When "Neighborhood Watch" Gets Out of Hand

[bigrun]

This was posted at another forum...Is this in evidence of his head injuries?..or a photoshopped bit..jus askin..


[/quote]

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by bigrun

This was posted at another forum...Is this in evidence of his head injuries?..or a photoshopped bit..jus askin..

[/quote]

That picture must be forged because Danzig told me that there was no struggle. She had strong evidence too. Her evidence was that the funeral director (who works for the Martins) said that Trayvon had no bruises. LOL.

I'm sorry Danzig. I couldn't resist.

[Riot]

ABC must have a massive contact leaking information to them from inside the prosecutors office - they've had all the "good stuff" in this case. I wonder if the prosecutor will freak out about this new leak, especially after the case has been sealed by the judge?

That looks like real blood to me. But you see how the pattern is running down to the left and right of the back-top of the head? [although there appears to be two contusions in a linear fashion (like the edge of a curb?) ] - there is no blood smear.

If his head was "being beaten" against the concrete, how come none of the blood is smeared?

So, say it's real, his head was beaten against the concrete to get the two contusions - he must have immediately gotten up and regained the upper hand, because the blood is running down both sides, consistent with how he's sitting now: with his head up, facing downward a little.

If his head was beaten against the concrete to get that, then he immediately got up before he started bleeding from the wounds, because none of the blood is smeared (is there blood on the concrete at the scene?)

And if he was standing after the injury, the blood would have run straight down his collar. It appears the head was bent over, as the blood ran down the left and right sides from the wounds.

I wonder if he shot Trayvon while laying on his back with Trayvon on top, then pushed dead Trayvon off and immediately stood up. Could be.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

I wonder if he shot Trayvon while laying on his back with Trayvon on top, then pushed dead Trayvon off and immediately stood up. Could be.

Yes. I believe that is what the claim has been all along.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Yes. I believe that is what the claim has been all along.

But it sure doesn't support it's existence through a 43-second long struggle, as heard on the tape. It must have happened at the very end. And if his head felt painful from being bashed against the cement enough to scare him for his life, how come after the fight there is zero sign of smear from Zimmerman putting his hand up to feel the back of his head, where the pain and warm blood are?

Big, I also saw the funeral director speak that there was no bruising, cuts or signs of a fight on hands or face he had to cover.

I'm just happy an arrest was finally made. I hope it doesn't come out the police department was incompetent and screwed up any evidence, etc. as is the fear. I'm content to the let the legal process work and come to a conclusion.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

But it sure doesn't support it's existence through a 43-second long struggle, as heard on the tape. And if his head felt hurt, how come there is zero sign of smear from Zimmerman putting his hand up to feel the pain and warm blood on the back of his head?

Big, I also saw the funeral director speak that there was no bruising, cuts or signs of a fight on hands or face he had to cover.

I'm just happy an arrest was finally made. I hope it doesn't come out the police department was incompetent and screwed up any evidence, etc. as is the fear. I'm content to the let the legal process work and come to a conclusion.

The funeral director (who works for the Martin family) is hardly a credible witness. The coroner is a credible witness. I would trust the coroner's opinion. But even if the funeral director was a credible witness, his testimony is still meaningless. Why would Martin have bruises? Zimmerman's claim is that he was sucker-punched from behind and then Martin jumped on top of him and started beating him. If that is what happened, then I wouldn't expect Martin to have any bruises. The guy with the bruises would be Zimmerman. If anything, the funeral director's testimony helps to confirm Zimmerman's story.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Today after viewing that photograph, Dershowitz blasted the prosecutors even more than he did before, calling them "not only immoral, but stupid". He accused them of committing a "grave ethical violation".

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...cution-immoral

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

The funeral director (who works for the Martin family) is hardly a credible witness. The coroner is a credible witness. I would trust the coroner's opinion. But even if the funeral director was a credible witness, his testimony is still meaningless. Why would Martin have bruises? Zimmerman's claim is that he was sucker-punched from behind and then Martin jumped on top of him and started beating him. If that is what happened, then I wouldn't expect Martin to have any bruises. The guy with the bruises would be Zimmerman. If anything, the funeral director's testimony helps to confirm Zimmerman's story.

There was 40-plus seconds of struggle as record on police tapes. Yes, I'd expect some physical evidence of that, on both men. And yes, we'll wait for the coroner's report.

This picture was taken by a citizen who arrived on the scene after the fight. It was not taken by the police.

[bigrun]

That picture must be forged because Danzig told me that there was no struggle. She had strong evidence too. Her evidence was that the funeral director (who works for the Martins) said that Trayvon had no bruises. LOL.

