SUN: Racing's media makeover paying off

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by DerbyCat

Well, I guess I'm not the typical DT chick, I buy the form regularly from the local smoke shop, I take hundreds with me to the track (lost $250 Sunday) and I fire with both fists at P3's and P4's. I love this game but if I didn't have disposable income I could never afford it. I also collect racing art and other memorabilia, donate to rescue groups and listen to Byk's radio show But I know I am the rare female fan.

And that is the key here - male or female, it more matters how much disposable income you can lose if gambling on the races is something you enjoy. Would I love to fire away with a couple thousand for the Breeder's Cup? Hell yeah.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Sightseek

And that is the key here - male or female, it more matters how much disposable income you can lose if gambling on the races is something you enjoy. Would I love to fire away with a couple thousand for the Breeder's Cup? Hell yeah.

And the thing is, you will be able to in the not too distant future as will many other women and minorities.

You are a single, independent (i always spell that wrong) woman in your thirties on the cusp of your prime earning years. Flashback 30 years ago-how many of us were there? Scav- do you want to bet there are a LOT more today? and that being the case...

Just go to an OTB and count the number of women and men.

Then come back here and keep kidding yourself.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Just go to an OTB and count the number of women and men.

Then come back here and keep kidding yourself.

But thats the point coach isnt it? I love racing. I will sit here online with you fools all day and night long and I will bet on youbet. But go to an OTB?

There is a place in Manhattan called the Playwright. I'm sure the NY contingent knows about it. Its not a bad place. But really...its kind of gross. Most OTB's seem seedy. Im sure there are exceptions but most I have encountered are disgusting looking places.

Go to Charlestown on a saturday night. Yes, charlestown West Virginia. The dining room is PACKED and anyone who has been there will say that it is easily 50% female (most likely over 50%). They are there for the racing and the gambling. Sure, its not Saratoga, but at the same time its suitable and you aren't sitting around a bunch of scuzzy guys yelling obscentities at a tv.

As the product becomes more female friendly, you will see an increase in female fans. Is it not fair to say that VENUE is a huge part of the product?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

But thats the point coach isnt it? I love racing. I will sit here online with you fools all day and night long and I will bet on youbet. But go to an OTB?

There is a place in Manhattan called the Playwright. I'm sure the NY contingent knows about it. Its not a bad place. But really...its kind of gross. Most OTB's seem seedy. Im sure there are exceptions but most I have encountered are disgusting looking places.

Go to Charlestown on a saturday night. Yes, charlestown West Virginia. The dining room is PACKED and anyone who has been there will say that it is easily 50% female (most likely over 50%). They are there for the racing and the gambling. Sure, its not Saratoga, but at the same time its suitable and you aren't sitting around a bunch of scuzzy guys yelling obscentities at a tv.

As the product becomes more female friendly, you will see an increase in female fans. Is it not fair to say that VENUE is a huge part of the product?

Totally agree.

On an aside, in the last few months, I've taken my first trips to Charlestown and Penn and have been pleasantly surprised.

Seedy as in the men there? Then that problem will never change.

The OTB in downtown Indy and the one in Evansville are not seedy facilities...just full of seedy people.

And live racing is a different ballgame. Most of the people in the clubhouse are couples and the men tend to bet much more while the women bet $2 and would rather spend two hours playing with their food.

And really if you're just going to bet $1 exactas and $2 win bets do it with 15 minutes left to post, not 1 minute and then take 2 god damn minutes to get the bet in.

So what I'm saying is women, for the most part, hurt the game more than help it.

[pmacdaddy]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

But thats the point coach isnt it? I love racing. I will sit here online with you fools all day and night long and I will bet on youbet. But go to an OTB?

There is a place in Manhattan called the Playwright. I'm sure the NY contingent knows about it. Its not a bad place. But really...its kind of gross. Most OTB's seem seedy. Im sure there are exceptions but most I have encountered are disgusting looking places.

The Playwright....Gross?!?!.....

Although, I do also enjoy Clancy's when in Saratoga

The more I think about it...

trying to get women to the track could be the final nail in the coffin for this sport.

When I watch Hollywood Friday Night Racing brought to you by TVG's Daily Double Whorefest Show... I realize that bringing young sluts to the track can only result in unwanted pregnancies and potential marriages which will more than likely take real gamblers (men) away from the game.

Now that they have the added responsibility of child support they won't have the disposable income to bet. All the $2 broads in the world couldn't make up for losing a whale.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

The more I think about it...

trying to get women to the track could be the final nail in the coffin for this sport.

When I watch Hollywood Friday Night Racing brought to you by TVG's Daily Double Whorefest Show... I realize that bringing young sluts to the track can only result in unwanted pregnancies and potential marriages which will more than likely take real gamblers (men) away from the game.

