Jon White on the Best Horses of the last 50 years...

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i'm not quite sure how saying she isn't comparable to ruffian is degrading. considering what ruffian did, how she ran, and her records and wins....i don't think i'm wrong in this case. i like zenyatta, as i do any racehorse, i appreciate what she's done. however, i would not go so far as to rank her above one of the best race fillies ever, nor do i think zenyatta belongs in the top 20 in the last fifty years. considering the elite company on that list, she does NOT belong. she's no weight carrier like kelso, she hasn't smashed a mile record under a huge impost like dr fager, she hasn't shipped all over and beaten all comers on mulitiple surfaces like round table, who ran for years, including in the spring classics vs the likes of iron liege and bold ruler. how is saying she does not compare to some of the truest greats ever to grace this sport degrading to her?! it is degrading to those great horses to have her on the same list! find one time that i 'degraded' her, her races, her performances. just one. now, if you find my lack of real respect for her in regards to the likes of damascus, sword dancer, and count fleet, war admiral, etc degrading...well, then i guess i'm guilty. gimme a break.

Don't bother. Where does she rank if she lost by a head last out? Where does she rank if she loses to the usual drivel in the Hirsh or whatever soft spot the run in next? Here is a good way to measure the horses above, if any of them lost their last race would they plummet in the theoretical rankings like Zenyatta would?

[letswastemoney]

How are you supposed to compare Zenyatta to dirt horses who have much more than 2 wins on dirt??!?!?!?! It makes nooooooooooooooo sense to me.

This is about as useful as comparing Bayakoa's career vs. Flawlessly! Ouija Board vs. Ghostzapper.

To make lists like Jon White made, you have to assume the dynamics of synthetic racing is similar to most dirt tracks, especially the type of dirt tracks the top horses on those lists ran on. Otherwise, it's a difficult comparison given the differences in what it takes to win on each surface.

[PatCummings]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Don't bother. Where does she rank if she lost by a head last out? Where does she rank if she loses to the usual drivel in the Hirsh or whatever soft spot the run in next? Here is a good way to measure the horses above, if any of them lost their last race would they plummet in the theoretical rankings like Zenyatta would?

Agree, completely.

Two words...

Anabaa's Creation.

That is all.

[Dunbar]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Don't bother. Where does she rank if she lost by a head last out? Where does she rank if she loses to the usual drivel in the Hirsh or whatever soft spot the run in next? Here is a good way to measure the horses above, if any of them lost their last race would they plummet in the theoretical rankings like Zenyatta would?

(emphasis added)

A very good observation, CS.

--Dunbar

[Indian Charlie]

No, because Zenyatta has done the undoable, win at the age of 6, so if she loses now, it's because she's raced till she is long in the tooth.