Street Sense Number

[randallscott35]

Steve, a 7 debut is good. A "0" debut by Discreet last year is the freakish fast kind.

Too much development, too early for Street I'm afraid. We'll see.


As for the wraps comments before on Nafzger. He absolutely runs most of his horses in wraps all the time, as does Wilkes by the way. The difference here is that he didn't always do that with Street Sense. Could be something, might be nothing. But I've seen enough of the wraps on angle as a warning sign in my life to be skeptical. Bluegrass Cat anyone?

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by randallscott35

As for the wraps comments before on Nafzger. He absolutely runs most of his horses in wraps all the time, as does Wilkes by the way. The difference here is that he didn't always do that with Street Sense. Could be something, might be nothing.

R.I.,

Go back in the thread.. The Cannon Shell guy, who seems to know a thing or two about Churchill doin's, says that Street Sense had a cut on his leg that Nafzger wanted covered for logical reasons...

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by Kasept

R.I.,

Go back in the thread.. The Cannon Shell guy, who seems to know a thing or two about Churchill doin's, says that Street Sense had a cut on his leg that Nafzger wanted covered for logical reasons...

As I said Steve, "could be nothing." If it was a cut, I guess it was nothing. Its something I pointed out in my original post which is something handicappers don't pay enough attention to in general.

The issue remains the number that was run and when it was run. He better be special to overcome that. Whether he is off 6 months or a year. I've seen enough of this to know he's up against it regardless of who his trainer is.

Time will tell.

[Cajungator26]

Guys, if I could chime in for a second...

Polo wraps do not provide the kind of support necessary to prevent an actual soft tissue injury. They are primarily used as protection from exterior damage (as in bumps, bangs, etc from other horses.) In order for a polo wrap to provide the kind of necessary support everyone is talking about here, it would have to be put on extremely tight and that kind of pressure can cause bandage bows (which is a bigger risk.) Just my opinion...

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Actually, polo wraps protect a horse from splints, bucked shins, windpuffs, bruises...etc. Splints, windpuffs, and bucked shins cause temporary lameness, but can be seen as a blemish for the rest of a horse's life. Also, if wrapped right, polo wraps do provide support when they are hooked just behind the fetlock joint. They provide support of the flexor tendons. Also, no extremely good horseman will ever wrap the wraps tight enough as to bow a tendon. Every great hunter/jumper trainer and dressage trainer that I have ever seen uses them. I've wrapped hundreds of horses, and have never had one bow a tendon yet, and I'm not even worried about it because I know how to wrap...

Here is a list of all the soft tissue injuries that wraps may prevent...
http://www.umm.edu/orthopaedics/soft.htm

Also, it has come to my attention from a very knowledgable race tracker that wraps may actually slow down a horse a little bit, and it would make sense because the horse does not have quite as much flexibility in their fetlock joint. There is some slight tension and resistence at the joint from the wraps. Alot of the major trainers of the sport believe this (or so I've been told...but my source is reliable). Of course, I would never ever ever let that affect the way I bet a race, or me ever using wraps on my horses.

Also, a lot of racehorse trainers use wraps as a means of preventing burns on the bottom of a horse's fetlock joint when they are running in a race. This is especially true for horses who are a little coon footed (long in the pasterns), because these horses fetlock joints will touch the ground while they are running.

Okay, Im done now.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Actually, polo wraps protect a horse from splints, bucked shins, windpuffs, bruises...etc. Splints, windpuffs, and bucked shins cause temporary lameness, but can be seen as a blemish for the rest of a horse's life. Also, if wrapped right, polo wraps do provide support when they are hooked just behind the fetlock joint. They provide support of the flexor tendons. Also, no extremely good horseman will ever wrap the wraps tight enough as to bow a tendon. Every great hunter/jumper trainer and dressage trainer that I have ever seen uses them. I've wrapped hundreds of horses, and have never had one bow a tendon yet, and I'm not even worried about it because I know how to wrap...

Here is a list of all the soft tissue injuries that wraps may prevent...
http://www.umm.edu/orthopaedics/soft.htm

Also, it has come to my attention from a very knowledgable race tracker that wraps may actually slow down a horse a little bit, and it would make sense because the horse does not have quite as much flexibility in their fetlock joint. There is some slight tension and resistence at the joint from the wraps. Alot of the major trainers of the sport believe this (or so I've been told...but my source is reliable). Of course, I would never ever ever let that affect the way I bet a race, or me ever using wraps on my horses.

