Another glorious win for the homo-phobes?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

Hey, she seemed to like me quite a bit. Perhaps I could parlay that friendship into something more sinister to do my share of the Agenda's work for the day.

funny, i think she said the same about you!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

I don't totally disagree with this, to be perfectly honest.

But in the meantime, the government confers a whole host of rights upon people who are married civilly. Nobody cares if X church down the street won't marry them, they care that the government recognizes the union and gives the same benefits. Read the link I posted above -- everyone likes to say that "oh they can just go get documents to do the same thing," and it's simply not true, because a hospital can keep someone away from their DYING PARTNER and that surviving partner has NO legal recourse at all. Try doing that to a married couple and see what happens.

And the bigger problem is that those who oppose gay marriage ENJOY the rights they get from marriage. No way in a million years are they going to choose to give them up. They like the automatic tax breaks, they like the automatic hospital visits, they like the benefits of marriage that the government gives them. Which makes the whole thing even more disgusting. Either let people in, or get the government out of civil marriage. Go down to the church, get yourself married, and have the government say "big f***ing deal, you still need documents to see your dying spouse...and maybe you can't even see her then," and see how much those opposed to gay marriage all the sudden care about "civil" marriage. The religious argument against "civil marraige" is utter BS.

And people wonder why they get called haters...and act all offended by it.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Danzig

funny, i think she said the same about you!

[brianwspencer]

And Obama didn't do a goddamn thing to help in a state where he's relatively popular either, which is especially rich.

They even played the "we're not familiar enough with the measure to comment" card...it's pretty self-explanatory.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

And Obama didn't do a goddamn thing to help in a state where he's relatively popular either, which is especially rich.

They even played the "we're not familiar enough with the measure to comment" card...it's pretty self-explanatory.

Would you expect anything else given the extreme conservatism with which this White House has handled DADT?

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by miraja2

Would you expect anything else given the way this White House has handled DADT?

Nope. Not at all.

Just voicing discontent with the fact that nobody will grow a pair and stand up and say THIS IS WRONG. Not even the President who campaigned heavily on the "fierce urgency of now" and being a strong advocate for the community.

Fierce urgency of you're on your own.

Wait til people close the purse strings when they get fed up (and I mean literally, my people all carry purses). There's a lot of money out there to be had, and a lot of passionate people willing to do anything for someone and something they believe in.

Not overall, but today? F*ck him.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

Nope. Not at all.

Just voicing discontent with the fact that nobody will grow a pair and stand up and say THIS IS WRONG. Not even the President who campaigned heavily on the "fierce urgency of now" and being a strong advocate for the community.

Fierce urgency of you're on your own.

Wait til people close the purse strings when they get fed up (and I mean literally, my people all carry purses). There's a lot of money out there to be had, and a lot of passionate people willing to do anything for someone and something they believe in.

Not overall, but today? F*ck him.

The ridiculous thing about the way the administration has handled DADT is that it isn't like they are just too cowardly to go against public opinion (at least on this issue) because poll after poll suggests that the majority of Americans favor allowing people who are homosexual to serve in the military.
I don't know what their exact reason might be, but whatever it is, it is ridiculous, not to mention a complete reversal on a campaign pledge.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by miraja2

The ridiculous thing about the way the administration has handled DADT is that it isn't like they are just too cowardly to go against public opinion (at least on this issue) because poll after poll suggests that the majority of Americans favor allowing people who are homosexual to serve in the military.
I don't know what their exact reason might be, but whatever it is, it is ridiculous, not to mention a complete reversal on a campaign pledge.

obama said they didn't have time to fool with DADT, as the economy was on the front burner. funny, that all went out the window when he leaped on health care with both feet! there's more to that story as to why he won't fool with it-but the excuse of having other things to fool with is b.s. imo.

[GenuineRisk]

This is a very good example of why rule by simple majority is not infallible. If civll rights for blacks had been left to the American voters, we'd have seen segregation laws last into the 1980's. Hell, they'd still have them in Georgia.

