The Boss has passed.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Thats not what I said. Signing Lester long term now is a good business move but how does that have anything to do with the yankee obligations that I am referring to? How is Beckett's signing or Pedroia or Youkilis similar in any way to what the yanks gave Rivera, Posada, Pettite and Jeter? Yeah, I love the way the Sox did their players that got them a world series after 250 years. Then again, it was one title with that group so they really didn't owe them much. You do have to love the way Ramon was kicked to the curb. And Manny. And Damon. And Millar.

I didnt say 168 million and 213 million are the same. I'm glad you got into Horse training instead of teaching kids to reach. This is 2010 right? The Red Sox are second behind the Yanks with 168 million.

Are you serious? How is Beckett's signing a 4 year 68 million dollar deal or Youkulis signing a 4 year 41 million dollar deal or Pedroia signing a 6 year 40 million dollar deal any different than Posada signing a 4 year 52 million or Rivera signing a 3 year 45 million dollar deal or pettite signing a 1 year 11 million dollar deal? Jeters contract was signed in 2001. Seriously what is the difference? Because the yankees are older? You seriously think they would have signed them if they still werent producing?

And only someone clueless would say that the Red Sox didnt do the right thing after 2004 since they wound up winning again three years later. Pedro left as a FA, got 50 million from the Mets for 1 good season. Yeah bad move. Millar did play another year in Boston but as a 35 year old player with fading skills he left as a FA and continued to fade. Damon left as a FA a year after they won the WS to who else? The yankees overpaid to get him and the fact that the Yankees "kicked him to the curb" after last season shouldnt be lost on you either. Manny? Perhaps you forgot the stretch when he demanded a trade and decided not to play hard?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Are you serious? How is Beckett's signing a 4 year 68 million dollar deal or Youkulis signing a 4 year 41 million dollar deal or Pedroia signing a 6 year 40 million dollar deal any different than Posada signing a 4 year 52 million or Rivera signing a 3 year 45 million dollar deal or pettite signing a 1 year 11 million dollar deal? Jeters contract was signed in 2001. Seriously what is the difference? Because the yankees are older? You seriously think they would have signed them if they still werent producing?

And only someone clueless would say that the Red Sox didnt do the right thing after 2004 since they wound up winning again three years later. Pedro left as a FA, got 50 million from the Mets for 1 good season. Yeah bad move. Millar did play another year in Boston but as a 35 year old player with fading skills he left as a FA and continued to fade. Damon left as a FA a year after they won the WS to who else? The yankees overpaid to get him and the fact that the Yankees "kicked him to the curb" after last season shouldnt be lost on you either. Manny? Perhaps you forgot the stretch when he demanded a trade and decided not to play hard?

Again, you have your facts wrong. Damon was offered a contract. Boras chose to play chicken and ended up on the wrong end. Damon should blame Boras for not properly assessing the market, not the yanks.

Manny demanded to be traded after being shopped for 5 years after he did nothing but carry the offense to their only two titles since woodrow wilson. yeah, they treated him great. How about pedro? He was only one of the best pitchers in the last quarter century. They treated him really good too. Bronson Aroyo? Not a great pitcher but he did his part. How was he handled? Mike Lowell? Theo should be ashamed of himself.

But that really isn't the point I was making. The yankees are an older team. They are an older CHAMPIONSHIP team. The yanks chose to stay loyal to their core group. How else can you explain Posada's contract? 4 yrs 52 million for a 36 yr old catcher. Anyone with half a brain knows that was a gift. Mo getting 45 million? Yeah, there were a bunch of teams that were going to pay 15 million a year to a 38 year old closer. Jeter got that contract 10 years ago as a reward for winning four series.

If Boston were to keep this group together and they were to win a couple of titles, then their payroll later would be much bigger. No????? The fact is, they havent had the same success. Even so, if history tells us anything, they wouldnt pay those guys anyway. Heck, if history tells us anything, they won't be in any position to have to make those decisions.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Again, you have your facts wrong. Damon was offered a contract. Boras chose to play chicken and ended up on the wrong end. Damon should blame Boras for not properly assessing the market, not the yanks.

Manny demanded to be traded after being shopped for 5 years after he did nothing but carry the offense to their only two titles since woodrow wilson. yeah, they treated him great. How about pedro? He was only one of the best pitchers in the last quarter century. They treated him really good too. Bronson Aroyo? Not a great pitcher but he did his part. How was he handled? Mike Lowell? Theo should be ashamed of himself.

But that really isn't the point I was making. The yankees are an older team. They are an older CHAMPIONSHIP team. The yanks chose to stay loyal to their core group. How else can you explain Posada's contract? 4 yrs 52 million for a 36 yr old catcher. Anyone with half a brain knows that was a gift. Mo getting 45 million? Yeah, there were a bunch of teams that were going to pay 15 million a year to a 38 year old closer. Jeter got that contract 10 years ago as a reward for winning four series.

If Boston were to keep this group together and they were to win a couple of titles, then their payroll later would be much bigger. No????? The fact is, they havent had the same success. Even so, if history tells us anything, they wouldnt pay those guys anyway. Heck, if history tells us anything, they won't be in any position to have to make those decisions.

