Where does my money go?

pmacdaddy · #1 02-13-2008, 09:31 PM

Bit of a hypothetical question here. Just curious if anyone has a good handle on following the money as "we" are certainly contributing this money everyone wants their hands on.

Personally, I want my money that does not get paid to people cashing tickets to go to the track as much as possible. I assume the best way to do this is to bet on track or with NYRA rewards. The real crux of my question is - How much less does then Track see from an OTB dollar? I honestly don't really know.

Here is the question.

I place $667 win wager in the opener at Aqueduct. Due to my ineptitude as a handicapper, my horse does not win and I lose my $667. Assuming all would pay track prices (which is by no means a given). $567 (85%) goes to the folks who had the winner. $100 (15% is the takeout).

Where does the $100 go in each of these three situations?

1) Win Bet Placed on Track

2) Win Bet Placed at OTB

3) Win Bet Placed with ADW

Answer may vary a lot within each category, but really curious if anyone knows generally how much makes it back to the track?

Or maybe I shouldn't care as long as I get a track price...

Scav · #2 02-13-2008, 09:53 PM

Odds of Dunbar knowing/finding the answer within 3 hours after seeing post: 1/9

blackthroatedwind · #3 02-13-2008, 10:15 PM

Odds of my not wanting to waste my time answering........1/9.

Scav · #4 02-13-2008, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Odds of my not wanting to waste my time answering........1/9.

If you know, why not answer? it was an open ended question for all to have the opportunity to answer and Pat is good people. CONTRIBUTIONS my friend, CONTRIBUTIONS

pmacdaddy · #5 02-13-2008, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Odds of my not wanting to waste my time answering........1/9.

So we should just push our money through the windows and not care?
.

Scav · #6 02-13-2008, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pmacdaddy

So we should just push our money through the windows and not care?

I think he is pissed at you for not asking him direct. I sensed some mood in that response. tisk tisk

pmacdaddy · #7 02-13-2008, 10:51 PM

I really don't know why this crap bothers me...maybe it shouldn't.

NYRA keeps the horses for 25 yrs, OTB gets to stay all screwed up and pols look like they will get to do as they please with VLT. As long as racing stays good I guess it's no real skin off my back.

#8 02-13-2008, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Odds of my not wanting to waste my time answering........1/9.

Odds as to why one would waste time responding?

constipation can be painful

blackthroatedwind · #9 02-13-2008, 10:52 PM

I'm glad he didn't ask me directly.....then I might have felt obliged to answer.

pmacdaddy · #10 02-13-2008, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm glad he didn't ask me directly.....then I might have felt obliged to answer.

Dear BTW,

I have a hypothetical question I need some help with...

Scav · #11 02-13-2008, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm glad he didn't ask me directly.....then I might have felt obliged to answer.

I have to admit I have zero idea where this is going......

blackthroatedwind · #12 02-13-2008, 11:01 PM

All monies bet, less takeout, get returned in the pari-mutual pool. The takeout is mostly kept by the racetrack, if your bet is made on-track ( or through NYRA-One if you're betting NYRA tracks ), and used to pay the expenses of running the business.....from purses to salaries to daily upkeep.

If you bet with an ADW they pay for the signal, and keep the difference between that rate and the takeout percentage, just as if you bet Santa Anita at Aqueduct.

Anything else?

Scav · #13 02-13-2008, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

All monies bet, less takeout, get returned in the pari-mutual pool. The takeout is mostly kept by the racetrack, if your bet is made on-track ( or through NYRA-One if you're betting NYRA tracks ), and used to pay the expenses of running the business.....from purses to salaries to daily upkeep.

If you bet with an ADW they pay for the signal, and keep the difference between that rate and the takeout percentage, just as if you bet Santa Anita at Aqueduct.

Anything else?

Dude, I think he is talking about actual numbers here, i think he knows the above.

Quote:

Where does the $100 go in each of these three situations?