[Danzig]

it's not supposed to be majority rule. the will of the people isn't supposed to supercede the constitution. if the majority voted to get rid of the press, do you really think that would happen? so why should civil rights only be permitted to some? it's simple-they're not supposed to be. all are created equal is supposed to mean just that.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Danzig

it's not supposed to be majority rule. the will of the people isn't supposed to supercede the constitution. .

it does in Chicago and some suburbs where it's illegal for a homeowner to have a handgun INSIDE their own home.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

it does in Chicago and some suburbs where it's illegal for a homeowner to have a handgun INSIDE their own home.

just another bone of contention with me. a perfect example of poor thinking. how often have you heard 'i'm willing to give up some rights if it makes me safer'. how taking a gun from a law abiding citizen will lessen crime i don't know. and like in d.c., if someone took it to court, it most likely wouldn't stand up to scrutiny.

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Danzig

it's not supposed to be majority rule. the will of the people isn't supposed to supercede the constitution. if the majority voted to get rid of the press, do you really think that would happen? so why should civil rights only be permitted to some? it's simple-they're not supposed to be. all are created equal is supposed to mean just that.

Yeah.... but the response from these nutjobs is that there is already equality- any gay person can get married; he or she just has to marry someone of the opposite sex.

I agree with you- the will of the majority should not be used to supersede the rights of a minority, but then I'm not on the side of those who wail about so-called "activist judges." (What does that even mean, besides, "a judge who makes a decision I personally disagree with?")

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Yeah.... but the response from these nutjobs is that there is already equality- any gay person can get married; he or she just has to marry someone of the opposite sex.

I agree with you- the will of the majority should not be used to supersede the rights of a minority, but then I'm not on the side of those who wail about so-called "activist judges." (What does that even mean, besides, "a judge who makes a decision I personally disagree with?")

The right has been crying about "activist judges" since they didn't get their way in Brown v. Board of Education.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by miraja2

The right has been crying about "activist judges" since they didn't get their way in Brown v. Board of Education.

Take a moment, and think about about that "activist" label. They are pretty clever. What they are saying there is that they think their favorite bigot authors got it right. They agree with those White bigots that set up the country. It's no wonder that they want to follow that plan, and make very few changes. Notice that? They paint you a witch for wanting to mess with it. It takes over 50% of the vote for you to keep them from outlawing Gay marriage. How much of the vote did they need to keep Obama from doing what you agree with? Ohhhh!! Noooo. Not 51%. Oh, no. That somehow got to be 41%. They only need 41% to stop him. Now, Brian is frustrated at Oba for not helping his gay supporters. Now, why do you think Oba can't help the young man? O.K., goes back to them only needing 41% to fk with him. Now, who was it that decided that? Oh, it's their favorite authors. See that? Such infallible designers they were. They decided to give all these white trash states the same number of senators as the civilized states (2.) See that? They give Alabama 2 senators, and a much bigger (and more civilized) state also only gets 2 senators. So, Alabama, and Pennsylvania have very different population numbers. If a small population has the same power (in the senate) as a large population, then don't you think you've doubled or tripled the power of the people in that White Trash state of Alabama ?.....Uh, yep. Now you see why they love them folks that wrote this design. Now, once you've done that (given neck people 2 or 3 times the representation in the senate as civilized people,) you then only make the necks get 41% of the senate to fk up Oba. If you do the math on that, Oba is being held hostage by as little as what? 30% of the voters? Just so happens that those 30% don't like Gay Marriage. That's why that brotha is watching Basketball on T.V., instead of looking like he cares whether Gay Marriage is legal in Maine (something he probably is actually all for.) Our system is designed to heavily favor country-time folks. You can elect all the Progressive Brothas you want, but they will always have to overcome the wishes of the 30% trash in this country (they have a built-in advantage.) This trash will always have more say than you. If that's the way it feels, it's because that's the way it is. Believe me, those Tea baggers from Bama, Tennessee etc. have a bigger voice in this than you or myself. It's exactly the opposite of the sht they say. They are way over represented. I think this is one of the reasons minorities think there is so much prejudice at work. Just look how much representation (in the senate) white people in Montana have versus Urban Black voters in the big cities of this country. Who designed that? It was designed by (or certainly for) the Southern States. That's how they got them to join the Union. That's an unfair fkd-up design, and that's why this country will always be held hostage by the same fkn trash (designed that way.) If you don't think so, get a pair of pliers. Find any piece of cheap metal faucet pipe. Pinch it. Does it matter that the rest of the pipe is clear, n' wide? No, the only thing that matters is that it's pinched down at one point. That's Oba's problem (the senate is that pinch where 30% of the voters get to have the same power as the other 70% of the voters.) People are brainwashed to think this is a fair country. It certainly is not, but look who bitches the most on here. It's the 30% who already have the power equal to the other 70%. They should shut the f up, n' thank their lucky stars.

