LOL -- A warning from Napolitano

[Riot]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...090202673.html

Selected excerpts:

How illegal immigrants are helping Social Security

In response to a research inquiry for a book I am writing on the economics of immigration, Stephen C. Goss, the chief actuary of the Social Security Administration and someone who enjoys bipartisan support for his straightforwardness, said that by 2007, the Social Security trust fund had received a net benefit of somewhere between $120 billion and $240 billion from unauthorized immigrants.

That represented an astounding 5.4 percent to 10.7 percent of the trust fund's total assets of $2.24 trillion that year. The cumulative contribution is surely higher now. Unauthorized immigrants paid a net contribution of $12 billion in 2007 alone, Goss said.

"If for example we had not had other-than-legal immigrants in the country over the past," Goss e-mailed me, "then these numbers suggest that we would have entered persistent shortfall of tax revenue to cover [payouts] starting [in] 2009, or six years earlier than estimated under the 2010 Trustees Report."

The Social Security actuaries estimate that two-thirds of unauthorized immigrant workers, or 5.6 million people, were paying into the system in 2007. Roughly half used a Social Security number tied to an invented name or one that belonged to someone else. Of the rest, many got legal cards when they entered the country under a temporary work visa. They stayed illegally after their visas expired.

About 180,000 unauthorized immigrants received about $1 billion in fraudulent benefits in 2007, Goss said. These benefits are subtracted from the net contribution. Few of the unauthorized workers are likely to receive anything, ever. About the only way they might would be if they were to become legal, and they had paid their withholding taxes using their true names.

The decline in illegal immigration, plus tighter workplace enforcement, means that contributions from the unauthorized will decrease. But as Goss notes, they remain, because of larger families, a positive contributing factor to Social Security solvency.

Somebody ought to say thank you.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...090202673.html

Selected excerpts:

Mr. Goss’s information is very informative if correct. Let’s take a look behind some of his numbers:

“In response to a research inquiry for a book I am writing on the economics of immigration, Stephen C. Goss, the chief actuary of the Social Security Administration and someone who enjoys bipartisan support for his straightforwardness, said that by 2007, the Social Security trust fund had received a net benefit of somewhere between $120 billion and $240 billion from unauthorized immigrants.

That represented an astounding 5.4 percent to 10.7 percent of the trust fund's total assets of $2.24 trillion that year. The cumulative contribution is surely higher now. Unauthorized immigrants paid a net contribution of $12 billion in 2007 alone, Goss said.”

He went on with

”About 180,000 unauthorized immigrants received about $1 billion in fraudulent benefits in 2007, Goss said. These benefits are subtracted from the net contribution.”

So using Mr. Goss’s figures $13 billion were contributed to Social Security in 2007 by ‘unauthorized workers’ after adding back on the billion he subtracted for fraud. After using the 5.6 million worker number he quoted we arrive at an average contribution per worker of $2,321.00. Since the SS and Medicaid contribution is 7.65% of first 90K earned we learn that the average yearly wage for an illegal worker in 2007 was $30,539.00.

So now Mr. Goss has let the truth out. I would think there are 5.6 million American workers ready and willing to go to work today for 30K per year no matter how dirty the job. I'd also like to ask Mr. Goss the amount of children these ‘unauthorized workers’ have with them. If it averages out to anything more than a half child per worker the $2,321 contributed to SS is swallowed up in the first semester of school with a courtesy daily lunch. I'll let RIOT figure out the ER room health costs incurred and will leave out uninsured motor vehicle accidents, crime, etc etc etc.

Stephen Goss showed his bias throughout the piece using ‘unauthorized’ instead of illegal. To him someone robbing his neighbor’s house isn’t a home invader or burglar but an unauthorized visitor.

[Antitrust32]

I think you would have to base it at 12% for social security, not 6%.. Either you pay all 12% or your company matches your 6%...

so go with 12% if you are trying to figure out peoples salaries.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I think you would have to base it at 12% for social security, not 6%.. Either you pay all 12% or your company matches your 6%...

so go with 12% if you are trying to figure out peoples salaries.

Going with the 12% figure the average yearly pay per worker is reduced to $19,341.

I'm not sure Goss included the employers contribution? If he did then he should have added and their employers everytime he typed 'unauthorized immigrants' or reduced their total contribution by half.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Going with the 12% figure the average yearly pay per worker is reduced to $19,341.

I'm not sure Goss included the employers contribution? If he did then he should have added and their employers everytime he typed 'unauthorized immigrants' or reduced their total contribution by half.

it has to be 12% no matter what.

If that employee isnt working, the 6% match isnt coming in. If you are self employed you have to pay 12% anyway.

Plus 19k sounds a lot more like the salary of an illegal than 30k.

[Princess Doreen]

The National Immigration Law Center says the money is directed towards the Earnings Suspense File, which is a repository for Social Security taxes which are paid by illegal immigrants who have either used false identities, forged document or incorrect Social Security numbers.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news0...ret_stash.html

The U. S. government is getting the benefit of those SS payments. I doubt they're being held in any "Suspense" file. The suspense is how the U. S. government is diverting those funds to pay for something other than the SS Program - much the same as they've diverted a LOT of SS funds. If all the money paid into SS over the decades actually had stayed in a SS account, the program wouldn't be in any trouble whatsoever.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Princess Doreen

The National Immigration Law Center says the money is directed towards the Earnings Suspense File, which is a repository for Social Security taxes which are paid by illegal immigrants who have either used false identities, forged document or incorrect Social Security numbers.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news0...ret_stash.html

The U. S. government is getting the benefit of those SS payments. I doubt they're being held in any "Suspense" file. The suspense is how the U. S. government is diverting those funds to pay for something other than the SS Program - much the same as they've diverted a LOT of SS funds. If all the money paid into SS over the decades actually had stayed in a SS account, the program wouldn't be in any trouble whatsoever.

exactly... its legal stealing

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Princess Doreen

If all the money paid into SS over the decades actually had stayed in a SS account, the program wouldn't be in any trouble whatsoever.

SS isn't in trouble. That's just something that people who want to privatize it say. If nothing is done, it's fine until 2037, and after that, it can pay out at 78% of what it should. If nothing at all is ever done. A few small tweaks (raising the cap works very well) and that 78% payout is readily fixed, as has been done in the past.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

it has to be 12% no matter what.

If that employee isnt working, the 6% match isnt coming in. If you are self employed you have to pay 12% anyway.

Plus 19k sounds a lot more like the salary of an illegal than 30k.

I completely agree I just think the employer should get credit for the contribution he makes and the worker what he does. An employer would pay the 6% whether it be for a legit or illegit SS#. I trust illegals who are self employed are forgoing both parts and make up part of the 1/3 Goss talks about.