Doug O'Neill

[pweizer]

The NY Times has now weighed in:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/11/sp...nted=1&_r=1&hp

The key quote:

Nationally, thoroughbred horses break down or show signs of injury at a rate of 5.1 per thousand starts, according to The Times’s analysis of more than 150,000 races over the past three years. In more than 2,300 starts, horses trained by O’Neill show a breakdown or injury frequency more than double that rate, at 12.0 per thousand starts.


“It’s a horrible statistic to be associated with,” O’Neill said.


In comparison, horses in the care of Motion — one of the trainers without a single drug violation and who will race Went the Day Well in the Preakness Stakes next Saturday — have started nearly 1,900 races and broken down or showed signs of injury in just 0.5 per thousand starts.

Paul

[Danzig]

oh, i missed this little gem in the yahoo article first time skimming it:


" the he-said, they-said dispute won't be resolved either way until after the Belmont closes out the Triple Crown season on the second Saturday in June"


he said they said??? seriously?! one of the reasons why they do need to take a long look at illegal drugs and how they're handled in this sport. the horses had a positive test-that's far more than he said they said.

absolutely ridiculous.


and thanks for the above post pweizer. eye-opening for sure. truly, that article exposes what is REALLY wrong with the sport. not race day medication, but race day cheaters. many trainers never get a positive, he's had several. and now he's in the limelight, and it's all coming out. just like with assman and dutrow. plenty of clean trainers to be had, but some owners want that win no matter how they get it, and hire people who will get it for them. this is the type of press we don't need. people joke about matz, where's his negatives? or graham motion with animal kingdom?

[slotdirt]

Focus is on trainers for obvious reasons, but owners keep giving guys with a multitude of positives lots of pretty horses to train. There has to be some culpability with the Reddams of the world as well.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

Focus is on trainers for obvious reasons, but owners keep giving guys with a multitude of positives lots of pretty horses to train. There has to be some culpability with the Reddams of the world as well.

best thing to do is ban the cheating trainers. then stupid owners can't hire cheating trainers, they'd have to hire clean ones. and they do exist.

[tector]

Originally Posted by pweizer

The NY Times has now weighed in:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/11/sp...nted=1&_r=1&hp

The key quote:

Nationally, thoroughbred horses break down or show signs of injury at a rate of 5.1 per thousand starts, according to The Times’s analysis of more than 150,000 races over the past three years. In more than 2,300 starts, horses trained by O’Neill show a breakdown or injury frequency more than double that rate, at 12.0 per thousand starts.


“It’s a horrible statistic to be associated with,” O’Neill said.


In comparison, horses in the care of Motion — one of the trainers without a single drug violation and who will race Went the Day Well in the Preakness Stakes next Saturday — have started nearly 1,900 races and broken down or showed signs of injury in just 0.5 per thousand starts.

Paul

If these numbers are true, they are pretty damning.

I would also note that the Times article actually missed a significant angle--while they talked about milkshaking, they did not raise the drug-masking effect.

[Danzig]

'Over 14 years and in four different states, O’Neill received more than a dozen violations for giving his horses improper drugs. O’Neill’s horses also have had a tendency to break down. According to an analysis by The New York Times, the horses he trains break down or show signs of injury at more than twice the rate of the national average.

But none of it — the drug charges or the rate of damaged horses under his care — has much impeded O’Neill’s rise in the ranks of racing, and so there he was last Saturday, saddling I’ll Have Another, the surprising 3-year-old who won the 138th Kentucky Derby.'


but yeah, let's all just focus on lasix. then everything else will be juuuuust peachy.


this is what's wrong in racing. not something that prevents hemorraging. this-trainers who are repeat offenders that not only continue to work, but actually grow their business to the point that they can win the most famous race in the world. and then the media can go on and on about how they're a cheat. and what does the racing world do? go after lasix. not cheaters, not repeat offenders, not try to fix a flawed appeals process, nor fix the licensing standards. they go after something that actuallly protects a horses lungs, doesn't mask drugs, and isn't proven to enhance performance. we hear ad nauseum that we shouldn't have horses racing on drugs, and look what trainer is in the spotlight right now! absolutely ridiculous and disheartening.
and what is his response? oh, it's just negative press...just trying to go after us because we won. bull!

[tector]

This is one of the comments to the NYT article:

Geri Minott
Cardiff by the Sea, CA

NYT Pick

I had several horses in training with Doug O'Neill, and their careers didn't end happily. One was given the most brutal disregard I have ever seen given to a horse. I offered my partners 45K to sell me the horse and prevent his last race. I had felt his ankles and I knew that he had an ailing suspensory ligament. My veterinary surgeon will support this statement.

The horse was dropped from allowance into a claimer and not even given support wraps for the race in which he ended up listed as "vanned off." I spent 60K putting that horse back together, as best I could. I had another one fracture a knee in workout after I had asked that the horse be sent home for some rest time. Neither of those would even be included in the appalling statistic of Doug's breakdowns. The money I spent on rescue COULD have gone into the racing industry.

I have lots of disturbing photos if one wants a closer look. If Doug had even had the decency to put support wraps on the horse with a chronic suspensory condition, things might have been much better. I feel that the brutality is at least similar to that exhibited by the New Orleans Saints and the penalty should be the same. Doug's assistant trainer is a true horseman. Let him take over and show a kinder hand. Most importantly, end the use of pain killers on race days now.

May 11, 2012 at 11:27 a.m.

[slotdirt]

Yikes.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by tector

This is one of the comments to the NYT article:

why would a horse still be racing with a chronic suspensory problem?

[slotdirt]

I'm going to go ahead and say that, rightly or wrongly, there are plenty of horses out there running with a chronic suspensory issue.

[Indian Charlie]

I've done some more reading on this stuff I previously stated (in my post above) was a safe and effective diuretic, and I think I'm going to have to retract my earlier statement.

I cannot believe they give this stuff to horses after all!

http://www.dhmo.org/truth/Dihydrogen-Monoxide.html

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by slotdirt

I'm going to go ahead and say that, rightly or wrongly, there are plenty of horses out there running with a chronic suspensory issue.

you could very well be correct. especially at the low level tracks. But when you hear the word "chronic" and it has to do with a ligament or tendon, it is best for the horse too be off munching grass somewhere.