American Pharoah...

10 pnt move up · #1 05-04-2015, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

So American Pharoah, who we were told has three or four gears, and can run as fast as need be to win ( essentially ) any race, needed 32 stings of the whip to run ( effectively ) the same race he ran in Arkansas?

American Pharoah got a dream trip to win the Derby by three quarters of a length over a horse that didn't change leads in the stretch. The pre-race BS about this horse was completely exposed.

Will this horse get Orb like hype in the next two weeks?

They seem similar to me in ways.

Indian Charlie · #2 05-04-2015, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Will this horse get Orb like hype in the next two weeks?

They seem similar to me in ways.

Comparing Orb to AP is ridiculous.

ninetoone · #3 05-04-2015, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Comparing AP to Seattle Slew is ridiculous.

FTFY

MaTH716 · #4 05-04-2015, 12:41 PM

I find it amazing that Espinoza worked out a trip from the 18 hole, where he was able to stay wide and not take any dirt to the face. That 5 trips in a row where he's been clear and clean.

pointman · #5 05-04-2015, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaTH716

I find it amazing that Espinoza worked out a trip from the 18 hole, where he was able to stay wide and not take any dirt to the face. That 5 trips in a row where he's been clear and clean.

He has put in some terrific rides in the TC races and is almost certain to be over bet in next year's Derby like Borel has been.

MaTH716 · #6 05-04-2015, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pointman

He has put in some terrific rides in the TC races and is almost certain to be over bet in next year's Derby like Borel has been.

The only thing is Nick, he's usually riding a Baffert rocket that's taking money anyway.

10 pnt move up · #7 05-04-2015, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Comparing Orb to AP is ridiculous.

Why?

Indian Charlie · #8 05-04-2015, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Why?

A better question is how you can compare Orb to AP.

What possible similarities do they have besides winning the Derby?

JJP · #9 05-04-2015, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

A better question is how you can compare Orb to AP.

What possible similarities do they have besides winning the Derby?

The hype, for one thing. After the Derby, the public and media both talked as if the Triple Crown was a foregone conclusion. What price did Orb go off at in Baltimore, 3-5?

I wonder if the rioters will riot outside Pimlico.

Indian Charlie · #10 05-04-2015, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJP

The hype, for one thing. After the Derby, the public and media both talked as if the Triple Crown was a foregone conclusion. What price did Orb go off at in Baltimore, 3-5?

I wonder if the rioters will riot outside Pimlico.

Nobody with any functioning gray matter thought he was going to win the Triple Crown. In fact, most people on here seemed to think his Derby win would be his last major win.

freddymo · #11 05-04-2015, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Nobody with any functioning gray matter thought he was going to win the Triple Crown. In fact, most people on here seemed to think his Derby win would be his last major win.

I think he wins TC I think CJ's fig is real not BSF. I was sure Big Brown would have won TC as well and Smarty Jones to boot so what do I know

JJP · #12 05-04-2015, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

Nobody with any functioning gray matter thought he was going to win the Triple Crown. In fact, most people on here seemed to think his Derby win would be his last major win.

I certainly didn't, and maybe you didn't either. But plenty of somebodies did, betting Orb down to 3-5 in the Preakness. The media certainly bought the hype hook, line & sinker.

Danzig · #13 05-04-2015, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJP

The hype, for one thing. After the Derby, the public and media both talked as if the Triple Crown was a foregone conclusion. What price did Orb go off at in Baltimore, 3-5?

I wonder if the rioters will riot outside Pimlico.

no more curfew. no riots or protests since charges brought vs the police.

10 pnt move up · #14 05-04-2015, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

A better question is how you can compare Orb to AP.

What possible similarities do they have besides winning the Derby?

Name trainer?

Favorite, very well regarded coming into the Derby and delivered?

Won in impressive fashion?

Had cake trips that hindered several in the field?

Will be 3/5 in their next start when they probably dont deserve to be any thing better than 7/5?

Just saying, nothing in common at all.

freddymo · #15 05-04-2015, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Name trainer?
Who isnt a name trainer in the Derby?

Favorite, very well regarded coming into the Derby and delivered?
Orb didnt have NEAR the hype AP did nor should he have

Won in impressive fashion?
Orb won a staggerfest after suicidal early pace

Had cake trips that hindered several in the field?
AP made his trip Orb inherited his hardily comparable

Will be 3/5 in their next start when they probably dont deserve to be any thing better than 7/5?
Depends who shows up

Just saying, nothing in common at all.

Just saying

10 pnt move up · #16 05-04-2015, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freddymo

Just saying

Your equating Baffert/Shug to say Motion? ok

Orb had TONS of hype into the Derby Freddy.

The beyers are only a couple points different, one had a fast pace, one had a very moderate pace.

He is going to be 3/5.

We can check back after the race, he is a horrible bet at his odds of winning and they are not 3/5.

Indian Charlie · #17 05-04-2015, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 pnt move up

Name trainer?

Favorite, very well regarded coming into the Derby and delivered?

Won in impressive fashion?

Had cake trips that hindered several in the field?

Will be 3/5 in their next start when they probably dont deserve to be any thing better than 7/5?

Just saying, nothing in common at all.

You also left off that they both breathe oxygen, eat grassy stuff, poop, pee, drink water, have four legs, at least partial tails, have two eyes, etc..

I stand corrected.

blackthroatedwind · #18 05-04-2015, 05:16 PM

You have to base your analysis on what you saw...not what you wish you saw. What we saw was a horse getting a very good trip, and being ridden very hard, that proved best. Hey, there's no shame in that...but he ran his race, handled the track, etc. He's a very good horse. He's not a super horse...at least not yet.

He's also a horse that missed the biggest 2YO race of the year, in his back yard, and was then off for five months. He has returned to run three races of 3 7/16 miles in distance in seven weeks time...and needs to run another 2 11/16 miles worth of races over the next five weeks. That's 5 races and over 6 miles in distance in just 12 weeks. I surely wish the connections the best of luck, and certainly hope they win in two weeks, but I'm also a betting man....and there is NO way I would bet on American Pharoah winning the Triple Crown at any kind of short price.