would quality road have beat zen in the b.c.

[Thunder Gulch]

I don't think QR was ready to run his best race that day, and I don't know if he would have handled the surface. Any dirt track in America, yes.

[The Bid]

Then I need a moderate one to make me 3.5 million. Anytime you beat a horse by 8 in hand thats won 6 G1 you are at the top of your business. Quality Road hasn't beaten anything at all. He ran off the screen against a bunch of zeros. He lost to Summer Bird twice, do you think Zenyatta would beat him? I think she would drill his ass, in fact she did. He finished behind superstars like Hold me Back, Theregoesjojo.

Zenyatta has finished behind none, and until she finishes behind one, shes where its at. Regardless of her figures, her surface, whatever argument anybody has...The fact is shes never been beaten. The only thing going thats goign to beat her right now is Mike Smith. He has tried his best on multiple occasions.

I guess we can make an argument that Summer Bird lost to Rachel by 6. Summerbird beat QR by 1 and 3.5. Zenyatta beat Summerbird 5 and he was up and down like a 15 dollar BJ. That would put R and Z in the same catagory, although I would argue Zenyatta is better than Rachel, or was last year. QR is not even in the same zipcode. I think thats accurate of the 3 horses we have mentioned. We have two filly/mares for the ages, and one pretty good older horse running against zeros.

Sure QR has a right to get better, and he would need to run that huge race back against either of the aforementioned to be in the ballgame

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Then I need a moderate one to make me 3.5 million. Anytime you beat a horse by 8 in hand thats won 6 G1 you are at the top of your business. Quality Road hasn't beaten anything at all. He ran off the screen against a bunch of zeros. He lost to Summer Bird twice, do you think Zenyatta would beat him? I think she would drill his ass. He finished behind superstars like Hold me Back, Theregoesjojo.

Zenyatta has finished behind none, and until she finishes behind one, shes where its at. Regardless of her figures, her surface, whatever argument anybody has...The fact is shes never been beaten. The only thing going thats goign to beat her right now is Mike Smith. He has tried his best on multiple occasions.

I guess we can make an argument that Summer Bird lost to Rachel by 6. Summerbird beat QR by 1 and 3.5. Zenyatta beat Summerbird 5 and he was up and down like a 15 dollar BJ. That would put R and Z in the same catagory, although I would argue Zenyatta is better than Rachel, or was last year. QR is not even in the same zipcode. I think thats accurate of the 3 horses we have mentioned. We have two filly/mares for the ages, and one pretty good older horse running against zeros.

You're saying so much that runs dead contrary to sound handicapping it isn't even funny.

If Rachel Alexandra returns from the long layoff in similar fashion to how you've returned from your posting layoff ... she will not only get crushed in the Apple Blossom .. but the bridgejumpers will lose a fortune in that manufactured prep race she is supposed to have at FG in March.

[The Bid]

I needed one

Im real sound handicapping. Those performance lines don't lie drugs. Thats just what hes beat, and what shes beat. Shes beaten everything, hes gotten beat by Summerbird twice, convincingly twice. How can she not get the nod over that one at the very least. He ran off the screen against zeros. What part of that is untrue?

[VOL JACK]

The first time summer Bird beat QR...QR had one 6.5f prep.
The second time was a very fair contest except for they were meeting on a sloppy track once again.
I dont think a horse could be better bred or have a better style for the slop than summer bird...which makes RA Haskell all the more impressive.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Zenyatta has finished behind none, and until she finishes behind one, shes where its at. Regardless of her figures, her surface, whatever argument anybody has...The fact is shes never been beaten. The only thing going thats goign to beat her right now is Mike Smith.

So, with that sound line of reasoning...

Peppers Pride would have beaten both Zenyatta and RA?

[The Bid]

If she won against open company on a major, against the best horses in the world, on multiple occasions....YES. Since she just ran against NM breds, you tell me

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Bid

If she won against open company on a major, against the best horses in the world, on multiple occasions....YES. Since she just ran against NM breds, you tell me

Oh.

So now that that particular argument is useful for your position, it's ok.

Got it.

[The Bid]

Yes, running lines are very important. More important than anything else in handicapping, IMO. Class lines are more true than any speed figure

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Yes, running lines are very important. More important than anything else in handicapping, IMO. Class lines are more true than any speed figure

Are you insane?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by The Bid

Zenyatta has finished behind none, and until she finishes behind one, shes where its at. Regardless of her figures, her surface, whatever argument anybody has...

