St. Trinians out till at least November

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by CSC

Alot of work when a simple answer of you asserting that if Rosario rode, St. Trinians she would have beaten Zenyatta. I think this is what you are trying to infer. Sorry you are losing a grasp on reality when Zenyatta is concerned. If that was as bad ride as you assert, there are many more to choose from rather than nitpicking a winning ride as this one was or atleast 99% of the time it is.

The work shows it all though, there is really not debate here.

[CSC]

I'll say this, no one can post pictures or quizzes like him, I really appreciate the effort on his part, but I seriously doubt anyone in the biz would read his post and still blame Garcia for losing the race to Zenyatta, or atleast with a straight face.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

The work shows it all though, there is really not debate here.

A replay would be far better, don't you think?

[CSC]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-fJpTGaPH8

A better view, now if Doug wants to assert that St. Trinians would have been better off to follow 60-1 shot Will O Way or the inferior Zardana to save ground AND lose 1st run (a point he made was to her advantage) on Zenyatta. Then I concede, he has a point, however no sane handicapper watching the replay would advise a jockey to follow a 60-1 shot or a fading Zardana. The fact is St Trinians was in a position to win, a tribute to her Jockey and was full of run at the wire running 11 and change the final 1/8th, to blame the rider is simply silly and a grasp IMO while not recognizing a horse that was able to outfinish her.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by CSC

I'll say this, no one can post pictures or quizzes like him, I really appreciate the effort on his part, but I seriously doubt anyone in the biz would read his post and still blame Garcia for losing the race to Zenyatta, or atleast with a straight face.

You'd be WRONG. I didn't bother reading the specific of DrugS' argument, I'm sure it's full of TRIVIALITIES, in other words, THE OBVIOUS. And it probably took him a month to see what others did after a single viewing of the race. However, that GARCIA moved too soon is OBVIOUS (anything else is fluff). Not only did he lose the race by doing so but he also put his horse under undue/excessive pressure and, effectively, broke her down (for the time being).

Then again, you still think that Interactif is better than PoP.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

DOUG IS A LEGEND, ITS STUFF LIKE THIS THAT DREAMS ARE MADE OF.
My dream of teaming up with Doug for the best gay sex ever is getting close to being a reality. JoeynDoug between the Sheets.

FTFY

[Indian Charlie]

Good one Sighty!

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by CSC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-fJpTGaPH8

A better view, now if Doug wants to assert that St. Trinians would have been better off to follow 60-1 shot Will O Way or the inferior Zardana to save ground AND lose 1st run (a point he made was to her advantage) on Zenyatta. Then I concede, he has a point, however no sane handicapper watching the replay would advise a jockey to follow a 60-1 shot or a fading Zardana. The fact is St Trinians was in a position to win, a tribute to her Jockey and was full of run at the wire running 11 and change the final 1/8th, to blame the rider is simply silly and a grasp IMO while not recognizing a horse that was able to outfinish her.

You need to be locked in a room and forced to watch ten thousand races.

The final margin was just a head. You make it sound like Zenyatta won by 3

Something as simple as a clean break by St. Trinians would have made the difference. Saving some ground into the 1st turn would have also helped.

Rosario's ROI is what it is because he rarely loses when he's on the horse who runs the better race .. and he steals a few wins here and there in races where he's not on the best horse.

Garcia is just your average top circuit jockey. Other than the very poor start and going 5 wide on the 1st turn while starting from post 2 - and getting hung up 4 to 5 wide the entire way around the far turn ... he did absolutely nothing wrong. Picture perfect.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

You'd be WRONG. I didn't bother reading the specific of DrugS' argument, I'm sure it's full of TRIVIALITIES, in other words, THE OBVIOUS. And it probably took him a month to see what others did after a single viewing of the race. However, that GARCIA moved too soon is OBVIOUS (anything else is fluff). Not only did he lose the race by doing so but he also put his horse under undue/excessive pressure and, effectively, broke her down (for the time being).

Then again, you still think that Interactif is better than PoP.

A horse running the final 1/8th under in 11 and change is one that was subjected to a premature move? Maybe horses are not as good as they once were, but don't quit your day job and sell cars. That one is a reach of major proportions.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

You need to be locked in a room and forced to watch ten thousand races.

The final margin was just a head. You make it sound like Zenyatta won by 3

Something as simple as a clean break by St. Trinians would have made the difference. Saving some ground into the 1st turn would have also helped.

Rosario's ROI is what it is because he rarely loses when he's on the horse who runs the better race .. and he steals a few wins here and there in races where he's not on the best horse.

Garcia is just your average top circuit jockey. Other than the very poor start and going 5 wide on the 1st turn while starting from post 2 - and getting hung up 4 to 5 wide the entire way around the far turn ... he did absolutely nothing wrong. Picture perfect.