I'm sorry Danzig. I couldn't resist.[/quote]


Is there a doctor in the house....more i look at that blood pattern the more it looks painted on...I watch a lot of CSI and never saw splatter like that...but i'd like one of our resident physicians to corroborate...danz, riot, anybody...

[Rupert Pupkin]

I think the Zimmermans made an excellent choice in picking Mark O"Mara to be George Zimmerman's defense attorney. Some defense attorneys are confrontational, argumentative, flamboyant, and "in your face". O'Mara is not like that at all. He is quiet, low-key, and very professional. In a case like this, I think that is a very good thing.

Emotions are really high on both sides. If you had one of these loud and confrontational defense attorneys, I think that would just inflame people. O'Mara could have easily gone out there and publicly attacked the special prosecutor. But he didn't do that. He knows the facts are on his side and he knows that the truth will come out.

He handled the hearing today very well. He didn't attack the prosecution investigator at the hearing today. He just asked him a simple question. He asked him whether he had any evidence of who started the fight. The prosecution investigator responded, "No".

That was all he needed to ask. The prosecution admitted that they had no evidence of who started the fight. That means they have no evidence that contradicts Zimmerman's claim that Martin attacked him first.

The judge will practically be forced to throw out the 2nd degree murder charge. There is a chance he may even throw out the manslaughter charge. If the prosecution has no evidence that contradicts Zimmerman's contention that Martin attacked him first, then they have no case. Zimmerman had obvious and visible injuries. If you get attacked and sustain those kinds of injuries, you have a right to defend yourself. The law is very clear on that, especially in Florida.


http://southflorida.sun-sentinel.com...,4802623.story

[Rupert Pupkin]

I actually hadn't read part #2 of this story. One of the prosecutors claims that Zimmerman gave 5 different statements and some of them were "inconsistent and contrary to physical evidence". I'm somewhat skeptical of this and most legal experts are too. You have to remember that even if you tell the same story 5 times, you're not going to tell the exact same story every time. You're probably going to remember new things each time. If there are major contradictions, then you are in trouble. But if you remember a few new details here and there, that is normal.

Maybe the prosecution has some damning evidence that they are holding back. Anything is possible but I wouldn't hold my breath.

There was another important disclosure made today. The judge asked the prosecution investigator how close the gun was to the victim when it was fired. So close, said the investigator, that there were burns on Trayvon's sweatshirt and skin.

That is obviously an extremely significant piece of evidence.


http://southflorida.sun-sentinel.com...3.story?page=2

[Antitrust32]

Rupert you seem to leave out in every post that the punk wanna be cop Zimmerman was following Martin in a car and by foot, and kept following him even when told not to.

if anyone would have had reason to protect their own self, it would be Martin.

and nobody can dispute Zimmermans claim of self defense?? well maybe that is because the 2nd party in this situation is DEAD at the hands of Zimmerman. Cant really tell your side when you are buried under the earth, can you?

but no.. poor Zimmerman, has to go through all this trouble. He should have thought about that before he tried to act like a cop and follow a kid with a loaded gun.

Zimmerman is a prick. If he doesnt go to jail for even a few years, it will be a grave injustice.


It disgusts me that people stick up for Zimmerman.

[Antitrust32]

maybe its just me.. but Zimmerman looks much more bald in the blood photo than any other picture i've seen of him.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Rupert you seem to leave out in every post that the punk wanna be cop Zimmerman was following Martin in a car and by foot, and kept following him even when told not to.

if anyone would have had reason to protect their own self, it would be Martin.

and nobody can dispute Zimmermans claim of self defense?? well maybe that is because the 2nd party in this situation is DEAD at the hands of Zimmerman. Cant really tell your side when you are buried under the earth, can you?

but no.. poor Zimmerman, has to go through all this trouble. He should have thought about that before he tried to act like a cop and follow a kid with a loaded gun.

Zimmerman is a prick. If he doesnt go to jail for even a few years, it will be a grave injustice.


It disgusts me that people stick up for Zimmerman.

I'm well aware that Zimmerman followed Martin in his car and on foot. I discussed that in several of my previous posts.

On the one hand, you could argue that Martin had the right to defend himself from some stranger who was following him. On the other hand, why didn't Martin call the police? You seem to be against vigilantiism. If you see a person following you, should you call the police or should you physically attack the person instead?