They had the same type of arguments before the B.C. win. They said she simply didn't have the figures. I'll admit, I did not know if she could beat those, but she did. This has now become simple hatred for the horse. She's got the class, and she's handled dirt. I don't think they will beat her going 10f on dirt. That's plays into her strength(10f.) Going 81/2f-9f on a super fast dirt track? Maybe. She's handled Oaklawn, and I do think there's something about Churchill that suits the trainer's methods. Their arguments against her are best suited for the 2 fake speed tracks (G Stream, and Mmth.) They will keep on changing their demands. If she wins at OAK or Churchill, they'll say the track was too slow etc. They don't like her. No ass kicking' is going to change that. Look, this QR loved GS last year. He wasn't as good at the other tracks. On a course that's at all tiring, he starts twirling his left front. Even in the winning sprint effort at TOGA, he's twirling late as Candy Ass Honey Bee is sucking' up 2nd. He would need to be running on Sheetrock to beat her at 10f. Twirling is like an unbalanced washing Machine. The faster the surface, the less that machine is gunna start vibrating.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

They had the same type of arguments before the B.C. win. They said she simply didn't have the figures. I'll admit, I did not know if she could beat those, but she did. This has now become simple hatred for the horse.

I believe I called Zenyatta a very dangerous horse in the Breeders Cup Classic if Life Is Sweet were to run well in the Distaff the day before.

I also know Zenyatta was the decisive horse that springboarded me to a tournament win worth four figures. She owes me nothing at all to say the least.

This has become hatred for sound competent handicapping. Nothing more and nothing less. Anyone who thinks she would beat Quality Road on dirt is either a fool or is trolling like the guy who stole Bid's login.

[Indian Charlie]

SCUDS talking hatred.

That's fugging precious.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

SCUDS talking hatred.

That's fugging precious.

Can't you stay on topic?

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

This has become hatred for sound competent handicapping.

Oh, if you had some sound competent handicapping on this, then I wouldn't write a thing. QR twirls badly on a dirt track that isn't sheetrock. That, right there, is probably gunna get him beat going 10f against her. All signs point to this horse loving Gulfstream like a ho loved Dangerfields fat wallet in his later years. You see fit to ignore those two items. Oaklawn n'Churchill aren't G Stream. You're gunna keep going back to figures on a track he adores, and a figure earned when he tired going 10f at Belmont. That's the worst 110 Beyer the guy has ever given out. If you would say Rachel is gunna beat Z(especially if it's less than 10f,) then I wouldn't argue it. You're arguing that Z would lose to QR going 10F (while running on a non-Gulfstream surface.) There's no reason to think that's going to happen. Gulfstream is a fake speed trainers paradise. If it wasn't, then Pletcher wouldn't be looking at the ground after almost every K Derby.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

QR twirls badly on a dirt track that isn't sheetrock.

So the late November track he debuted on at Aqueduct was sheetrock? As was the track he set a track record over in the Amsterdam at Saratoga?

NT

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So the late November track he debuted on at Aqueduct was sheetrock? As was the track he set a track record over in the Amsterdam at Saratoga?

NT

Only the great ones don't twirl the lasso on every surface they run.

I'm speaking of horses like Citation, Big Red, Spectacular Bid, and Yankee Bravo.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

So the late November track he debuted on at Aqueduct was sheetrock? As was the track he set a track record over in the Amsterdam at Saratoga?

NT

I haven't watched the maiden race. He's twirling in the stretch of the sprint win at Toga. It's not as big an issue on a really fast track, or around one turn. Sidney's Candy looked good on a soft lead over a very fast track on Monday. Still, he was twirling. That will be an issue going 2 turns for him on a track that's not that fast. Sadler should try to find the fastest track possible for him, and then hope the track is favoring speed on Derby Day.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I believe I called Zenyatta a very dangerous horse in the Breeders Cup Classic if Life Is Sweet were to run well in the Distaff the day before.

I also know Zenyatta was the decisive horse that springboarded me to a tournament win worth four figures. She owes me nothing at all to say the least.

This has become hatred for sound competent handicapping. Nothing more and nothing less. Anyone who thinks she would beat Quality Road on dirt is either a fool or is trolling like the guy who stole Bid's login.

Listen (Narcissist Adjacent) I wasn't specifically referring to you. The "not fast enough argument" was the main argument her detractors used before the B.C. So, you've now moved over to the "not fast enough argument," and it's all based on Andy's Bias Figures. She has shown that she'll run the figure required. Stop messing with this bitch. She will own you.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Stop messing with this bitch. She will own you.

No need to have a meltdown.

I didn't mean to mess with you ... for that I'm sorry oh Queen Dark Meat Enthusiast