[Danzig]

not all doom and despair...


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1257...hatsNewsSecond

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Danzig

not all doom and despair...


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1257...hatsNewsSecond

LOL...If they don't call it marriage, it barely makes it through. You would think a compromise like that would make for at least a 60-40 situation. The fact that it's that close sort of points to the objections being mainly from hatred, and not just a problem with the word "marriage."

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

It's the black churches who push it.

Wait...there aren't any black people in Maine. Nvmd.

I've seen a few.

I bought a book when I moved here, for newcomers to the state.

On the first page or two it said that Maine is something like 96% white.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Danzig

exactly! why some are so intent on preventing rights to some of us is beyond me as well.

Most of the homophobes I've ever met are devout Christians.

God hates fags, after all.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Take a moment, and think about about that "activist" label. They are pretty clever. What they are saying there is that they think their favorite bigot authors got it right. They agree with those White bigots that set up the country. It's no wonder that they want to follow that plan, and make very few changes. Notice that? They paint you a witch for wanting to mess with it. It takes over 50% of the vote for you to keep them from outlawing Gay marriage. How much of the vote did they need to keep Obama from doing what you agree with? Ohhhh!! Noooo. Not 51%. Oh, no. That somehow got to be 41%. They only need 41% to stop him. Now, Brian is frustrated at Oba for not helping his gay supporters. Now, why do you think Oba can't help the young man? O.K., goes back to them only needing 41% to fk with him. Now, who was it that decided that? Oh, it's their favorite authors. See that? Such infallible designers they were. They decided to give all these white trash states the same number of senators as the civilized states (2.) See that? They give Alabama 2 senators, and a much bigger (and more civilized) state also only gets 2 senators. So, Alabama, and Pennsylvania have very different population numbers. If a small population has the same power (in the senate) as a large population, then don't you think you've doubled or tripled the power of the people in that White Trash state of Alabama ?.....Uh, yep. Now you see why they love them folks that wrote this design. Now, once you've done that (given neck people 2 or 3 times the representation in the senate as civilized people,) you then only make the necks get 41% of the senate to fk up Oba. If you do the math on that, Oba is being held hostage by as little as what? 30% of the voters? Just so happens that those 30% don't like Gay Marriage. That's why that brotha is watching Basketball on T.V., instead of looking like he cares whether Gay Marriage is legal in Maine (something he probably is actually all for.) Our system is designed to heavily favor country-time folks. You can elect all the Progressive Brothas you want, but they will always have to overcome the wishes of the 30% trash in this country (they have a built-in advantage.) This trash will always have more say than you. If that's the way it feels, it's because that's the way it is. Believe me, those Tea baggers from Bama, Tennessee etc. have a bigger voice in this than you or myself. It's exactly the opposite of the sht they say. They are way over represented. I think this is one of the reasons minorities think there is so much prejudice at work. Just look how much representation (in the senate) white people in Montana have versus Urban Black voters in the big cities of this country. Who designed that? It was designed by (or certainly for) the Southern States. That's how they got them to join the Union. That's an unfair fkd-up design, and that's why this country will always be held hostage by the same fkn trash (designed that way.) If you don't think so, get a pair of pliers. Find any piece of cheap metal faucet pipe. Pinch it. Does it matter that the rest of the pipe is clear, n' wide? No, the only thing that matters is that it's pinched down at one point. That's Oba's problem (the senate is that pinch where 30% of the voters get to have the same power as the other 70% of the voters.) People are brainwashed to think this is a fair country. It certainly is not, but look who bitches the most on here. It's the 30% who already have the power equal to the other 70%. They should shut the f up, n' thank their lucky stars.

Ever heard of a paragraph?