Top 25 3yo's 1987-2007

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Lawyer Ron, Artax, Louis Quatorze, Serena's Song, Tabasco Cat, Devil His Due, Corporate Report. None of them could beat out Startac or Kissin Kris in your opinion?

Didn't you read the title? You can scratch Louis Quatorze and Tabasco Cat right away.

Serena's Song is a filly. I am a misogynist.

Lawyer Ron did what after the TC? 2nd in the Super Derby? Great.

Artax? A distant 2nd to Sea of Secrets in an allowance and a 2nd to Run Man Run in the Malibu? Stellar.

Devil His Due? Chased a NY-bred at Saratoga. A-one.

There was a bunch of good also-rans in '91 (Sea Cadet was in there, too). In my haste, I left off Travers winner Corporate Report.

[RolloTomasi]

Top 25 Lightning Will Not Strike Twice 3yos:

Honor Grades after Summer Squall
Tiago after Giacomo
Cahill Road after Unbridled
Prince of Thieves after Timber Country
Rebel Alliance after Sunday Silence
Demons Begone before Pine Bluff
Honor Grades before AP Indy
Pleasant Tap before Go For Gin
Hold That Tiger after Editor's Note
Tossofthecoin before Charismatic
Millenium Wind after Charismatic
So Long Birdie after Birdstone
Fast Play after Seeking The Gold
Citidancer before Will's Way
Excavate before Menifee
Bravo Mondo after Hansel
Corker after Strodes Creek
Exetera after Sea Cadet
On Target after Sea Cadet
Defere after Dehere
Pendleton Ridge before Lost Mountain
Exploit after Prized
Whywhywhy before Spellbinder
Spellbinder after Whywhywhy
Jazil before Rags To Riches

[letswastemoney]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Top 25 Lightning Will Not Strike Twice 3yos:

Honor Grades after Summer Squall
Tiago after Giacomo
Cahill Road after Unbridled
Prince of Thieves after Timber Country
Rebel Alliance after Sunday Silence
Demons Begone before Pine Bluff
Honor Grades before AP Indy
Pleasant Tap before Go For Gin
Hold That Tiger after Editor's Note
Tossofthecoin before Charismatic
Millenium Wind after Charismatic
So Long Birdie after Birdstone
Fast Play after Seeking The Gold
Citidancer before Will's Way
Excavate before Menifee
Bravo Mondo after Hansel
Corker after Strodes Creek
Exetera after Sea Cadet
On Target after Sea Cadet
Defere after Dehere
Pendleton Ridge before Lost Mountain
Exploit after Prized
Whywhywhy before Spellbinder
Spellbinder after Whywhywhy
Jazil before Rags To Riches

as a kid, for some odd reason i was a huge Corker fan. i had put some money on him through my dad when he first started and broke his maiden. i wonder if he's still alive.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

Didn't you read the title? You can scratch Louis Quatorze and Tabasco Cat right away.

Serena's Song is a filly. I am a misogynist.

Lawyer Ron did what after the TC? 2nd in the Super Derby? Great.

Artax? A distant 2nd to Sea of Secrets in an allowance and a 2nd to Run Man Run in the Malibu? Stellar.

Devil His Due? Chased a NY-bred at Saratoga. A-one.

There was a bunch of good also-rans in '91 (Sea Cadet was in there, too). In my haste, I left off Travers winner Corporate Report.

I don't know why I left LQ and Tabasco Cat on there. But let's look at the rest. You obviously are looking at only what the horses did in the remainder of their 3yo seasons. So with that in mind, how do Harlan's Holiday, Cryptoclearance, and Kissin Kris make it but Flower Alley doesn't? Harlan's Holiday won the Penn Derby and Cryptoclearance won the Pegasus. You make not like fillies much but isn't Serena's Song's Haskell against the boys the equal of Kissin Kris' win in the same race? I thought that Nobiz was at least as good as Favorite Trick was.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I don't know why I left LQ and Tabasco Cat on there. But let's look at the rest. You obviously are looking at only what the horses did in the remainder of their 3yo seasons. So with that in mind, how do Harlan's Holiday, Cryptoclearance, and Kissin Kris make it but Flower Alley doesn't? Harlan's Holiday won the Penn Derby and Cryptoclearance won the Pegasus. You make not like fillies much but isn't Serena's Song's Haskell against the boys the equal of Kissin Kris' win in the same race? I thought that Nobiz was at least as good as Favorite Trick was.

