Will Ghostzapper..

Cannon Shell · #1 11-24-2009, 04:26 PM

ever be as good a sire as his brother?

http://secure3.werkhorse.com/enicks/...NERS_11-23.pdf

randallscott35 · #2 11-24-2009, 04:29 PM

VOL JACK · #3 11-24-2009, 04:30 PM

Not unless Linda Rice gets a bunch and runs them in Turf sprints.

NTamm1215 · #4 11-24-2009, 04:31 PM

If he has to settle for being a significantly better racehorse it's not all bad.

That being said, his first crop has been a tad disappointing.

NT

Scav · #5 11-24-2009, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

If he has to settle for being a significantly better racehorse it's not all bad.

That being said, his first crop has been a tad disappointing.

NT

Maybe true, but based on what expectations? I sure as heck wasn't expecting him to toss a bunch of 6f sprinters. I think when they start getting to two turns you will see different numbers

CSC · #6 11-24-2009, 05:30 PM

I wonder how Ghostzapper would have done had he been trained by Linda Rice and not Robert Frankel...5 1/2 turf sprint champion? What could have been...

NTamm1215 · #7 11-24-2009, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scav

Maybe true, but based on what expectations? I sure as heck wasn't expecting him to toss a bunch of 6f sprinters. I think when they start getting to two turns you will see different numbers

I kind of expected him to throw more first crop winners than the likes of Offlee Wild and Ministers Wild Cat.

I hope his progeny get better with distance.

NT

Bigsmc · #8 11-24-2009, 06:52 PM

His babies are:

3 for 11 routing
4 for 12 on the grass

I'm not quite ready to give up on him.

philcski · #9 11-24-2009, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

If he has to settle for being a significantly better racehorse it's not all bad.

That being said, his first crop has been a tad disappointing.

NT

City Zip was a damn good racehorse too... probably Carson City's best. Of course... when your brother is the best of a generation, you're always the redheaded stepchild.

I'm not concerned about his babies yet though.

VOL JACK · #10 11-24-2009, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philcski

City Zip was a damn good racehorse too... probably Carson City's best. Of course... when your brother is the best of a generation, you're always the redheaded stepchild.

I'm not concerned about his babies yet though.

I think City Zip is the best deal at stud. (10k)

Indian Charlie · #11 11-24-2009, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

I think City Zip is the best deal at stud. (10k)

I'd probably take Fupeg at 15k in 2010 over CZ at 10k.

I'd take CZ at 10k in a second though over the again drastically reduced fee for Forestry, who will now stand for 17.5K

Indian Charlie for 70k, a 5k drop, is probably the best bargain out there still, of course.

Interesting that Empire Maker dropped to 50k.

philcski · #12 11-24-2009, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

I think City Zip is the best deal at stud. (10k)

table didn't come out too good but he ranks very high in all categories in his group (>$7,500 and less than $20k.)
I like him a lot as well.

Code:

name	                fee	first year at stud	runners	winners	stakes winners	earnings	earnings per runner	earnings per runner/fee
Birdstone**		     $10,000	2005	65	27	4	$5,370,431	$82,622.02	8.26
Candy Ride (ARG)**		$12,500	2005	107	57	9	$4,097,699	$38,296.25	3.06
Even the Score**		$15,000	2005	81	45	3	$2,476,723	$30,576.83	2.04
Northern Afleet**		        $7,500	1999	241	147	9	$7,328,402	$30,408.31	4.05
Belong to Me**		        $10,000	1994	137	71	9	$3,976,165	$29,023.10	2.90
Pure Prize**		        $12,500	2003	127	72	9	$3,587,426	$28,247.45	2.26
Freud**		                $7,500	2002	121	62	8	$3,321,246	$27,448.31	3.66
City Zip**		                $12,500	2002	171	100	6	$4,551,974	$26,619.73	2.13
Petionville**		        $10,000	1997	167	94	5	$4,372,806	$26,184.47	2.62
Jump Start**	         	$10,000	2003	165	98	8	$4,251,979	$25,769.57	2.58
Mizzen Mast**		        $17,500	2003	152	84	9	$3,807,649	$25,050.32	1.43
Montbrook**        		$10,000	1995	144	79	7	$3,547,456	$24,635.11	2.46
E Dubai**		                $15,000	2003	150	90	7	$3,654,636	$24,364.24	1.62
Milwaukee Brew**		$7,500	2004	146	80	5	$3,527,335	$24,159.83	3.22
Toccet**		                $7,500	2005	104	64	5	$2,472,066	$23,769.87	3.17
War Chant**		        $15,000	2001	131	62	10	$3,062,604	$23,378.66	1.56
Quiet American**		        $15,000	1992	135	61	5	$3,100,812	$22,968.98	1.53
Include**		                $17,500	2003	141	80	3	$3,181,565	$22,564.29	1.29
Mutakddim**		        $12,500	1997	222	138	12	$4,839,564	$21,799.84	1.74
Repent**		                $7,500	2004	142	67	4	$3,061,535	$21,560.11	2.87
Orientate**		        $12,500	2003	187	105	5	$3,998,002	$21,379.69	1.71
Valid Expectations**		$10,000	1998	115	78	7	$2,444,183	$21,253.77	2.13
Stephen Got Even**		$7,500	2001	197	105	6	$4,131,883	$20,974.03	2.80
Congaree**		        $10,000	2005	96	43	3	$2,006,277	$20,898.72	2.09
Touch Gold**		        $15,000	1999	203	107	5	$4,158,729	$20,486.35	1.37
Aptitude**		                $10,000	2002	138	68	3	$2,756,551	$19,975.01	2.00
Put It Back**       		$8,500	2002	142	79	9	$2,782,127	$19,592.44	2.30
Peace Rules**	        	$7,500	2005	118	73	2	$2,297,784	$19,472.75	2.60
Catienus**         		$10,000	2001	156	96	5	$3,027,194	$19,405.09	1.94
Smoke Glacken**	        	$17,500	1998	187	103	5	$3,584,908	$19,170.63	1.10
Chapel Royal**		        $10,000	2005	149	72	3	$2,773,050	$18,611.07	1.86
Point Given**	         	$15,000	2002	114	54	3	$1,996,953	$17,517.13	1.17
Salt Lake**	                 	$7,500	1993	133	84	3	$2,299,900	$17,292.48	2.31
Officer**	                	$17,500	2003	157	79	2	$2,705,462	$17,232.24	0.98
Van Nistelrooy**	         	$15,000	2003	151	67	5	$2,561,874	$16,966.05	1.13
Doneraile Court**   		$7,500	2000	158	82	4	$2,597,929	$16,442.59	2.19
Alphabet Soup**	        	$7,500	1998	183	91	2	$2,862,986	$15,644.73	2.09
Thunder Gulch**		        $15,000	1996	183	73	10	$2,850,852	$15,578.43	1.04
Bertrando**        		$10,000	1994	132	57	3	$2,053,778	$15,558.92	1.56
Golden Missile**	        	$7,500	2001	170	87	3	$2,639,354	$15,525.61	2.07
Stormin Fever**    		$7,500	2000	157	69	4	$2,435,563	$15,513.14	2.07
Holy Bull**           		$10,000	1995	180	79	5	$2,770,211	$15,390.06	1.54

