Majestic Warrior

[SniperSB23]

I thought Circular Quay had absolutely no chance in the Derby last year but not only do I think Majestic Warrior is more likely to be a closing sprinter than CQ but CQ was also FAR more accomplised at this point. I don't really get the buzz around this horse. Plodding past a spent Mayonnaise and Ready's Image after they tried to duel for seven furlongs wasn't anything to get excited about.

[freddymo]

I think the connections and the pedigree lend themself to overreaction, dont you? I am one who swallowed the bait.
Something to be said for a 2 year old grade 1 Indy winner regardless of the race shape.

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I thought Circular Quay had absolutely no chance in the Derby last year but not only do I think Majestic Warrior is more likely to be a closing sprinter than CQ but CQ was also FAR more accomplised at this point. I don't really get the buzz around this horse. Plodding past a spent Mayonnaise and Ready's Image after they tried to duel for seven furlongs wasn't anything to get excited about.

Then why on earth are you excited about the cheaper version (Denis of Cork) of him?

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

Then why on earth are you excited about the cheaper version (Denis of Cork) of him?

He's already won around two turns and already won in a race where the pace scenario played completely against him. You have to be a closer to win in those circumstances, not a plodder like Majestic Warrior. Barring an unforeseen infusion of speed horses into the Derby picture this year there is no chance of enough of a pace meltdown for a plodder to crack the superfecta even if that plodder turns out to like 10 furlongs which is a big question mark.

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

He's already won around two turns and already won in a race where the pace scenario played completely against him. You have to be a closer to win in those circumstances, not a plodder like Majestic Warrior. Barring an unforeseen infusion of speed horses into the Derby picture this year there is no chance of enough of a pace meltdown for a plodder to crack the superfecta even if that plodder turns out to like 10 furlongs which is a big question mark.

So he went an extra turn and panel in the Southwest and caught horses that went ridiculously fast on the front and he's not a plodder?

He beat the great Unbridled Vicar at Fair Grounds but he showed heart...BEATING UNBRIDLED VICAR BY A NOSE????!?!?!

Denis of Cork has absolutely no shot in the Derby. I hope he's the the favorite.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

So he went an extra turn and panel in the Southwest and caught horses that went ridiculously fast on the front and he's not a plodder?

He beat the great Unbridled Vicar at Fair Grounds but he showed heart...BEATING UNBRIDLED VICAR BY A NOSE????!?!?!

Denis of Cork has absolutely no shot in the Derby. I hope he's the the favorite.

If Dennis of Cork was a plodder he would not have been anywhere close to the fast pace in the Southwest. Comparing him to Majestic Warrior makes little or no sense. If you like Majestic Warrior that's fine.....but he is completely different type of horse than Dennis of Cork.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

If Dennis of Cork was a plodder he would not have been anywhere close to the fast pace in the Southwest. Comparing him to Majestic Warrior makes little or no sense. If you like Majestic Warrior that's fine.....but he is completely different type of horse than Dennis of Cork.

Since when do plodders run seven furlongs in 1:23 flat? If we're going to "make sense" lets go after ridiculous assumptions that result in mockery.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

Since when do plodders run seven furlongs in 1:23 flat? If we're going to "make sense" lets go after ridiculous assumptions that result in mockery.

Plodding is a running style that is mistakenly used as an insult to horses. It has more to do with how the horse runs the race than how fast they do it. Like other running styles there are both fast and slow plodders.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Pillow Pants

So he went an extra turn and panel in the Southwest and caught horses that went ridiculously fast on the front and he's not a plodder?

He beat the great Unbridled Vicar at Fair Grounds but he showed heart...BEATING UNBRIDLED VICAR BY A NOSE????!?!?!

Denis of Cork has absolutely no shot in the Derby. I hope he's the the favorite.

The point is if Majestic Warrior had the same setup against the great Unbridled Vicar he wouldn't have beat him and the slow pace would have been the excuse. The fact is, Denis of Cork had excuses to lose and got it done in that race even if the time was slow and the competition soft. I don't think he is as good a Derby contender as War Pass and Pyro at this point. I said a couple weeks back I'd take those two against the field and feel pretty good about it. As a third choice though I think Denis of Cork is as good as any and certainly a better option than Majestic Warrior.

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

The point is if Majestic Warrior had the same setup against the great Unbridled Vicar he wouldn't have beat him and the slow pace would have been the excuse. The fact is, Denis of Cork had excuses to lose and got it done in that race even if the time was slow and the competition soft. I don't think he is as good a Derby contender as War Pass and Pyro at this point. I said a couple weeks back I'd take those two against the field and feel pretty good about it. As a third choice though I think Denis of Cork is as good as any and certainly a better option than Majestic Warrior.

What about the Southwest? How would he have fared in that race?

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

He's already won around two turns and already won in a race where the pace scenario played completely against him. You have to be a closer to win in those circumstances, not a plodder like Majestic Warrior. Barring an unforeseen infusion of speed horses into the Derby picture this year there is no chance of enough of a pace meltdown for a plodder to crack the superfecta even if that plodder turns out to like 10 furlongs which is a big question mark.

The colt has had a total of 3 starts with 1 of them health compromised. You are drawing a lot of conclusions from so little data. His second dam was a fairly acomplished router and he sure does have a great trainer in BILLY(for you BBB)..
I worry more about him not having a couple more races in him then if he plods or if he develops a little more turn of foot. He is 6 months older lets see what 08 brings before we label him Saarland 2 the sequel

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by freddymo

The colt has had a total of 3 starts with 1 of them health compromised. You are drawing a lot of conclusions from so little data. His second dam was a fairly acomplished router and he sure does have a great trainer in BILLY(for you BBB)..
I worry more about him not having a couple more races in him then if he plods or if he develops a little more turn of foot. He is 6 months older lets see what 08 brings before we label him Saarland 2 the sequel

By no means do I think there is no chance the horse will develop into a legit Derby horse. I just think there are a lot of reasons to think he won't. Considering he looks like the poor man's version of Circular Quay at this point though I find the buzz around him to be puzzling.

[KirisClown]

Originally Posted by freddymo

His second dam was a fairly acomplished router

Spinning Round was A LOT like her daughter Dream Supreme.. both had their finest moments going 7F...

[freddymo]

what about Ashland?

With the many misgivings, this thread, regarding MAJESTIC WARRIOR and his preferred distance, (more than a few suggested, foolishly, that he is a sprinter because his dam was ?). The AP Indy colt handled six furlongs this morning.

As we posted, this would be a very important work and we cannot recall a faster Payson move. By any measure, six panels at this deep training center is not a frequent occurence. Nomatter Pillow Pants passes a big hurdle and is very live having one of a half dozen or so.

BBB