I missed Flower Alley, too. I don't really care for Harlan's Holiday either, so he can replace him. Cryptoclearance butted heads with all sorts of good horses in '87 and the Pegasus was still Grade 1 at the time so he stays.

Serena's Song is a filly. She doesn't qualify.

Nobiz Like Shobiz was good for about the last 400 yards of the lowly Jamaica. Other than that, his performances all year were atrocious. He sucks. Favorite Trick won the Jim Dandy. That's huge in my book.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

I missed Flower Alley, too. I don't really care for Harlan's Holiday either, so he can replace him. Cryptoclearance butted heads with all sorts of good horses in '87 and the Pegasus was still Grade 1 at the time so he stays.

Serena's Song is a filly. She doesn't qualify.

Nobiz Like Shobiz was good for about the last 400 yards of the lowly Jamaica. Other than that, his performances all year were atrocious. He sucks. Favorite Trick won the Jim Dandy. That's huge in my book.

I think Cryptoclearance was a very good horse and deserves to be on the list. He just came in a really tough year. But if winning a single grade one afterwards gets you on, there are quite a few that I wonder about. Lion Heart won the Haskell. Is the Haskell no longer up to the level of the Dandy? I notice you have Favorite Trick and Fly So Free on there (both Dandy winners) but not Lion Heart and Serena's Song, both Haskell winners. If it seems like I'm questioning your opinions, I'm sorry. I'm not meaning too. I just wondered what were determining factors for you in who does or doesn't make it. For the record, I'd agree with about 80% of your list so we aren't that far off.

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I think Cryptoclearance was a very good horse and deserves to be on the list. He just came in a really tough year. But if winning a single grade one afterwards gets you on, there are quite a few that I wonder about. Lion Heart won the Haskell. Is the Haskell no longer up to the level of the Dandy? I notice you have Favorite Trick and Fly So Free on there (both Dandy winners) but not Lion Heart and Serena's Song, both Haskell winners. If it seems like I'm questioning your opinions, I'm sorry. I'm not meaning too. I just wondered what were determining factors for you in who does or doesn't make it. For the record, I'd agree with about 80% of your list so we aren't that far off.

Lion Heart was second. I was restricting it to off-the-board horses. Serena's Song was too obvious, so I just tossed cuz she ran against fillies for the most part. Otherwise, I just went year by year and then narrowed it down to 25. I actually thought I had Corporate Report on there, but totally missed Flower Alley.

To be perfectly honest the whole impetus to make that list was to get Lost Mountain's name thrown into this thread. I always hated that horse but it's hard to deny him some recognition when he has the Peter Pan, Dwyer, and Haskell on his post-Derby resume.

[NoLuvForPletch]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

I don't know why I left LQ and Tabasco Cat on there. But let's look at the rest. You obviously are looking at only what the horses did in the remainder of their 3yo seasons. So with that in mind, how do Harlan's Holiday, Cryptoclearance, and Kissin Kris make it but Flower Alley doesn't? Harlan's Holiday won the Penn Derby and Cryptoclearance won the Pegasus. You make not like fillies much but isn't Serena's Song's Haskell against the boys the equal of Kissin Kris' win in the same race? I thought that Nobiz was at least as good as Favorite Trick was.

If we are talking fillies, where is Silverbulletday? She won 8 Graded Stakes as a 3YO. 4 G1's, 2 G2's and 3's.