Another Brilliant Plan Out of WI

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

And what happens to that vote? Depends on what the election is for, right? You might check out your own election laws. They are on the internet, just google "voting requirement Wisconsin".



They have to show ID now. Maybe you should go read your current voting laws before you change them.

No you do not have to show ID to vote. You don't have to show an ID to register to vote either. You do have to show something with your address on it to register to vote, but once registered you do not have to show anything to vote. That person could have moved, etc and could be voting twice

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

No you do not have to show ID to vote. You don't have to show an ID to register to vote either. You do have to show something with your address on it to register to vote, but once registered you do not have to show anything to vote. That person could have moved, etc and could be voting twice

The incidences of voter fraud in your state are very low.

To vote on day of election, or to register to vote, you have to provide the following (this is only part of the requirements, there are residency time requirements, too): (and if you do not show these, you can only cast a provision ballot in the federal election only that is not automatically counted)

from Wis.gov

Acceptable documents for proof of Wisconsin residency

Documents presented as proof must be original. Photocopies and account statements printed online are not acceptable.

The following documents are acceptable proof of Wisconsin residency when they include your name and current Wisconsin residence street address:

* Employee photo identification card issued by your current employer, containing your employer's name and address. Your employer's telephone number may be required for verification.

* Pay check or stub with your name and Wisconsin address, and your employer's name and address. Your employer's telephone number may be required for verification.

* A utility bill for water, gas, electricity or land-line telephone service at least 30 days old.

* An account statement at least 30 days old from a Wisconsin financial institution. The account statement must show activity.

* Wisconsin Quest Card (acceptable for proof of Wisconsin residency without your residence street address on it).

* Forward Wisconsin ID Medical Assistance Card (acceptable for proof of Wisconsin residency without your residence street address on it).

* Certified school record or transcript.

* Mortgage documents for a residential property in Wisconsin.

The department will decline to accept any document presented if it does not provide conclusive proof of residency.

Documents presented as proof must be original. Photocopies are not acceptable. Documents with a photograph of a person will be accepted only when the person is readily recognizable from the photograph. The department will decline to accept any document presented if it has reason to suspect the authenticity of the document. Questionable documents may require additional review.

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

The incidences of voter fraud in your state are very low.

To vote on day of election, or to register to vote, you have to provide the following (this is only part of the requirements, there are residency time requirements, too): (and if you do not show these, you can only cast a provision ballot in the federal election only that is not automatically counted)

from Wis.gov

So if a person is registered to vote in Milwaukee, but moves to Waukesha 60 days ago and has a utility bill in Waukesha now they could vote in both Milwaukee where they are currently registered and in Waukesha where they now have a utility bill in since they could register the day of the election. Someone else could be voting under someone else's name that is a registered voter as well if they knew their name and address since we don't require proof that they are the person they say they are.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by wiphan

So if a person is registered to vote in Milwaukee, but moves to Waukesha 60 days ago and has a utility bill in Waukesha now they could vote in both Milwaukee where they are currently registered and in Waukesha where they now have a utility bill in since they could register the day of the election. Someone else could be voting under someone else's name that is a registered voter as well if they knew their name and address since we don't require proof that they are the person they say they are.

Here's a thought... if you dont have an photo ID card, and you want to vote, how about go and get a photo ID? I mean they have a year to prepare for this. If voting is important to you, all you have to do is bring a valid form of identification.

I had to show it here in Florida, and the world didnt end. At least not yet.

Should be a requirement you have to show the electronic long form birth certificate...not the physical copy. They'll believe it.

[Antitrust32]

and guess what... you actually CAN use your student ID to vote in Wisconsin, according to the new law. As long as the ID has not expired and you have to prove you are currently enrolled.

Who would have thought?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

and guess what... you actually CAN use your student ID to vote in Wisconsin, according to the new law. As long as the ID has not expired and you have to prove you are currently enrolled.

Who would have thought?

You mean except that there's more than what you said: the ID's don't have expiration dates or proof of current enrollment on them? and don't meet all the requirements of the current bill as signed today?

http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/ar...?article=33379

Most significantly, the Assembly version would include university-issued student identification cards as an acceptable form of ID.

But there's a catch: the student IDs must include a current address, birth date, signature and expiration date -- requirements no college or university in Wisconsin currently meets.

"A lot of changes in this version are really steps in the wrong direction," says David Canon, a UW-Madison political science professor and election law expert.

According to Canon, the requirement of a current address for student IDs is "more onerous" than those for other IDs, like military identification, and creates a kind of double standard.

"If [bill author Rep. Stone's] stated purpose is to make driver's licenses and student IDs equivalent, he needs to makes them equivalent," says Canon. "It's not the same standard and it's a very significant difference between the two."

Additionally, Canon notes that UW campus IDs serve as room keys, making the rule that they contain an updated address dangerous, in terms of student security. And universities would have to bear the cost of issuing updated ID cards to students, which he says they are ill-equipped to handle.

Samuel Polstein, a UW-Madison student council member and a leader of student efforts opposing the bill, is also dissatisfied with the requirement.

Students will have to bring receipt as proof of paid tuition for the semester with them to the polling place.

Hey, nice! Have fun trying to vote in Wisconsin, students! Good luck with that. Thank the Republican party! We know most students vote Democratic for reasons exactly like this - too bad the Republicans made it so you can't vote! And that's why.

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Here's a thought... if you dont have an photo ID card, and you want to vote, how about go and get a photo ID? I mean they have a year to prepare for this. If voting is important to you, all you have to do is bring a valid form of identification.

I had to show it here in Florida, and the world didnt end. At least not yet.

