welfare vs wages

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rudeboyelvis

If that McDonald's is in Florida, you will have about a 99% chance of being served by a HS drop out with a neck tattoo, than a college grad that "hasn't found their niche" yet.

i'd love to see a citation on that 99% chance.

■Over 88 percent of workers who would benefit are at least 20 years old.
■About 44 percent of affected workers have at least some college education.


or you can ignore the facts and stick with your preconceived notions of who works in fast food.


Minimum-wage workers are older and, as discussed later, have greater family responsibilities than commonly portrayed. The facts do not support the perception of minimum-wage workers as primarily teenagers working for spending money (though even if true, it would not justify paying teens subpoverty wages).

the corresponding chart showed that 11.7% of workers who would be affected by a min. wage increase are under age 20. that means 88.3% aren't teens.



Data on educational attainment of those who would be affected by a minimum-wage increase further dispel the misperception of minimum-wage workers as high school students. In fact, nationally just 21.3 percent of those who would be affected have less than a high school degree, while fully 43.8 percent have some college education, an associate degree, or a bachelor’s degree or higher.

[Danzig]

The immediate benefits of a minimum-wage increase are in the boosted earnings of the lowest-paid workers, but its positive effects would far exceed this extra income. Recent research reveals that, despite skeptics’ claims, raising the minimum wage does not cause job loss.6 In fact, throughout the nation, a minimum-wage increase under current labor market conditions would create jobs. Like unemployment insurance benefits or tax breaks for low- and middle-income workers, raising the minimum wage puts more money in the pockets of working families when they need it most, thereby augmenting their spending power. Economists generally recognize that low-wage workers are more likely than any other income group to spend any extra earnings immediately on previously unaffordable basic needs or services.

Increasing the federal minimum wage to $10.10 by July 1, 2015, would give an additional $51.5 billion over the phase-in period to directly and indirectly affected workers,7 who would, in turn, spend those extra earnings. Indirectly affected workers—those earning close to, but still above, the proposed new minimum wage—would likely receive a boost in earnings due to the “spillover” effect (Shierholz 2009), giving them more to spend on necessities.

This projected rise in consumer spending is critical to any recovery, especially when weak consumer demand is one of the most significant factors holding back new hiring (Izzo 2011).8 Though the stimulus from a minimum-wage increase is smaller than the boost created by, for example, unemployment insurance benefits, it has the crucial advantage of not imposing costs on the public sector.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i'd love to see a citation on that 99% chance.




or you can ignore the facts and stick with your preconceived notions of who works in fast food.


Minimum-wage workers are older and, as discussed later, have greater family responsibilities than commonly portrayed. The facts do not support the perception of minimum-wage workers as primarily teenagers working for spending money (though even if true, it would not justify paying teens subpoverty wages).

the corresponding chart showed that 11.7% of workers who would be affected by a min. wage increase are under age 20. that means 88.3% aren't teens.



Data on educational attainment of those who would be affected by a minimum-wage increase further dispel the misperception of minimum-wage workers as high school students. In fact, nationally just 21.3 percent of those who would be affected have less than a high school degree, while fully 43.8 percent have some college education, an associate degree, or a bachelor’s degree or higher.

I'd like to see the citation that shows 43.8% of the store workers at MacDonalds have not only graduated HS, but managed to earn a B.S. or at least attended undergraduate schooling.

Please feel free to revisit my previous posts. I compared minimum wage jobs of 30 years ago to the current climate. Of course there are more adults working these jobs but that directly correlates to the number of adults that chose to forgo their education. Only 3/4ths of kids in high school graduate. The number of those that go on to higher education, compared to other developed nations, is staggeringly low.

That is not McDonald's nor Walmart's nor anyone else who employs minimum wage worker's fault. They should not be required to increase the prices of their goods and services to inflate the compensation of these folks that made these choices.

When I go to McDonalds, I see a couple of shift managers (who most likely graduated HS and possibly attended Community College), a bunch of kids, and an equal amount of 20 somethings that don't look like they even know what day it is, but have managed to earn enough cash to tattoo every inch of their bodies. Hey, your world, who am i to judge?

Sorry, but that is the impression that is left.

Walmart is not much different. Though more uneducated middle aged people than teenagers appear to work there. I see people who were probably day laborers during the construction boom stocking shelves, low level office workers during the mortgage boom manning the cash registers, etc. - now working these jobs. They, by and large, have no formal education and obviously did not excel when they did have a menial office job nor impress a construction foreman to be brought back when work began to slowly trickle back in. Which is fine. this is their fit, and they are most likely excelling at it. But that is what it is - it is not a 10.00 an hour job. and employers needn't be held hostage with a proverbial gun to their head to give that to them.

When the market dictates that wages increase, then you will see it. When Walmart can't run a store because they are losing employees to a competitor due to wages, they will increase wages. How it works.

Unfortunately you have a generation of unskilled labor at the ready, so i doubt it happens anytime soon.

[Danzig]

again, rude, would you rather a multi billion dollar corporation pay a living wage, like they used to, or would you prefer we continue to subsidize these workers with rent assistance, housing allowances, food stamps, etc? gun to it's head. that's hilarious.

as for impressions...i'll take cold, hard facts from people who study this over impressions, bias, feelings and beliefs any day.

as for the market-i doubt the market has ever dictated. these companies for the most part will try to get away with everything they possibly can.

i think it's a disgrace, for example, that the base wage for a tipped employee hasn't been changed since it was set in 1991. 22 years ago.
you telling me the market bears out keeping that amount?

you can't go by what you think, and one should never judge a book by its cover. i'd imagine people i deal with think i have a college degree plus. i don't.


corporations have seen taxes lowered, subsidies granted, etc, etc. in turn, with all the breaks they've gotten from the pols they pay off, they in turn should pay a correct wage, based on years of indicators and facts.
but yeah, let mcdonalds and the like keep making billions of dollars while the middle class keeps supporting everyone. that's fair.