Who will you vote for?

Originally Posted by Riot

Well, other than the 5 years of me being pretty consistent in the way I've always "handled" Morty

Sometimes I really wonder if some Derby Trail members actually read Derby Trail .... ?

Well....they do

And that is the #1 reason you will never be a serious contender for junior ombudsman.

If there is no crack in your pipe, there should be.

[joeydb]

Currently (at 7:20am EDT):

12 votes for Obama
13 votes for Romney
and
3 votes for Johnson

I hope those so inclined will see that a vote for Johnson is basically a vote for Obama. In other words the vote for the admittedly disadvantaged third party under our electoral system only raises the probability that the candidate you like the least (Obama even if you are Libertarian) will win.

[Antitrust32]

I actually dislike Romney and Obama equally. I don't believe the Republican Party is conservative anymore, and I have disgust for their pandering to the religious right.

To me, Obama has been no different than Bush. I dont believe Romney will be any different than Bush. You guys are voting for the same man.

I'll stick with voting 3rd party.. as nothing will ever change unless the American people demand change.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I actually dislike Romney and Obama equally. I don't believe the Republican Party is conservative anymore, and I have disgust for their pandering to the religious right.

To me, Obama has been no different than Bush. I dont believe Romney will be any different than Bush. You guys are voting for the same man.

I'll stick with voting 3rd party.. as nothing will ever change unless the American people demand change.

I respect your principles - however the math of it shows you will be aiding Obama in re-election. Just keep that in mind. If that's OK with you, good. You should be aware of both your intention and the likely effect of your decision.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by joeydb

I respect your principles - however the math of it shows you will be aiding Obama in re-election. Just keep that in mind. If that's OK with you, good. You should be aware of both your intention and the likely effect of your decision.

When did you become the father of the board?

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

When did you become the father of the board?

Never said I was. Did what I said not make logical sense?

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by joeydb

I respect your principles - however the math of it shows you will be aiding Obama in re-election. Just keep that in mind. If that's OK with you, good. You should be aware of both your intention and the likely effect of your decision.

i suppose you think that saying it enough times will make it so.

unless a third party candidate garners enough votes to get electoral votes in his column, the only impact is on the overall popular vote. altho ross perot received 19% of the popular vote, thus keeping clinton from potentially receiving more than 50% of the vote, he received no electoral votes.

[joeydb]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i suppose you think that saying it enough times will make it so.

unless a third party candidate garners enough votes to get electoral votes in his column, the only impact is on the overall popular vote. altho ross perot received 19% of the popular vote, thus keeping clinton from potentially receiving more than 50% of the vote, he received no electoral votes.

Are you kidding?

You are correct of course about the electoral vote, but obviously the vote that did not go to which candidate has a chance to win that is still more favorable to the third-party voter than the Democrat does have an impact.

Count the votes on the top of this page. If the Johnson votes went to Romney instead, doesn't the result become clearer? It is much more likely that the third-party voter will lose the election for Romney than win it for Johnson - astronomically so.

So again - in 2012 - with the polls where they are - even plus or minus 10% for Obama or Romney - a vote for Johnson is equivalent to a vote for Obama.

That is the math of it, and all the motivation, justification, and hand-wringing before and after casting the vote is meaningless. The MATH is all that MATTERS as that is what drives the RESULT.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Are you kidding?

You are correct of course about the electoral vote, but obviously the vote that did not go to which candidate has a chance to win that is still more favorable to the third-party voter than the Democrat does have an impact.

Count the votes on the top of this page. If the Johnson votes went to Romney instead, doesn't the result become clearer? It is much more likely that the third-party voter will lose the election for Romney than win it for Johnson - astronomically so.

So again - in 2012 - with the polls where they are - even plus or minus 10% for Obama or Romney - a vote for Johnson is equivalent to a vote for Obama.

That is the math of it, and all the motivation, justification, and hand-wringing before and after casting the vote is meaningless. The MATH is all that MATTERS as that is what drives the RESULT.