Going 'maybe' 4 wide into the 1st turn did not cost her the race, you cannot be saying this with a straight face, furthermore didn't Zenyatta break a little tardy last year in the BC Classic? One is used as an excuse, the other is not. Be consistent atleast, there are some that actually hang on every word you say here afterall.

[Danzig]

how would a tardy break at all hinder zenyatta? i think the break would have differing affects when you consider a horses running style. it never seemed to hurt evening attire, who could never be accused of being a good breaker. but a bad break was considered to have been very costly to war emblem in the belmont, just to use as an example.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Danzig

how would a tardy break at all hinder zenyatta? i think the break would have differing affects when you consider a horses running style. it never seemed to hurt evening attire, who could never be accused of being a good breaker. but a bad break was considered to have been very costly to war emblem in the belmont, just to use as an example.

Ask I DrugS, it seemed to hinder a closer like St. Trinians. I know both are not identical as Z is a deeper closer, but it isn't like ST is the reincarnation of War Emblem either.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by CSC

Going 'maybe' 4 wide into the 1st turn did not cost her the race, you cannot be saying this with a straight face, furthermore didn't Zenyatta break a little tardy last year in the BC Classic? One is used as an excuse, the other is not. Be consistent atleast, there are some that actually hang on every word you say here afterall.

Zenyatta is a big lumbering closer who often breaks a bit tardy. That's different from breaking into the side of the gate and stumbling.

As for the difference between racing on the rail through the 1st turn and racing 4 wide the entire way around the 1st turn .... here's the Hollywood Gold Cup. Watch where Awesome Gem is in the first turn - and watch where Rail Trip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B1DnIXRok4

But hey, the Hollywood Gold Cup only proves that Bejarano rode a perfect race on Rail Trip... after all, he had him "in a position to win" and that is "a tribute to the jockey"

[Danzig]

i know she's no war emblem, i said it was an example. i guess i will have to go elsewhere for help, you seem to be more interested in polemics than instruction anyway.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by CSC

A horse running the final 1/8th under in 11 and change is one that was subjected to a premature move? Maybe horses are not as good as they once were, but don't quit your day job and sell cars. That one is a reach of major proportions.

Within the dynamics of the race, it was a PREMATURE move. Picking Summer Bird can carry you just so far, Ace. Do you ever stop and think how stupid some of the **** you write is for ANYONE with half a clue when it comes to tripping?

Obviously not.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

As for the difference between racing on the rail through the 1st turn and racing 4 wide the entire way around the 1st turn .... here's the Hollywood Gold Cup. Watch where Awesome Gem is in the first turn - and watch where Rail Trip.

Thanks for pointing out the banal. But you got this all wrong. If you go to CJ's site, you'll see that Rail Trip was very very vulnerable in the Gold Cup. He 'figured' to lose.

ha ha ha

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by CSC

a closer like St. Trinians.

St. Trinians has very good natural speed ... she was pressing the pace from about a neck back going 7fs in an alw sprint she won by 7 lengths in her 2nd start in America.

That's why she was supposed to be a big match-up problem for Zenyatta ... because, unlike a Life Is Sweet .. she could get early separation and a nice big cushion on Zenyatta .. and unlike an Anabaa's Creation, she can finish hard.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Zenyatta is a big lumbering closer who often breaks a bit tardy. That's different from breaking into the side of the gate and stumbling.

As for the difference between racing on the rail through the 1st turn and racing 4 wide the entire way around the 1st turn .... here's the Hollywood Gold Cup. Watch where Awesome Gem is in the first turn - and watch where Rail Trip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B1DnIXRok4

But hey, the Hollywood Gold Cup only proves that Bejarano rode a perfect race on Rail Trip... after all, he had him "in a position to win" and that is "a tribute to the jockey"

Rail Trip is overrated, I stated that many times here. Comparing his style to St. Trinians is bad, you know well they have opposing styles, regardless he still should be good enough to beat Awesome Gem, a horse that clunked up in last year's classic mind you. The problem here is if Garcia took a gamble and went towards the rail, and let's say the trip parted like the red sea for him, how is she going to outrun Zenyatta the final 1/8th to 1/4 mile, just how many horses have done that in their career, the only chance she had was to get the jump on her, pinch a break and hold her off. That's what she did and against another horse, 99/100 she would have won the race.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i know she's no war emblem, i said it was an example. i guess i will have to go elsewhere for help, you seem to be more interested in polemics than instruction anyway.

Eristic would suffice, I hate big words.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by CSC

Rail Trip is overrated, I stated that many times here. Comparing his style to St. Trinians is bad, you know well they have opposing styles

Missing the point award.