But don't you get it then they can't cheat the system. Riot believes there is no fraud, but without a photo ID it is impossible to prove what person actually cast that vote so it is impossible to prove fraud. The same person that will be disenfranchised by the so called photo ID receives some sort of government entitlement whether it be medicare, medicaid, food stamps, social security etc which require much more work and effort than simply obtaining an ID

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

But don't you get it then they can't cheat the system.

How are poor people that don't have cars, and can't take a day off work to stand at the DMV, supposed to get one? How is grandma in the nursing home supposed to get one?

Riot believes there is no fraud, but without a photo ID it is impossible to prove what person actually cast that vote so it is impossible to prove fraud.

No. Stop misstating what I've said. I've said there is fraud, and it's so low it's in the single digits. It is entirely possible to prove who voted where (signatures and crosschecking now) which is [b]why voter fraud is so low.

The same person that will be disenfranchised by the so called photo ID receives some sort of government entitlement whether it be medicare, medicaid, food stamps, social security etc which require much more work and effort than simply obtaining an ID

Wow - your assumptive statement reveals a lot about why the law is being changed by the Republicans. Thanks for admitting that

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

How are poor people that don't have cars, and can't take a day off work to stand at the DMV, supposed to get one? How is grandma in the nursing home supposed to get one?


No. Stop misstating what I've said. I've said there is fraud, and it's so low it's in the single digits. It is entirely possible to prove who voted where (signatures and crosschecking now) which is [b]why voter fraud is so low.

How do you know it is so low? Do you really know that the person who said they were Bill Smith was actually Bill Smith?

Wow - your assumptive statement reveals a lot about why the law is being changed by the Republicans. Thanks for admitting that

Is not an assumption it is fact. If they work then they need to cash a check. In order to cash a check they need a photo ID (even at the check cashing place). To open a bank account they need a photo ID. The poor people that you speak of usually are on food stamps or receive medicaid. If they are not then they already need an ID to cash their pay check. The elderly receive social security, medicare or medicaid. You need a photo ID to do just about everything. So what is wrong with the facts

1) If they work they have a photo ID- required by employer and required to cash a check
2) If they don't work they need to have some income coming in thus they are on a government entitlement program
3) If they are elderly they either are independently wealthy or they are on a government entitlement (ie social security, medicare, etc.)

What am I missing

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Here's a thought... if you dont have an photo ID card, and you want to vote, how about go and get a photo ID? I mean they have a year to prepare for this. If voting is important to you, all you have to do is bring a valid form of identification.

I had to show it here in Florida, and the world didnt end. At least not yet.

You don't have a year to prepare if you move. And if Wisconsin changed the law so you can no longer get one on weekends before the election when you are not working.

[wiphan]

Originally Posted by Riot

You don't have a year to prepare if you move. And if Wisconsin changed the law so you can no longer get one on weekends before the election when you are not working.

The disenfranchised people you speak of usually don't have a job so Mon-Friday works just fine (poor and elderly). The responsible people who have an ID (which by the way is required by most employers) will find time to go to the DMV and change their address. So that is not an issue.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

The disenfranchised people you speak of usually don't have a job so Mon-Friday works just fine (poor and elderly). The responsible people who have an ID (which by the way is required by most employers) will find time to go to the DMV and change their address. So that is not an issue.

Yes, we don't want those unemployed or irresponsible people voting! Who cares? That's "not an issue" to quote you. Even if this is America, and every adult over 18 not prohibited by a court is allowed to.

(Except the Republicans want to also add in those damn unemployed freeloaders who are irresponsible - no voting for them, no matter what the Constitution says! They usually vote Democratic, anyways ... )

At least you are honest about it, finally. That is exactly who the Republicans want to disinfranchise.

[Rileyoriley]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

Here's a thought... if you dont have an photo ID card, and you want to vote, how about go and get a photo ID? I mean they have a year to prepare for this. If voting is important to you, all you have to do is bring a valid form of identification.

I had to show it here in Florida, and the world didnt end. At least not yet.

Pay attention. The world is now ending October 21st, 2011.

[Rileyoriley]

I wonder if one has to show a photo ID to be eligible for the rapture?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by wiphan

So if a person is registered to vote in Milwaukee, but moves to Waukesha 60 days ago and has a utility bill in Waukesha now they could vote in both Milwaukee where they are currently registered and in Waukesha where they now have a utility bill in since they could register the day of the election. Someone else could be voting under someone else's name that is a registered voter as well if they knew their name and address since we don't require proof that they are the person they say they are.

And the occurance of the above is how much? Thousands? Millions?

That's why when you move, you have to register in your new precinct, in order to vote there. Otherwise - boom, there you are again with the provision ballot that isn't counted.

Amazing how those current laws work to keep voter fraud in the single digits year after year after year in Wisconsin!

Sad that the Koch Brothers Republican Governors Association has as it's stated goal making voting laws harder, so less people can readily vote - especially those Democratic-leaning ones.

Sad American citizens sign on to that discrimination.

[Antitrust32]

I really, really did not feel discriminated against the last time I voted and had to bust out the driver ID

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I really, really did not feel discriminated against the last time I voted and had to bust out the driver ID

Because you had one. I just showed my license last Tuesday to vote in the primary. But if I didn't have it with me, I would have been allowed to vote.

Wait until someone tells grandma who has lived in the same house for decades, who knows the poll workers, who has voted in that precinct her entire life that she can't vote this time because she stopped driving 2 years ago and her license is expired and no, she didn't need to go get a new non-driver photo ID so doesn't have anything.

The point is not the photo ID. The point is making it deliberately more difficult than it is now to be able to vote, by changing the voting laws to make them more restrictive, and the deliberate way it is being done is to disenfranchise the poor and non-whites, students, the elderly. It's disgusting.