Also, a lot of racehorse trainers use wraps as a means of preventing burns on the bottom of a horse's fetlock joint when they are running in a race. This is especially true for horses who are a little coon footed (long in the pasterns), because these horses fetlock joints will touch the ground while they are running.

Okay, Im done now.

I disagree, Jessica. I've been wrapping horses since I was 6 years old, so yeah, I know how to wrap as well and I haven't ever caused a bowed tendon either. It CAN happen, though and that is the primary reason that smart horsemen will not wrap their horses with POLO wraps while trailering (bandage bows.) As you know, there are different types of boots and leg protection gear to use while riding and while I personally use polo wraps during routine riding, I do so because of the protection they offer to the exterior of the horses leg (especially for horses who overreach, etc.) I use jumping boots, splint boots etc for actual support and my trainer will not "hook" polo wraps because there IS a risk in doing that, and when you've got eventers that are worth a quarter of a million buckaroos, you don't want to chance it.

Polo wraps got their name because they were originally popular among polo players. Their usefulness has long since expanded into most every other discipline. Polo wraps, usually made of cotton-blend fabric, offer wide-spectrum protection, depending on how they are used. People who use polo wraps like them because of their versatility, since different parts of the leg can be protected, depending on how they are applied. Using polo wraps, however, requires some experience, since a leg can be easily damaged by a wrap that has been applied improperly. They also require more maintenance than leg boots in order to maintain their usefulness and elasticity.

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

I disagree, Jessica. I've been wrapping horses since I was 6 years old, so yeah, I know how to wrap as well and I haven't ever caused a bowed tendon either. It CAN happen, though and that is the primary reason that smart horsemen will not wrap their horses with POLO wraps while trailering (bandage bows.) As you know, there are different types of boots and leg protection gear to use while riding and while I personally use polo wraps during routine riding, I do so because of the protection they offer to the exterior of the horses leg (especially for horses who overreach, etc.) I use jumping boots, splint boots etc for actual support and my trainer will not "hook" polo wraps because there IS a risk in doing that, and when you've got eventers that are worth a quarter of a million buckaroos, you don't want to chance it.

Polo wraps got their name because they were originally popular among polo players. Their usefulness has long since expanded into most every other discipline. Polo wraps, usually made of cotton-blend fabric, offer wide-spectrum protection, depending on how they are used. People who use polo wraps like them because of their versatility, since different parts of the leg can be protected, depending on how they are applied. Using polo wraps, however, requires some experience, since a leg can be easily damaged by a wrap that has been applied improperly. They also require more maintenance than leg boots in order to maintain their usefulness and elasticity.

Well, I was talking about using wraps on racehorses, not on horses who are shipping.

And what is the risk for hooking polo wraps? Please tell me. I would love to know because I am baffled from that statement. Also, as redransom said, racehorse trainers do have their horses fetlock joints hooked. Some of those animals are worth millions and millions. Take Afleet Alex for example. Tim Ritchey used to be a three day eventer, and he had Alex's rundowns hooked behind the fetlock joint.

In your second paragraph, you forgot to talk about how polo wraps add SUPPORT. I could find numerous articles by famous horsemen agreeing with me on this. I have learned everything I know through experience.

I use bell boots for horses overreaching. If you are riding animals who overreach so badly that they hit their cannon bones or ankle joint, then they aren't very high dollar or quality animals because they can't move.

Originally Posted by kentuckyrosesinmay

Actually, polo wraps protect a horse from splints, bucked shins, windpuffs, bruises...etc. Splints, windpuffs, and bucked shins cause temporary lameness, but can be seen as a blemish for the rest of a horse's life. Also, if wrapped right, polo wraps do provide support when they are hooked just behind the fetlock joint. They provide support of the flexor tendons. Also, no extremely good horseman will ever wrap the wraps tight enough as to bow a tendon. Every great hunter/jumper trainer and dressage trainer that I have ever seen uses them. I've wrapped hundreds of horses, and have never had one bow a tendon yet, and I'm not even worried about it because I know how to wrap...

Here is a list of all the soft tissue injuries that wraps may prevent...
http://www.umm.edu/orthopaedics/soft.htm

Also, it has come to my attention from a very knowledgable race tracker that wraps may actually slow down a horse a little bit, and it would make sense because the horse does not have quite as much flexibility in their fetlock joint. There is some slight tension and resistence at the joint from the wraps. Alot of the major trainers of the sport believe this (or so I've been told...but my source is reliable). Of course, I would never ever ever let that affect the way I bet a race, or me ever using wraps on my horses.

