Ramon A. Dominguez

[FATPIANO]

Not a fan of Ramon , ever since he cost me 40,000 on Scrappy T in The Preakness, he blew the turn and cost me a 100 DD Pimlico Special/Preakness Double.

[gaut10]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

It's also because they are at different points in their career. Gomez is at the point where he can choose not to ride certain races. Dominguez isn't there yet, but he's pretty close.

I think Gomez is a very good rider and his performance during Breeders Cup weekend was great, since he was riding with basically one arm. But Dominguez had a better year.

exactly

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by FATPIANO

Not a fan of Ramon , ever since he cost me 40,000 on Scrappy T in The Preakness, he blew the turn and cost me a 100 DD Pimlico Special/Preakness Double.

OK, WTF are you talking about? If you think Scrappy T was the best horse in that Preakess you are out of your mind.

[eajinabi]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

It's also because they are at different points in their career. Gomez is at the point where he can choose not to ride certain races. Dominguez isn't there yet, but he's pretty close.

I think Gomez is a very good rider and his performance during Breeders Cup weekend was great, since he was riding with basically one arm. But Dominguez had a better year.

What defined his better year than gomez?

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by eajinabi

What defined his better year than gomez?

He dominated the toughest colony in the country for the entire year. He understands pace and race setups better than anyone on the game IMO. He rode more winners than Gomez and earned more money riding than Gomez did in 2010.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

He dominated the toughest colony in the country for the entire year. He understands pace and race setups better than anyone on the game IMO. He rode more winners than Gomez and earned more money riding than Gomez did in 2010.

Besides that.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Besides that.

Cooler whipping motion than Gomez?

[Princess Doreen]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Besides that.

He's good lookin'.

[johnny pinwheel]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Lets not even compare each riders big wins last year, don't embarass yourself. I'll give you Ramon rides many more winners, but also many more horses, like 700 a year more, yet barely beats him in earnings, you know why? One wins the big races, one not so much.

yeah, but one throws in alot of bad rides and the other....not so much.....

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Lets not even compare each riders big wins last year, don't embarass yourself. I'll give you Ramon rides many more winners, but also many more horses, like 700 a year more, yet barely beats him in earnings, you know why? One wins the big races, one not so much.

Let me ask you a question ( and I personally like Garrett as well as you ), do you think a jockey should be rewarded for riding pretty much only for certain outfits, mostly high profile, and in big races, while intentionally not riding for many cheaper outfits and in smaller pursed races over one that rides every day, in many races a day, often very cheap races ( in purse and quality ), for anybody and everybody, while forming no allegiances to any big outfits....and beats the former rider for specific riding titles?

Let me add something else....Ramon Dominguez rode NO HORSE in the Cigar Mile because he knew the connections of Haynesfield and a Dutrow longshot both wanted him, he had ridden both in their prior races, and he didn't want to be unfair to either participant. Do you think, and be honest, that Garrett would have done the same thing? No, this doesn't play into an Eclipse award discussion, save that perhaps Haynesfield would have won the Cigar ( surely Ramon would have chosen him ), and Ramon would have won another Grade 1 and more money.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

He dominated the toughest colony in the country for the entire year. He understands pace and race setups better than anyone on the game IMO. He rode more winners than Gomez and earned more money riding than Gomez did in 2010.

Sorry Hoss, he rode significantly more horses than Gomez ( 700) and barely beat him in earnings, less than 500,000, Gomez barely rode over 700 horses the whole year and earned 16 million. He didn't win the Saratoga title so he didn't dominate all year, and sorry, what half way decent rider wouldn't dominate Aqueduct? This is beginning to sound eerily familiar, next we're going to hear he did more for the game. I think the thing that sepeartes truly great riders from mere good riders are winning the big races, that is much more important tp me than winning riding titles, but again, that is just my opinion, I certainly respect yours, just saying.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Let me ask you a question ( and I personally like Garrett as well as you ), do you think a jockey should be rewarded for riding pretty much only for certain outfits, mostly high profile, and in big races, while intentionally not riding for many cheaper outfits and in smaller pursed races over one that rides every day, in many races a day, often very cheap races ( in purse and quality ), for anybody and everybody, while forming no allegiances to any big outfits....and beats the former rider for specific riding titles?

Let me add something else....Ramon Dominguez rode NO HORSE in the Cigar Mile because he knew the connections of Haynesfield and a Dutrow longshot both wanted him, he had ridden both in their prior races, and he didn't want to be unfair to either participant. Do you think, and be honest, that Garrett would have done the same thing? No, this doesn't play into an Eclipse award discussion, save that perhaps Haynesfield would have won the Cigar ( surely Ramon would have chosen him ), and Ramon would have won another Grade 1 and more money.