No matter what, if Zimmerman was walking back to his car and was attacked from behind, then Martin had no justification for the assault.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Rupert you seem to leave out in every post that the punk wanna be cop Zimmerman was following Martin in a car and by foot, and kept following him even when told not to.

if anyone would have had reason to protect their own self, it would be Martin.

and nobody can dispute Zimmermans claim of self defense?? well maybe that is because the 2nd party in this situation is DEAD at the hands of Zimmerman. Cant really tell your side when you are buried under the earth, can you?

but no.. poor Zimmerman, has to go through all this trouble. He should have thought about that before he tried to act like a cop and follow a kid with a loaded gun.

Zimmerman is a prick. If he doesnt go to jail for even a few years, it will be a grave injustice.


It disgusts me that people stick up for Zimmerman.

I will repost one of my previous posts about this subject:

Based on everything I have heard so far, Zimmerman had done a good job helping to watch the neighborhood and keep the neighborhood safe for several years. This was an unfortunate incident. Hindsight is 20/20. Don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. Neighborhood watch programs (formal and informal) work. They reduce crime.

I highly doubt Zimmerman intended to get into any type of physical altercation. I think there is a good chance that he never intended to get within 50 yards of Martin. But he lost him on foot and at some point I think he turned a corner and found himself in close proximity to Martin. It was probably a fluke thing. We don't know for sure what happened after that. Zimmerman claims they had words but then the words ended and he was walking back to his car when he was attacked from behind.

Hindsight is 20/20 but as I said before, I highly doubt Zimmerman had any plans of getting into close proximity with Martin. If he was just some type of vigilante, why did he even bother calling the police? If he thought he was just some tough guy, he would have probably just pulled up to Martin in his car and rolled down his window and asked, "Who are you and what are you doing in this neighborhood?" But he didn't do this. He called the police. I think the whole thing was an unfortunate incident. I wouldn't recommend following someone on foot because if you lose them there is always the chance that you could end up face to face with them after turning a corner. I don't think Zimmerman ever dreamed that he would be jumped from behind (if that is in fact what happened).

I'm sure Zimmerman had followed people hundreds of times over the years (while doing his informal neigborhood watches) without incident. This incident was an aberration.

[Danzig]

That picture must be forged because Danzig told me that there was no struggle. She had strong evidence too. Her evidence was that the funeral director (who works for the Martins) said that Trayvon had no bruises. LOL.

I'm sorry Danzig. I couldn't resist.[/quote]

gfy.

sorry, couldn't resist.

and what i said was according to what had been put out up to that point, there was no evidence of a struggle. if the photo is real, i guess it shows otherwise...
and i didn't say there were no bruises, the funeral director did-take your beef up with him.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Danzig

Tgfy.

sorry, couldn't resist.

and what i said was according to what had been put out up to that point, there was no evidence of a struggle. if the photo is real, i guess it shows otherwise...
and i didn't say there were no bruises, the funeral director did-take your beef up with him.

Of course there was evidence of a struggle at the time you made the post. You just chose to ignore that evidence. At the time you made the post, it had been reported that Zimmerman had a broken nose. It had been reported that several witnesses at the scene including police officers said that Zimmerman's nose was bleeding and the back of his head was bleeding.

That was the evidence that we knew at the time that suggested a struggle. That was why I was so shocked when you claimed you didn't think there was any evidence of a struggle. That was when I told you that I had never heard anyone from either side claim that there was no struggle. That was when you answered that the funeral director said that Martin had no bruises on him and that was what you based your opinion on.

You can go back and re-read the posts if you don't believe me.

[bigrun]

Zimmerman apologizes to Trayvon Martin’s parents at bail hearing

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crim...#ixzz1sdpgC0jH

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Of course there was evidence of a struggle at the time you made the post. You just chose to ignore that evidence. At the time you made the post, it had been reported that Zimmerman had a broken nose. It had been reported that several witnesses at the scene including police officers said that Zimmerman's nose was bleeding and the back of his head was bleeding.

That was the evidence that we knew at the time that suggested a struggle. That was why I was so shocked when you claimed you didn't think there was any evidence of a struggle. That was when I told you that I had never heard anyone from either side claim that there was no struggle. That was when you answered that the funeral director said that Martin had no bruises on him and that was what you based your opinion on.

You can go back and re-read the posts if you don't believe me.

well, i'm glad you're around to tell me what i knew. there's a variety of reports coming out daily. from what i had read up to that point, i'd seen nothing to suggest there'd been evidence of a struggle, which is why i put what i did. i'd also read that security camera footage at the jail showed no marks on the guys head as he'd claimed. but, i've also said more than once that it's a muddled mess, and that i doubt the guy gets found guilty at trial. but hey, whatever blows your skirt up.