Also, a lot of racehorse trainers use wraps as a means of preventing burns on the bottom of a horse's fetlock joint when they are running in a race. This is especially true for horses who are a little coon footed (long in the pasterns), because these horses fetlock joints will touch the ground while they are running.

Okay, Im done now.

As a former racetrack groom, I'm here to tell you there's a giant difference between "wraps" and "bandages" and "rundowns" and where they all go and what they're all for.

Bandages in the true sense are what goes on a horse in his stall. Standing, sweats, poultices, spiders...

Wraps are usually used during training and are "polo" types, discussed above, or "tracers" which resemble ace bandages and are used for both protection and added support. Of course some also use tight vetwrap bandages on horses when training when the horse needs it; I was lucky to never have had one of them. I had a mare, who won a stakes at Ellis Park in 1997, who had some ankle issues and we used tracers on all fours for her and that was more than sufficient.

Oh and racing bandages are called "rundowns" when on hind legs and are, basically, vetwrap around the ankles and a rundown patch over the top (or back of the ankle, in this case.) I think this is what you were referring to when you mentioned preventing burns, which is called running down. For front bandages, which is what the "f" in the Form is for, it's the same thing, only wrapped tightly for support rather than prevention of running down, nine times out of 10. I've seen a horse or two actually run down in front, too. But it's rare...

[Revolution]

Originally Posted by redransom

As a former racetrack groom, I'm here to tell you there's a giant difference between "wraps" and "bandages" and "rundowns" and where they all go and what they're all for.

Bandages in the true sense are what goes on a horse in his stall. Standing, sweats, poultices, spiders...

Wraps are usually used during training and are "polo" types, discussed above, or "tracers" which resemble ace bandages and are used for both protection and added support. Of course some also use tight vetwrap bandages on horses when training when the horse needs it; I was lucky to never have had one of them. I had a mare, who won a stakes at Ellis Park in 1997, who had some ankle issues and we used tracers on all fours for her and that was more than sufficient.

Oh and racing bandages are called "rundowns" when on hind legs and are, basically, vetwrap around the ankles and a rundown patch over the top (or back of the ankle, in this case.) I think this is what you were referring to when you mentioned preventing burns, which is called running down. For front bandages, which is what the "f" in the Form is for, it's the same thing, only wrapped tightly for support rather than prevention of running down, nine times out of 10. I've seen a horse or two actually run down in front, too. But it's rare...

Thanks. That is good stuff.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by redransom

As a former racetrack groom, I'm here to tell you there's a giant difference between "wraps" and "bandages" and "rundowns" and where they all go and what they're all for.

Bandages in the true sense are what goes on a horse in his stall. Standing, sweats, poultices, spiders...

Wraps are usually used during training and are "polo" types, discussed above, or "tracers" which resemble ace bandages and are used for both protection and added support. Of course some also use tight vetwrap bandages on horses when training when the horse needs it; I was lucky to never have had one of them. I had a mare, who won a stakes at Ellis Park in 1997, who had some ankle issues and we used tracers on all fours for her and that was more than sufficient.

Oh and racing bandages are called "rundowns" when on hind legs and are, basically, vetwrap around the ankles and a rundown patch over the top (or back of the ankle, in this case.) I think this is what you were referring to when you mentioned preventing burns, which is called running down. For front bandages, which is what the "f" in the Form is for, it's the same thing, only wrapped tightly for support rather than prevention of running down, nine times out of 10. I've seen a horse or two actually run down in front, too. But it's rare...

Thanks... very good info there. I had never heard of "tracers."

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by redransom

As a former racetrack groom, I'm here to tell you there's a giant difference between "wraps" and "bandages" and "rundowns" and where they all go and what they're all for.

Bandages in the true sense are what goes on a horse in his stall. Standing, sweats, poultices, spiders...

Wraps are usually used during training and are "polo" types, discussed above, or "tracers" which resemble ace bandages and are used for both protection and added support. Of course some also use tight vetwrap bandages on horses when training when the horse needs it; I was lucky to never have had one of them. I had a mare, who won a stakes at Ellis Park in 1997, who had some ankle issues and we used tracers on all fours for her and that was more than sufficient.

Oh and racing bandages are called "rundowns" when on hind legs and are, basically, vetwrap around the ankles and a rundown patch over the top (or back of the ankle, in this case.) I think this is what you were referring to when you mentioned preventing burns, which is called running down. For front bandages, which is what the "f" in the Form is for, it's the same thing, only wrapped tightly for support rather than prevention of running down, nine times out of 10. I've seen a horse or two actually run down in front, too. But it's rare...

Thanks for the correct terminology red ransom. That's good stuff.