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#41
08-11-2009, 07:39 AM
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 one pol is no different/better than another. besides, the House needs a good cleaning out (and so does the senate)...
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Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln 
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#42
08-12-2009, 02:48 PM
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Appears Cash for Clunkers was 13 times more important than border security
In this administation's eyes. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090812/...l_guard_border
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“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
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#43
08-12-2009, 02:54 PM
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#44
08-12-2009, 03:00 PM
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“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
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#45
08-12-2009, 03:44 PM
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#46
08-12-2009, 08:00 PM
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"After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it. I sure as hell wouldn't want to live in a society where the only people allowed guns are the police and the military."...William S. Burroughs
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#47
08-13-2009, 07:24 AM
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32398464/ns/politics/
Just how many consumers used the federal rebates to buy these larger, not-so-green vehicles is unclear. The Obama administration has declined so far to release detailed records of purchases under the program being compiled by the Transportation Department, listing every clunker deal requesting rebates. Buyers must have trade-ins that qualify for such deals — comparable vehicle types with at least 2 mpg less in fuel efficiency than the new purchase. And the new vehicle can't cost more than $45,000. Even a high-end 2009 BMW X3 crossover utility vehicle, priced at just under $40,000, counts as a gas saver eligible under the government program, with 19 mpg. "The Cash for Clunkers is definitely generating traffic for Cadillac and Hummer," Ledesma said. i think it's too soon to say that a program costing 3 billion is a success. i also think the mpg requirements should have been far more stringent than just 2 mpg earned.
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Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#48
08-13-2009, 11:00 AM
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#49
08-13-2009, 12:01 PM
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#50
08-13-2009, 02:12 PM
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#51
08-13-2009, 02:21 PM
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I think the program has both Progressive, and Conservative aspects to it. What most of you are doing is attacking the Conservative part of the bill (this makes the song "AMAZING" by Kanye West pop into my head.) There are 2 ways that the bill helps the country:
1) gas savings, and less pollution 2) helps get the automobile industry get going again If people can possibly get by with the 25-30 mpg type cars, then they will buy them. You will get 20-25% off the price of those. You're not gunna get that type of % off of these vehicles with 18-19 mpg. You will get a 10% savings. That's a big difference. There is a big incentive to buy the higher mpg cars, but this fact escapes many. If you're trading something very bad on gas mileage in, then yes, you can buy a low end Hummer that gets 18-19 mpg (and get the small 10% price break.) Somehow, if this wasn't allowed, I am pretty sure you'd be complaining that families (which need larger autos) can't take part in the program (anti-family.) I doubt it's the Dems that demanded for there to be a right to replace a 14 mpg ride with an 18 mpg one. Either way, everyone who uses this program is cutting down on the country's gas usage, and helping get the automobile industry back up running. A program like this (that gives everyone 2 ways to help the country) is one that will actually work. It has some level of freedom of choice involved, but it's matched by powerful incentives to buy higher mpg cars (if you possibly can do so.) If (on a really big gas guzzler you're trading in) you want to dilute your discount by turning it from 25% to only 10%, then I hardly think it's something to brag about.
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#52
08-13-2009, 04:57 PM
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altho it may be a success in that mpg will improve, i don't know that it's worth $3billion. could that money have been better spent? perhaps in alternative fuel usages, research, or even by helping OUR facilities in regards to refining oil. our refinery capacity hasn't grown in years, there's been no reason to do so...but, if we could take care of our own refining, that would help price-wise, as well as weaning us from foreign oil.
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Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#53
08-14-2009, 07:32 AM
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I'm busting out of retirement for this.. Are you kidding me?!?! That 3 bill better spent would just be wasted in some stupid govnt program that nobody would see a penny of. This money is ACTUALLY GOING INTO TAXPAYERS POCKETS! its unreal. I never thought I'd have a chance at 4500 of govnt cash.. but here we are! And people are actually complaining! This is the best thing Obama has done since in office. Why the repubs are complaining is beyond be. The only problem i have with it is I wish they would salvage the good parts of the cars being turned in..
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#54
08-14-2009, 08:12 AM
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perhaps i should have said 'it may have been better not to have spent it at all'? our govt needs to quit acting as tho we have a limitless supply of dough, and unlimited abilities to borrow and spend.
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Books serve to show a man that those original thoughts of his aren't very new at all. Abraham Lincoln
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#55
08-14-2009, 09:19 AM
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[quote=Antitrust32]I'm busting out of retirement for this..
Are you kidding me?!?! That 3 bill better spent would just be wasted in some stupid govnt program that nobody would see a penny of. This money is ACTUALLY GOING INTO TAXPAYERS POCKETS! its unreal. I never thought I'd have a chance at 4500 of govnt cash.. QUOTE] so we took 3 billion out of one pocket and put it into the other we feel good? This isn't government cash there is no such thing. It is our cash! And to think dealers didn't take a part of each $4,500 rebate with higher costs is naive. The spare parts, frame and everything but the engine went to scrap yards and will be parted out and then salvaged. We see none of that money so in realty we get back approximately $3,000 of the $4,500. Now let's spend some money shoreing up the boarders and getting illegals back home and then look at the savings we'll see
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“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson Last edited by dellinger63 : 08-14-2009 at 09:46 AM.
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#56
08-14-2009, 09:27 AM
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they spend like 500 billion every year that "would have been better not to have spent at all" This actually has a chance of "robbing peter to pay peter back" You dont have to be out of work and have 12 kids to be able to get your hands on some of this cash. I love it.
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#57
08-14-2009, 09:31 AM
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[quote=dellinger63]
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come on man... the 3 bil was coming out of our pocket NO MATTER WHAT. At least we have the OPPORTUNITY to put it in the other pocket.. cant say that about 99.99999999999% of other govnt spending. there are tons of things where the money is better off not spent. Unfortunatly it doesnt matter what we think cause the money is going to be spent. At least its not being spent on something we will never see. We can actually benefit from this. This is the best thing Obama has done along with the stem cell research.. lets cut a really crappy program and use that money to shoreing up boarders. There are probably a few trillion programs out there that would be better to complain about than this one. 3 bill is like 5 cents to Obama.
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#58
08-14-2009, 09:50 AM
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Lori I couldn't agree more concerning stem cell research. No one is forcing anyone to under go treatment and no one should tell someone else they can't. We'll just agree to disagree on the success of cash for clunkers.
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“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” Thomas Jefferson
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#59
08-14-2009, 09:53 AM
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Is it fair to say the majority of people that drive clunkers can not or could not afford newer cars?
If so, how is it they now can afford to make payments on a new car? Even with a $4500 down payment... Sounds like the mortgage crisis all over again to me...or am I missing something?
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We've Gone Delirious
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#60
08-14-2009, 10:03 AM
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