Founding fathers liked taxed government health care

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Nascar1966

Im sure Riot can tell us where all the money is going to come from to pay for this BS insurance. My guess is our brain dead and clueless Pres will take it from the military, retired military, and Social Security.

No. The people who buy this BS insurance pay for it. To those private capitalistic companies who sell it to them and make a profit.

There is no insurance to purchase from the government.

The poor people on Medicaid will be paid for as they are now. Except the PPACA did do some financial adjustments to extend the life of the Medicaid trust by 12 years.

The government will give vouchers to those low income but not poverty-level people that can't afford insurance, to help them pay for a portion of it, based upon income. That is paid for in several ways, none of which involves SS, Medicare or the VA, or retired or military.

Seriously - here are the major provisions in the bill, and how it works, written in plain english, click on it and go read it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient...dable_Care_Act

Nobody says you have to like it, or agree with it - but you do have the responsibility to dislike or disagree with actual content in the bill, not imaginary, made up talking points of fear mongering.

See, the anger you hold over things in your imagination about this is probably raising your blood pressure, and I'm helping pay for your VA insurance. Preventive care is a good thing.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

The government will give vouchers to those low income but not poverty-level people that can't afford insurance, to help them pay for a portion of it, based upon income. That is paid for in several ways, none of which involves SS, Medicare or the VA, or retired or military..

Give me a break it's paid for in taxes and then those taxed get to wait in line with those who received 'vouchers' in many cases for the same Dr. test. It's nothing more than a massive expansion of medicaid.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by dellinger63

Give me a break it's paid for in taxes and then those taxed get to wait in line with those who received 'vouchers' in many cases for the same Dr. test. It's nothing more than a massive expansion of medicaid.

So .. you don't like sharing a doctor with other people who didn't buy 100% of their own insurance? That's weird.

(the vouchers are for purchasing insurance, not healthcare)

Maybe there are superelite doctors and hospitals that are 100% insurance company or private pay, with no other payment plans, you can go to so you don't catch cooties waiting in line with other patients.

Right now I share doctors and hospitals with other people who have no insurance at all, so I'll be happy when they can finally afford to purchase insurance themselves (with some help) - it will lower my costs.

And I really don't care how other people pay their bills. I mostly worry about mine.

[dellinger63]

Originally Posted by Riot

So .. you don't like sharing a doctor with other people who didn't buy 100% of their own insurance? That's weird.

(the vouchers are for purchasing insurance, not healthcare).

The sharing is fine, the paying for their vouchers is where I have a problem. Not to mention the overcrowding of the entire healthcare system that will have no other choice than to reduce/ration care for everyone and the fraud that will surely accompany this and any other federal 'get well plan' that has ever been devised.

I believe the subsidizing of medical students in return for a certain amount of service in return is a great idea as these new Dr.'s could do internships and residencies at government run hospitals treating government supported patients. This would be constitutional IMO, allow those unable to buy insurance to be treated and no changes would be made to those who are happy with their current care.

[Riot]

Not to mention the overcrowding of the entire healthcare system that will have no other choice than to reduce/ration care for everyone

Those people are getting healthcare now, but only emergency - they are tying up emergency rooms and trauma centers for diabetes blood checks and colds/flu, sprains, etc!

Get them insurance so they get preventive care (lowering all our healthcare costs, because we pay for them in the ER), get them out of the ER and hospitals, and get them into a regular doctor's office where they belong.

I believe the subsidizing of medical students in return for a certain amount of service in return is a great idea as these new Dr.'s could do internships and residencies at government run hospitals treating government supported patients. This would be constitutional IMO, allow those unable to buy insurance to be treated and no changes would be made to those who are happy with their current care.

The government does that now - provides educational subsidies for doctors, they replay loans with service. The army does it, too. Ever see the show Northern Exposure? Yes, I agree expansion of those programs would be great. Trouble is, that puts a newly credentialed doctor who just came off 4 plus years of lowpaid work (intern, residency) and puts them right in another few years of low paid work. This is when people want to start families, etc. They are 35-40 years old before they then join a practice, and start to make any money to pay off student loans. Let alone buy the house, etc. That's why those programs are not popular with doctors.

I would rather have insurance costs lowered so more Americans can be insured, pay for their own insurance, all our costs go down for insurance because the pools are bigger, they start getting better healthcare for preventive care so everyone gets healthier, which brings all our costs down.

Rather than leaving them uninsured and depending upon others for charity.

Edit: Dell, have you heard what's happened in Arizona? Real death panels. Governor Jan Brewer has taken money away from anybody on the state medicaid that needs a transplant, to save money in the overall state budget. Two people have died already.

One person's operation was canceled the morning they were being wheeled into a surgery suite to get a new liver - a friend had died and given them the liver, but that was the morning Jan Brewer cancelled the funding. That person never got that liver.

Other state legislators are furious, and have come up with other ways to keep that program funded but cut the funding from non-life-threatening portions of the state budget, but Jan Brewer refuses to address it.

What do you think of that, Dell? When withholding money kills real people with real families? And they are not "freeloaders" on the state.

[Nascar1966]

Originally Posted by Riot

Those people are getting healthcare now, but only emergency - they are tying up emergency rooms and trauma centers for diabetes blood checks and colds/flu, sprains, etc!

Get them insurance so they get preventive care (lowering all our healthcare costs, because we pay for them in the ER), get them out of the ER and hospitals, and get them into a regular doctor's office where they belong.



The government does that now - provides educational subsidies for doctors, they replay loans with service. The army does it, too. Ever see the show Northern Exposure? Yes, I agree expansion of those programs would be great. Trouble is, that puts a newly credentialed doctor who just came off 4 plus years of lowpaid work (intern, residency) and puts them right in another few years of low paid work. This is when people want to start families, etc. They are 35-40 years old before they then join a practice, and start to make any money to pay off student loans. Let alone buy the house, etc. That's why those programs are not popular with doctors.

I would rather have insurance costs lowered so more Americans can be insured, pay for their own insurance, all our costs go down for insurance because the pools are bigger, they start getting better healthcare for preventive care so everyone gets healthier, which brings all our costs down.

Rather than leaving them uninsured and depending upon others for charity.

If a person is going to the ER for a diabetes blood check, that is a waste of the ER. I do my own checks. They are very easy to do and all it is a little pinch.