So where were the guys they were going to replace those players with?
Please tell me what catchers have been available that can hit like Posada still can? You seriously don't think that Mariano Rivera couldnt get 45 million on the open market 2 years ago??? Brad lidge got 37.5 for 3 years! Brad freakin Lidge! And that was a season removed from him having a 5.28 era.

Only someone who was clueless would infer that the Red Sox did the wrong thing by letting those players go. Yeah It would have been a good move to keep pedro and pay him 50 million and get a single good season out of him. And Millar really lit it up as a 37 year old in the NL. And for your info, lowell is making a lot of money to do nothing. The Red Sox didnt kick him in the hip, he got hurt. Oh poor manny, he was so mistreated in Boston. That 125 million they gave him was soooo wronggg. He pouted because they did not want to give him another long term deal for mega money when he was on the decline. They were 100% right in trading him as he dogged it and faked injuries and after one good 1/2 of a season has gone steadily down hill. Would you want to be paying him 25 million a year for the next 2 years? And yes the red sox owed a great deal of gratitude to Bronson Arroyo and that 24-19 record and 4.19 era over 2 1/2 years. Trading him to a team to the NL was a terrible thing for his career. He has only been able to bank $33 million in 5 years in Cincy as a mediocre pitcher.

And the yankees didnt re-sign Damon or matsui because they wanted them to leave. Damon was offered a substandard contract with a signifigant cut in pay which was less than mike cameron and Bobby Abreau signed for. They squeezed him out. They did the same thing to Torre.

And Boston won the championship once again 3 years later (2007) after letting all those fading pieces go which makes your statement that they havent found success since entirely wrong.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

So where were the guys they were going to replace those players with?
Please tell me what catchers have been available that can hit like Posada still can? You seriously don't think that Mariano Rivera couldnt get 45 million on the open market 2 years ago??? Brad lidge got 37.5 for 3 years! Brad freakin Lidge! And that was a season removed from him having a 5.28 era.

Only someone who was clueless would infer that the Red Sox did the wrong thing by letting those players go. Yeah It would have been a good move to keep pedro and pay him 50 million and get a single good season out of him. And Millar really lit it up as a 37 year old in the NL. And for your info, lowell is making a lot of money to do nothing. The Red Sox didnt kick him in the hip, he got hurt. Oh poor manny, he was so mistreated in Boston. That 125 million they gave him was soooo wronggg. He pouted because they did not want to give him another long term deal for mega money when he was on the decline. They were 100% right in trading him as he dogged it and faked injuries and after one good 1/2 of a season has gone steadily down hill. Would you want to be paying him 25 million a year for the next 2 years? And yes the red sox owed a great deal of gratitude to Bronson Arroyo and that 24-19 record and 4.19 era over 2 1/2 years. Trading him to a team to the NL was a terrible thing for his career. He has only been able to bank $33 million in 5 years in Cincy as a mediocre pitcher.

And the yankees didnt re-sign Damon or matsui because they wanted them to leave. Damon was offered a substandard contract with a signifigant cut in pay which was less than mike cameron and Bobby Abreau signed for. They squeezed him out. They did the same thing to Torre.

And Boston won the championship once again 3 years later (2007) after letting all those fading pieces go which makes your statement that they havent found success since entirely wrong.

but w/o Manny they haven't won squat chuck

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by gales0678

but w/o Manny they haven't won squat chuck

They have won more titles than the yankees have this decade and the yankees never ever win without outspending everyone.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They have won more titles than the yankees have this decade and the yankees never ever win without outspending everyone.

2-2 chuck ,but , you guys ain't winning squat w/o manny , he was a man among boys

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by gales0678

2-2 chuck ,but , you guys ain't winning squat w/o manny , he was a man among boys

First of all, I am not a Red Sox fan except when they play the yankees. And that statement says all you need to know. I guess they should just cease operations up there. And 2000 was last decade.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

They have won more titles than the yankees have this decade and the yankees never ever win without outspending everyone.

This is also wrong. You are a knowledgable guy but you keep allowing me to find inaccuracies.

In 1998, the Baltimore orioles had the highest payroll in baseball with 70 million, 8 million more than the bombers who went on that year to win the world series.

Sorry Charlie.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

This is also wrong. You are a knowledgable guy but you keep allowing me to find inaccuracies.

In 1998, the Baltimore orioles had the highest payroll in baseball with 70 million, 8 million more than the bombers who went on that year to win the world series.

Sorry Charlie.

It was $74.1 million against $73.9 million, so yeah, technically the Yanks didn't outspend everybody, close enough though.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

This is also wrong. You are a knowledgable guy but you keep allowing me to find inaccuracies.

In 1998, the Baltimore orioles had the highest payroll in baseball with 70 million, 8 million more than the bombers who went on that year to win the world series.

Sorry Charlie.

Well my proof readers just havent been keeping up. I figure that gales is allowed literary license (or to just make things up like the great umpire conspiricy) then I can generalize. That and the "wooden leg" thread have me distracted.