Andy, and if he had won the Cigar it would have only made 6 Grade 1. I know what you are saying to an extent, but any way you look at it Ramon is not riding crap, he rides for all the top trainers and all the best horses from the lesser trainers, he is always on a top mount, Gomez did not have one single major barn he rode for, Baffert pulled that crap with Lucky, Pletcher used Castellano as much if not more than Garrett and his main number one trainer died! ( Frankel) Garrett rode fewer horses for Clement and Dutrow than Ramon did, he rode a hodge podge for mutliple trainers, he rode absolute filth the majority of the time at Belmont and Saratoga, hell not one of his Breeders Cup races were favored, I just think that Garrett had a much better year, and not even close really.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by johnny pinwheel

yeah, but one throws in alot of bad rides and the other....not so much.....

I've seen a few.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Andy, and if he had won the Cigar it would have only made 6 Grade 1. I know what you are saying to an extent, but any way you look at it Ramon is not riding crap, he rides for all the top trainers and all the best horses from the lesser trainers, he is always on a top mount, Gomez did not have one single major barn he rode for, Baffert pulled that crap with Lucky, Pletcher used Castellano as much if not more than Garrett and his main number one trainer died! ( Frankel) Garrett rode fewer horses for Clement and Dutrow than Ramon did, he rode a hodge podge for mutliple trainers, he rode absolute filth the majority of the time at Belmont and Saratoga, hell not one of his Breeders Cup races were favored, I just think that Garrett had a much better year, and not even close really.

You didn't really answer my question.

Garrett didn't ride for the people you mentioned because they preferred others or didn't like that he spun them when he could be more choosy. What goes around comes around in this game.

He is a terrific rider....but he didn't deserve the Eclipse this year. It is NOT an award that only recognizes a rider's record in Big races. This is part of the equation. But far from the only thing to be recognized. Garrett was the best rider with far less mounts than most....but that's not the criteria for this award. Now, if you want to argue here that these awards were shown this year to have no criteria, that's fine, but then you better take back your argument with Dahoss.

[blackthroatedwind]

I'll give you an analogy that you might find reasonably fair...


If I came here and said Nick Zito deserved the Trainer of the Year over Todd because he came really close in many big races, won his share, and didn't have NEARLY the kind of stock, or the numbers, that Todd has, people would say I was crazily defending a friend.....and they would be right. They would not say I didn't necessarily make some fair points....but that my argument in its entirity was unsound and I was only making it because Nick is my close friend.

They would be right.

For the internet record....this was analogy....I don't believe what I was suggesting. Todd and Jerry Hollendorfer were the only two deserving candidates.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

You didn't really answer my question.

Garrett didn't ride for the people you mentioned because they preferred others or didn't like that he spun them when he could be more choosy. What goes around comes around in this game.

He is a terrific rider....but he didn't deserve the Eclipse this year. It is NOT an award that only recognizes a rider's record in Big races. This is part of the equation. But far from the only thing to be recognized. Garrett was the best rider with far less mounts than most....but that's not the criteria for this award. Now, if you want to argue here that these awards were shown this year to have no criteria, that's fine, but then you better take back your argument with Dahoss.

Well therein lays the problem, there apparently is no criteria, so we each move on with our own opinions on it.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Well therein lays the problem, there apparently is no criteria, so we each move on with our own opinions on it.

No, we make the best choice, and this year it was Ramon.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Sorry Hoss, he rode significantly more horses than Gomez ( 700) and barely beat him in earnings, less than 500,000, Gomez barely rode over 700 horses the whole year and earned 16 million. He didn't win the Saratoga title so he didn't dominate all year, and sorry, what half way decent rider wouldn't dominate Aqueduct? This is beginning to sound eerily familiar, next we're going to hear he did more for the game. I think the thing that sepeartes truly great riders from mere good riders are winning the big races, that is much more important tp me than winning riding titles, but again, that is just my opinion, I certainly respect yours, just saying.

Look, I know you LOVE Gomez and I have a lot of respect for him as a rider. But I was asked a question and provided facts for answers to the question.

Dominguez won more races and earned more money. IMO that is why he had a better year. I think you'd admit (if you were being honest) that you are extremely biased when it comes to Gomez, so this is sort of a pointless discussion.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

Look, I know you LOVE Gomez and I have a lot of respect for him as a rider. But I was asked a question and provided facts for answers to the question.

Dominguez won more races and earned more money. IMO that is why he had a better year. I think you'd admit (if you were being honest) that you are extremely biased when it comes to Gomez, so this is sort of a pointless discussion.

Truly friendship doesn't make me lose objectivity, I'm just saying I would have rather of had the year Gomez had as a rider last year than Ramon, simple as that.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Truly friendship doesn't make me lose objectivity, I'm just saying I would have rather of had the year Gomez had as a rider last year than Ramon, simple as that.

Riding less horses and making as much money? Understandable. However, does that mean he should be recognized as the Eclipse award winning rider?

You should REALLY think about that before answering.