VOL JACK · #13 11-24-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

I'd probably take Fupeg at 15k in 2010 over CZ at 10k.

I'd take CZ at 10k in a second though over the again drastically reduced fee for Forestry, who will now stand for 17.5K

Indian Charlie for 70k, a 5k drop, is probably the best bargain out there still, of course.

Interesting that Empire Maker dropped to 50k.

Why in the world would you take Fu Peg over CZ?
I think Fupeg is gonna be a decent broodmare Sire...but other than that what has he accomplished in the shed?

Indian Charlie for 70k is O.k.
But If you can afford 70k...you might as well go to Distorted Humor for 100k.

freddymo · #14 11-24-2009, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

Why in the world would you take Fu Peg over CZ?
I think Fupeg is gonna be a decent broodmare Sire...but other than that what has he accomplished in the shed?

Indian Charlie for 70k is O.k.
But If you can afford 70k...you might as well go to Distorted Humor for 100k.

Advertised stallion fees are a complete joke. Who cares what the advertise at?

How many Fu Peg's are there between the USA/Euro and Australia 12 mil? Remember the first crop I think they averaged 500k at Keeneland..lol

pba1817 · #15 11-24-2009, 08:22 PM

Is the advertised stud fee always paid on live foal... or are there ever any concessions or negotiations?

Scav · #16 11-24-2009, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pba1817

Is the advertised stud fee always paid on live foal... or are there ever any concessions or negotiations?

Tons, there is all sorts of agreements that can be made.

Almost all breeding agreements are stand and nurse now also

philcski · #17 11-24-2009, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

I'd probably take Fupeg at 15k in 2010 over CZ at 10k.

I'd take CZ at 10k in a second though over the again drastically reduced fee for Forestry, who will now stand for 17.5K

Indian Charlie for 70k, a 5k drop, is probably the best bargain out there still, of course.

Interesting that Empire Maker dropped to 50k.

Forestry blows. He should stand for free with the amount of money he's burned up.

Fupeg? Seriously? City Zip has 6 stakes winners this year with 14 stakes wins, Fupeg has 4 with 5 wins. His one 2009 graded win was the Derby Mexicano (no joke.) City Zip is ahead of him in every category.

Linny · #18 11-24-2009, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scav

Maybe true, but based on what expectations? I sure as heck wasn't expecting him to toss a bunch of 6f sprinters. I think when they start getting to two turns you will see different numbers

'Zapper was a freak under a mile when he began his career so a bit of speed wouldn't have been a surprise. When you consider his Vosburgh and his Tom Fool, you don't think of him siring colts that win at 8.5f on turf.

VOL JACK · #19 11-24-2009, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny

'Zapper was a freak under a mile when he began his career so a bit of speed wouldn't have been a surprise. When you consider his Vosburgh and his Tom Fool, you don't think of him siring colts that win at 8.5f on turf.

Being by Awesome Again out of a Relaunch mare does not really scream Turf Sire.

However, City Zip is by Carson City out of the same Relaunch mare and he throws plenty of turf and Poly runners.

freddymo · #20 11-24-2009, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linny

'Zapper was a freak under a mile when he began his career so a bit of speed wouldn't have been a surprise. When you consider his Vosburgh and his Tom Fool, you don't think of him siring colts that win at 8.5f on turf.

Tons of significant races at 7f on the turf Ann? He stood for 300 balloons winning at 6.5 on the lawn doesnt seem a goal of many of those 500k plus yearling AY?