1) Win Bet Placed on Track

2) Win Bet Placed at OTB

3) Win Bet Placed with ADW

pmacdaddy · #14 02-13-2008, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

All monies bet, less takeout, get returned in the pari-mutual pool. The takeout is mostly kept by the racetrack, if your bet is made on-track ( or through NYRA-One if you're betting NYRA tracks ), and used to pay the expenses of running the business.....from purses to salaries to daily upkeep.

If you bet with an ADW they pay for the signal, and keep the difference between that rate and the takeout percentage, just as if you bet Santa Anita at Aqueduct.

Anything else?

Just OTB Take Out and I should be all set. That is "mostly" kept by the track? Thanks

Scav · #15 02-13-2008, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scav

Where does the $100 go in each of these three situations?

1) Win Bet Placed on Track

2) Win Bet Placed at OTB

3) Win Bet Placed with ADW

**** it, I'll try

Track keeps full takeout.

I think an OTB and ADW are kinda the same, in that they negiotate to take wagers on the signals, and while the takeout is same from the actual track, they get to keep part of the takeout

Scav · #16 02-13-2008, 11:07 PM

And, I know that in Illinois, when Arlington is the host track, you get full track odds at Trackside OTB's, and when Hawthorne is the host track, then we get charged like 2% on winning tickets at Trackside OTBs

I have heard that it is grossly high on winning tickets at NY OTB's from Marty.

blackthroatedwind · #17 02-13-2008, 11:10 PM

NY OTB pays a fee for all signals, just like ADWs and host tracks pay other tracks, but pays a very low rate due to their high handle. They have a state mandated deal with NYRA, as they were created as an arm for racing in NY State, and thus have to support the industry in NY State and the very races they specifically were created to exist upon. Remember, for the first 25 or so years of their existance, there was little to no simulcasting, so they existed only on NY races.....save a literal handful of " special events. "

I really don't feel like getting into a further discussion of how OTB is inefficient and takes way too much money out of racing and why the nature of their charter runs contra to the best interests of racing.

Scav · #18 02-13-2008, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

NY OTB pays a fee for all signals, just like ADWs and host tracks pay other tracks, but pays a very low rate due to their high handle. They have a state mandated deal with NYRA, as they were created as an arm for racing in NY State, and thus have to support the industry in NY State and the very races they specifically were created to exist upon. Remember, for the first 25 or so years of their existance, there was little to no simulcasting, so they existed only on NY races.....save a literal handful of " special events. "

I really don't feel like getting into a further discussion of how OTB is inefficient and takes way too much money out of racing and why the nature of their charter runs contra to the best interests of racing.

I don't think he was asking about that, but I could be wrong, I think he just wanted to see where his dollar was best spend.

Personally, there is too many hands in the cookie jar, but it is what we get when all these states are involved with differences up the wazzoo(takeout, drugs, entry rules)

IMO it will never change until horse racing gets run like a sporting franchise, like the NFL/MLB/NBA, which will never happen because of the gambling aspect

blackthroatedwind · #19 02-13-2008, 11:20 PM

There's a very large discussion that can be had about this....and it could be interesting and informative if the parties discussing it actually understand it. There are a lot of different, and valid, points of view. There are also a lot of the opposite.

I would prefer to have it over drinks, and/or dinner, and not somewhere for the world to see and where I have to spend an inordinate amount of time typing.

Sorry.

pmacdaddy · #20 02-13-2008, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

NY OTB pays a fee for all signals, just like ADWs and host tracks pay other tracks, but pays a very low rate due to their high handle. They have a state mandated deal with NYRA, as they were created as an arm for racing in NY State, and thus have to support the industry in NY State and the very races they specifically were created to exist upon. Remember, for the first 25 or so years of their existance, there was little to no simulcasting, so they existed only on NY races.....save a literal handful of " special events. "

I really don't feel like getting into a further discussion of how OTB is inefficient and takes way too much money out of racing and why the nature of their charter runs contra to the best interests of racing.

Thanks.

Was mainly looking to understand the arrangement between NY OTB and Track. OTB is what is it and arguing about it certainly seems to be pointless right now. Just trying to get a sense for how much more an on-track dollar benefits the track as opposed to a off-track dollar.