Now that they have the added responsibility of child support they won't have the disposable income to bet. All the $2 broads in the world couldn't make up for losing a whale.

a lot of people go to Keeneland, Del Mar, Saratoga, etc.. FOR the women! its always good for women, men, kids, or anyone to go to the track!

[Antitrust32]

I used to love going to the OTB in high school. Eventhough I was MAYBE one of 3 girls.. and the other 2 girls were working as tellers. But then again I've never felt uncomfortable being the only girl in a group of hundreds of old men.

its pointless to argue that women even bet nearly the amount men bet, cause its simply not true.

If an man and a woman both had the same amount of disposible income, who do you think would be more likely to spend it on gambling. Men are the easy 1-20 favorites there.

its it worth spending lots in marketing to get young women involved? or would it be more worth while to spend that money getting young men involved?

thats an easy answer for me if I'm a marketing director. Though horse racing doesnt seem to market to ANYONE, which is the main problem.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by pmacdaddy

Although, I do also enjoy Clancy's when in Saratoga

Don't go there with shorts on.

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

Don't go there with shorts on.

I laughed..

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

As the product becomes more female friendly, you will see an increase in female fans. Is it not fair to say that VENUE is a huge part of the product?

I keep wondering about what sport everyone is refering to? Are we talking about the same one? You know the one where the growth is almost exclusively in account wagering?


The product is gambling. It is neither male or female friendly. The KY Derby and Oaks are not the product nor are the tv ratings for those anything but a sidebar. Horseracing does NOT derive any signifigant revenue from TV unilke other sports which derive the vast majority of their revenue from TV. What Bravo or ABC or NBC focuses on during its telecasts dont change the fact that we need people betting into the pools on days other than Derby days.

It is good news that ratings are up. However no one should think that the increase in ratings is "because of" something done right or that an increase in ratings for a singular event (Derby) translates into "we are going into the right direction with our new focus". All it means was the ratings were up for a 2 hour period one day of the year.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I keep wondering about what sport everyone is refering to? Are we talking about the same one? You know the one where the growth is almost exclusively in account wagering?


The product is gambling. It is neither male or female friendly. The KY Derby and Oaks are not the product nor are the tv ratings for those anything but a sidebar. Horseracing does NOT derive any signifigant revenue from TV unilke other sports which derive the vast majority of their revenue from TV. What Bravo or ABC or NBC focuses on during its telecasts dont change the fact that we need people betting into the pools on days other than Derby days.

It is good news that ratings are up. However no one should think that the increase in ratings is "because of" something done right or that an increase in ratings for a singular event (Derby) translates into "we are going into the right direction with our new focus". All it means was the ratings were up for a 2 hour period one day of the year.

I agree with pretty much everything you say here. The model has to change. Is it possible that racing could one day thrive where handle is just a portion of the revenue as opposed to nearly all of it? And if it can't, we need to look into new ways to generate handle.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

I agree with pretty much everything you say here. The model has to change. Is it possible that racing could one day thrive where handle is just a portion of the revenue as opposed to nearly all of it? And if it can't, we need to look into new ways to generate handle.

How exactly could it change? What other revenue sources could there be? TV revenue? That is a pipedream.

Your last sentence is the key. No doubt that is the best way for the game to survive and thrive. Betfair is a perfect example yet virtually no one is pushing for it within the game and there really hasnt been a groundswell from the people who put the money through the windows either. And the depressing part is that not only would incorporating Betfair style gambling be difficult in determining how to split the income but will almost assuredly be opposed by politicians.

While I do understand that there is a certain percentage of woman that gamble and follow horseracing I simply dont believe that there is some huge, secret group of women that are waiting to be coaxed into going to the track.

Maybe it could work if the ladies could bet on horses in a race and have a tiered list of items they could win instead of money. Say like a vajazzle for the favorite or a coach purse for the longest shot on the board. ANd if they play exotics they could win big prizes like a pink miata for the chalk exacta or a weeks vacation to Chicago and tickets to Oprah.

[Antitrust32]

maybe if tracks could figure out.. and I have no idea for the life of me how the would.. a way to create a JACKPOT in horse racing.

It could move slot players (lots of women & men) to play horse racing. Kind of like what Oaklawn did, but make it better and more interesting. Slot players LOVE the jackpot and dont like having to study bets.

Maybe have more gray horse days. Women love em some gray horsies.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Coach Pants

Maybe have more gray horse days. Women love em some gray horsies.

do you have any serious idea's? Horse racing does an absolutely terrible job marketing itself. Byk seems like the only one out there marketing for racing. There has to be some suggestions people can come up with that would help..