Class C Positive Reported on Oaks Day

[King Glorious]

I spoke incorrectly when I said it wasn't intentional. You guys are correct in pointing out how it's the same guy getting caught multiple times on days when nobody else is getting caught. So it's obvious that he pushes the envelope. I should have said that I don't feel like he's trying to cheat but that he's trying to walk right up to the line and occasionally, he steps over it. What it makes me think of is how many times he comes right up to the line, within inches (or picograms) of crossing it but gets away with it and ends up winning a major race. His successes keep owners sending their horses to him. I mean just look at Maximum Security, for example. They weren't interested in going to someone with a reputation for being clean. They wanted one that wouldn't get caught. His record will keep them coming and the risks are worth the reward when the penalties are so light. Honestly, why should he stop doing what he's doing?

You guys ask and answer your own questions. He obviously doesn't care but I wouldn't say he's negligent because that implies he's not aware. I think he's completely aware and complicit.

[Dahoss]

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...ffert-trainee/

Poor guy just can’t catch a break.

When is enough...enough?

[moses]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...ffert-trainee/

Poor guy just can’t catch a break.

When is enough...enough?

With this many positive drugs tests reported, there is only one logical conclusion — there is a vast conspiracy to bring him down due to his incredible success.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...ffert-trainee/

Poor guy just can’t catch a break.

When is enough...enough?

Lol. Yeah, I have nothing.

[parsixfarms]

I thought the Breeders Cup previously adopted a rule that a trainer found to have committed certain medication violations during a calendar year could not compete at the event. At this point, wouldn’t everyone be better served if Baffert and his horses were not allowed to participate in this year’s event?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

I thought the Breeders Cup previously adopted a rule that a trainer found to have committed certain medication violations during a calendar year could not compete at the event. At this point, wouldn’t everyone be better served if Baffert and his horses were not allowed to participate in this year’s event?

I don't think anyone would be better served. The quality of the races would suffer because he's got some good horses. I understand the thinking and I won't even try to defend Baffert but if I'm being honest, I don't really care about the positive tests and I don't think many fans do either. Judging by the light penalties and allowing it to keep happening, I don't think the people that run the sport really care either. Baffert is the face of the sport like it or not and not having the star person there would not help the sport at all I don't think.

[moses]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I don't think anyone would be better served. The quality of the races would suffer because he's got some good horses. I understand the thinking and I won't even try to defend Baffert but if I'm being honest, I don't really care about the positive tests and I don't think many fans do either. Judging by the light penalties and allowing it to keep happening, I don't think the people that run the sport really care either. Baffert is the face of the sport like it or not and not having the star person there would not help the sport at all I don't think.

I don't see how you can postulate that "many fans" don't care about the positive tests. Most gamblers that I know are extremely frustrated at trying to handicap races while also factoring in potential drug cheats. Most casual fans that I know are absolutely appalled at the stuff that came out about Servis/Navarro.

You may be right that not enough people care, or perhaps the right people don't care...but I'm not sure why Baffert's presence is a necessity. There are plenty of big race days at NYRA or Gulfstream or Churchill/Keeneland that have no Baffert horses or very few.

Do Baffert's horses make the races more competitive? Maybe. I don't know. Personally, I think his horses are almost always overbet and if they win provide very little value. I guess it can be good if you're against one of his overbet horses and can beat them.

[goodcopy]

Originally Posted by moses

I don't see how you can postulate that "many fans" don't care about the positive tests. Most gamblers that I know are extremely frustrated at trying to handicap races while also factoring in potential drug cheats. Most casual fans that I know are absolutely appalled at the stuff that came out about Servis/Navarro.

You may be right that not enough people care, or perhaps the right people don't care...but I'm not sure why Baffert's presence is a necessity. There are plenty of big race days at NYRA or Gulfstream or Churchill/Keeneland that have no Baffert horses or very few.

Do Baffert's horses make the races more competitive? Maybe. I don't know. Personally, I think his horses are almost always overbet and if they win provide very little value. I guess it can be good if you're against one of his overbet horses and can beat them.

Bobby B is a great trainer and stable manager but when it comes down to why he is being treated different than other good trainers all comes down to Baffert's money interest and owners

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by moses

I don't see how you can postulate that "many fans" don't care about the positive tests. Most gamblers that I know are extremely frustrated at trying to handicap races while also factoring in potential drug cheats. Most casual fans that I know are absolutely appalled at the stuff that came out about Servis/Navarro.

You may be right that not enough people care, or perhaps the right people don't care...but I'm not sure why Baffert's presence is a necessity. There are plenty of big race days at NYRA or Gulfstream or Churchill/Keeneland that have no Baffert horses or very few.

Do Baffert's horses make the races more competitive? Maybe. I don't know. Personally, I think his horses are almost always overbet and if they win provide very little value. I guess it can be good if you're against one of his overbet horses and can beat them.

Different sport but in baseball, the Astros manager that was fired and suspended for a year because of cheating, was hired immediately after his suspension was lifted. Alex Rodriguez was suspended for drug use and now he’s ESPN’s lead baseball analyst. Barry Bonds and Mark McGwire were hired as coaches by teams. Josh Gordon in football gets chance after chance. Antonio Brown has pending assault charges against him and he just got signed. The Cowboys have a couple of guys that have suspended for drugs. There’s a coach who was fined and suspended for putting a bounty out on opposing players and paid bonuses to his guys if they could hurt them and he’s still working.

I point these out as examples that fans don’t really care. As long as they are entertained, that’s all they care about. Barry Bonds could stand at home plate, call time out, stick a needle in his arm right there.....I just want to see a 600 foot home run.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

I thought the Breeders Cup previously adopted a rule that a trainer found to have committed certain medication violations during a calendar year could not compete at the event.

There is a "Convicted Trainers Rule" but the relevant violation(s) has to be final (i.e., not still on appeal).

In addition, the violation has to be of a certain severity (Class 1A or B, Class 2A). I don't think any of these recent Baffert positives qualify (lidocaine is Class 2B).

See page 92:

https://members.breederscup.com/docu...nships/HIG.PDF