Unless the Supreme Court is going to hand another election to the candidate that got the fewest popular votes like they did in 2000, the electoral college is the only thing that matters, which means that only 8 states matter, and all 8 states right now are clearly for or leaning Obama.

It's a shame that states that are predictably red or blue don't get visits or advertising from the candidates. For example, Kentucky is a democratic-majority registered state. Our largest population centers are clearly democratic. But we have McConnell and Rand Paul. The only candidate advertising here is Tea Party and aggressive republican, hardly any democratic candidate.

I'm wishing it would go to popular vote, I think, and do away with electoral college. Make each candidate have to win every state, every vote they can. Have to think on it a little more.

[Rudeboyelvis]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Are you kidding?

You are correct of course about the electoral vote, but obviously the vote that did not go to which candidate has a chance to win that is still more favorable to the third-party voter than the Democrat does have an impact.

Count the votes on the top of this page. If the Johnson votes went to Romney instead, doesn't the result become clearer? It is much more likely that the third-party voter will lose the election for Romney than win it for Johnson - astronomically so.

So again - in 2012 - with the polls where they are - even plus or minus 10% for Obama or Romney - a vote for Johnson is equivalent to a vote for Obama.

That is the math of it, and all the motivation, justification, and hand-wringing before and after casting the vote is meaningless. The MATH is all that MATTERS as that is what drives the RESULT.

Perhaps that wouldn't be the case if Romney didn't kowtow so far to the fringe right, to the point of excluding the majority of Americans. One thing for certain, that ain't Gary Johnson's fault, or problem.

The Republicans are something else man.... You could run an empty sack of potatoes against Obama and would win this election considering what an abject failure his presidency has been in virtually every measurement.

But no...Gotta stick an overstuffed,overprivileged fundamentalist with a recipe for financial disaster in there to insure you alienate the majority of the voting population, then cry about how a third party candidate "stole" your election from you.

good grief.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by joeydb

Are you kidding?

You are correct of course about the electoral vote, but obviously the vote that did not go to which candidate has a chance to win that is still more favorable to the third-party voter than the Democrat does have an impact.

Count the votes on the top of this page. If the Johnson votes went to Romney instead, doesn't the result become clearer? It is much more likely that the third-party voter will lose the election for Romney than win it for Johnson - astronomically so.

So again - in 2012 - with the polls where they are - even plus or minus 10% for Obama or Romney - a vote for Johnson is equivalent to a vote for Obama.

That is the math of it, and all the motivation, justification, and hand-wringing before and after casting the vote is meaningless. The MATH is all that MATTERS as that is what drives the RESULT.

no, i'm not kidding. you might want to look up electoral votes, and the entire voting process for president.
presidents aren't elected by popular vote, or majority vote. each state has its own rules regarding electoral votes, and how they are obtained. in some states, whoever wins the popular vote wins the entire number of electoral votes. in others, they are apportioned. so, altho ross got almost 20% of the popular vote, his votes in each state weren't enough to garner a single electoral vote. he had, therefore, zero chance to win the presidency.

also, you're assuming that all votes for 3rd party candidates would go to romney if they didn't go to an alternative. what is that based on? they could just as easily go to obama.

at any rate, it doesn't matter one whit in how i decide to vote. i will vote my conscience, and it will not be for obama or romney. they don't deserve my vote.
as for your assumptions about where a 3rd party vote would wind up if one had to choose between romney and obama. i'd vote for the latter. but, i get to choose.

[Danzig]

http://factcheck.org/2012/10/obamas-numbers/

Summary
For more than a year, we’ve been pointing out on a regular basis how President Obama, his allies and his critics all misuse or even fabricate statistics to give voters a skewed picture of reality. This time we’ll just offer the accurate numbers.

Here — in a graphic suitable for framing, embossing, emailing to friends or posting on social media — is an accurate statistical picture of key changes that occurred since Obama took office in January 2009. The indicators are all derived from the most authoritative and up-to-date sources available.


Readers may draw their own conclusions about how much credit or blame the president personally deserves for any of them. What we can vouch for is that these measures are the most recent available, from authoritative sources, and cover the time since Obama took the oath of office.