Founding fathers liked taxed government health care

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Now you got it! .

So you think the health care mandate is constitutional, hospitals should be private, and there should be government single payer?

BTW, Cook County is a public hospital. So are VA hospitals. You think they should be shut down?

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

So you think the health care mandate is constitutional, hospitals should be private, and there should be government single payer?

No a health care mandate with government hospitals and care is constitutional.

Mixing MANDATE and PRIVATE is where the problem lays. Not constitutional. Since I'm a very anti government-run anything much less healthcare this plan is something I'd throw in the garbage and say I'm happy with what I have.

[Riot]

No a health care mandate with government hospitals and care is constitutional.

That's completely, 100% nationalized healthcare. Government-employed doctors, government run hospitals.

Mixing MANDATE and PRIVATE is where the problem lays. Not constitutional.

The Supremes have already said other mixes of public and private, Social Security and Medicare, are constitutional. And the founders thought it constitutional, too (the articles I posted)

Since I'm a very anti government-run anything much less healthcare this plan is something I'd throw in the garbage and say I'm happy with what I have.

The plan doesn't make you change what you have. Your costs will go down, however. So be really angry about that. The plan gets the uninsured insured. The plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

The plan doesn't make you change what you have. Your costs will go down, however. So be really angry about that. The plan gets the uninsured insured. The plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors.

So how come MY insurance company made us change what we already had, and my costs went up by $600 ?? all because of Obamacare also.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

So how come MY insurance company made us change what we already had, and my costs went up by $600 ?? all because of Obamacare also.

Wow there's a suprise. Your insurance had to change and went up because of Obamacare.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Wow there's a suprise. Your insurance had to change and went up because of Obamacare.

There's 8,000 people working for the company i work for.. I will bet you 95% of them will not vote for Obama based on this ridiculous, costly health bill that makes my somewhat decent insurance turn into crap with an outrageously high deductable.

But Riot knows everything, and surely Obamacare had nothing to do with my insurance company changing all its coverage (and citing Obamacare as the reason).

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

There's 8,000 people working for the company i work for.. I will bet you 95% of them will not vote for Obama based on this ridiculous, costly health bill that makes my somewhat decent insurance turn into crap with an outrageously high deductable.

But Riot knows everything, and surely Obamacare had nothing to do with my insurance company changing all its coverage (and citing Obamacare as the reason).

I wasn't misled by Obama's lies in 2008 and wont be misled by this disgrace of a President in 2012. If you dont agree with Riot your deemed to be a hateful person.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Wow there's a suprise. Your insurance had to change and went up because of Obamacare.

Insurance costs have been increasing double digits for several years - it's just more of the same gouging by the insurance companies, and blaming it on something else. The provisions in the healthcare act that would help this won't kick in for another 2 years.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

Insurance costs have been increasing double digits for several years - it's just more of the same gouging by the insurance companies, and blaming it on something else. The provisions in the healthcare act that would help this won't kick in for another 2 years.

That is only like 1/8th true.

sure the premiums rise a little every year.

but you are leaving out the fact that they ELIMINATED 66% of the plans we could choose from, leaving us with only a very high deductible plan.. and obamacare gave them the reason and permission to do this.

[hi_im_god]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

So how come MY insurance company made us change what we already had, and my costs went up by $600 ?? all because of Obamacare also.

i try to stay away from this discussion because there's so much misinformation passed off as fact. but given that very little in the bill goes into effect before 2014, your company might not be entirely truthful if they're actually telling you the healthcare bill is responsible for all reductions in coverage and increases in employee costs in 2011.

i'm not taking any position on the bill itself. you can like or dislike it. but if someone is telling you that changes taking effect 3 years from now affects the cost of your coverage today you should be skeptical.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

i try to stay away from this discussion because there's so much misinformation passed off as fact. but given that very little in the bill goes into effect before 2014, your company might not be entirely truthful if they're actually telling you the healthcare bill is responsible for all reductions in coverage and increases in employee costs in 2011.

i'm not taking any position on the bill itself. you can like or dislike it. but if someone is telling you that changes taking effect 3 years from now affects the cost of your coverage today you should be skeptical.

According to RIOT "the plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors."

The lowered prescription drug costs for seniors has to be diverted somewhere.

[Cannon Shell]

The idea that healthcare will be cheaper because of this bill is preposterous and based on deceptive use of numbers.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

According to RIOT "the plan has already gotten many students and young people insured, and lowered prescription drug costs for seniors."

The lowered prescription drug costs for seniors has to be diverted somewhere.

Didn't you forget that Riot knows everything.

[timmgirvan]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

i try to stay away from this discussion because there's so much misinformation passed off as fact. but given that very little in the bill goes into effect before 2014, your company might not be entirely truthful if they're actually telling you the healthcare bill is responsible for all reductions in coverage and increases in employee costs in 2011.

i'm not taking any position on the bill itself. you can like or dislike it. but if someone is telling you that changes taking effect 3 years from now affects the cost of your coverage today you should be skeptical.

It is being said on internet that California Blue Cross/Blue Shield is attempting raise rates 59%. Whatever is going to happen, the consumer will take it in the shorts!

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

It is being said on internet

Must be true. If it is being said on (the) internet, it has to be true.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by timmgirvan

It is being said on internet that California Blue Cross/Blue Shield is attempting raise rates 59%. Whatever is going to happen, the consumer will take it in the shorts!

Yes, and CA BC & BS famously tried that last year, too, and were prevented from doing it by the Obama administration. And they raised alot the year before. That's not associated with the PPACA. That's insurance companies taking record profits while they kick off customers who cost them money.

That is one of the reasons why the PPACA was passed, however - to help control insurance costs.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by hi_im_god

i try to stay away from this discussion because there's so much misinformation passed off as fact. but given that very little in the bill goes into effect before 2014, your company might not be entirely truthful if they're actually telling you the healthcare bill is responsible for all reductions in coverage and increases in employee costs in 2011.

i'm not taking any position on the bill itself. you can like or dislike it. but if someone is telling you that changes taking effect 3 years from now affects the cost of your coverage today you should be skeptical.

I have no choice... its the only thing offered through work and it is way cheaper than purchasing it privately still.

of course the insurance company is shady, but Obamacare gave them a reason to become shadier. they site the cadallac tax, which doesnt even come into effect until like 2018 or something.. and my plan is more like a 1995 dodge intrepid instead of a damn caddy!

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I have no choice... its the only thing offered through work and it is way cheaper than purchasing it privately still.

of course the insurance company is shady, but Obamacare gave them a reason to become shadier. they site the cadallac tax, which doesnt even come into effect until like 2018 or something.. and my plan is more like a 1995 dodge intrepid instead of a damn caddy!

And the above is why I wish there was a public option, that would put pressure on everyone to keep costs low and competitive.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Riot

They will just make more doctors. It's easy to make more doctors. .

Originally Posted by Riot

You said "it's not that easy" to make more doctors. I agreed and offer my thoughts on how to help do it.
.

okay i think i figured out the multi quote post thing now.

I think my turning embryo's into doctors plan might work. maybe trackrat can bring up that idea? it is easy.

[Crown@club]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

So how come MY insurance company made us change what we already had, and my costs went up by $600 ?? all because of Obamacare also.

Company insurance plan comes up for renewal in April. Cost went up over $2000 for 3 employees that are covered under the plan. One employee has 3 children on it with 1 child with a pre-existing condition.

We're going to be shopping for something else, but Anthem and one other company won't quote any prices until after sign up.