ruffian and rachel

[slotdirt]

Poor Gallorette only has a G3 to her name.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Merlinsky

Off the top of my head, probably Sysonby. Not 100% but that's who came to mind first. Certainly was one of those mentioned in Walter Farley's fictionalized account, and people were all 'hey whoa wait a minute, let's not get carried away.' For those who haven't read it, it's really good and it's not a fictionalized account of the horses' accomplishments, just a fake person named Danny to serve as the eyes of the reader in MOW's story.

While we're talking MOW, the Steves Byk and Haskin were talking about the Hopeful the other day and 'our' Steve said MOW lost it, but actually he won the Hopeful and lost the Sanford. I felt a tad silly calling in just to correct that, but having read Man O' War numerous times as a child and Dorothy Ours' book when it came out, I couldn't help but have a bell go off in my head.

i was thinking sysonby, but too tired to look it up... i read the farley man o'war book-hell, i read everything walter farley wrote!

[DaTruth]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

What race are they going to change the name of to the "Rachel Alexandra" Grade 1 race. All the really good one's get Grade 1 races.

Maybe they'll change the name of the Haskell or the Woodward to the "Rachel Alexandra"

I'm looking forward to the Grade 1 Seattle Slew and Affirmed Stakes. Maybe GP will do something to elevate the Spectacular Bid Stakes. As for Secretariat, Did AP get the stakes naming rights for Secretariat over NYRA?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

What race are they going to change the name of to the "Rachel Alexandra" Grade 1 race. All the really good one's get Grade 1 races.

Maybe they'll change the name of the Haskell or the Woodward to the "Rachel Alexandra"

If any existing race is changed, I'd guess the Mother Goose or one of the Oaks preps she ran.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

If any existing race is changed, I'd guess the Mother Goose or one of the Oaks preps she ran.

i wouldn't be in the least surprised if oaklawn changed the martha washington to the rachel alexandra, since she's now the record holder in that race-also because they renamed a race the smarty jones.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by DaTruth

I'm looking forward to the Grade 1 Seattle Slew and Affirmed Stakes. Maybe GP will do something to elevate the Spectacular Bid Stakes. As for Secretariat, Did AP get the stakes naming rights for Secretariat over NYRA?

I'm looking forward to the $3.75 cent DaTruth Claiming race.

[DaTruth]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I'm looking forward to the $3.75 cent DaTruth Claiming race.

You should feel honored by the Antitrust 32 Handicap, which is restricted to geldings.

[Linny]

Agree about Gallorette. She was very good and took on leading males in an era of tough old timers sticking arond for years. I don't think she's being snubbed so much as the focus has been comparing RA to other brilliant 3yo fillies. To try to draw a comparison, you have to look at a timeline comparison, meaning you only look at Gallorette up to September of her 3yo year.
RA has had a brilliant 3yo campaign and it's fair to compare her to other brilliant 3yo fillies, but not fair to compare her to horses that developed into champions at 4 or beyond.

Colin and Fair Play had a rather on sided rivalry as Colin was never beaten. The horse I'd love to time travel to see would be Domino, but only if I could catch a day when he was sprinting.

Don't get me started on the changing of race names. I hate it with the white hot heat of a thousand suns. NOTHING will sway me, nothing.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Linny

Agree about Gallorette. She was very good and took on leading males in an era of tough old timers sticking arond for years. I don't think she's being snubbed so much as the focus has been comparing RA to other brilliant 3yo fillies. To try to draw a comparison, you have to look at a timeline comparison, meaning you only look at Gallorette up to September of her 3yo year.
RA has had a brilliant 3yo campaign and it's fair to compare her to other brilliant 3yo fillies, but not fair to compare her to horses that developed into champions at 4 or beyond.

Colin and Fair Play had a rather on sided rivalry as Colin was never beaten. The horse I'd love to time travel to see would be Domino, but only if I could catch a day when he was sprinting.

Don't get me started on the changing of race names. I hate it with the white hot heat of a thousand suns. NOTHING will sway me, nothing.

depends on the race they're changing. renaming the la troienne made no sense to me, while i would have no problem with renaming the fantasy stakes, or the rebel, the carousel, etc.

[dean smith]

Originally Posted by Antitrust32

I'm looking forward to the $3.75 cent DaTruth Claiming race.

Originally Posted by DaTruth

You should feel honored by the Antitrust 32 Handicap, which is restricted to geldings.

Ah, verbal jousting at its finest... I'm giving the point to DaTruth on that one. "Restricted to geldings" was nice.

[Merlinsky]

Originally Posted by Linny

Colin and Fair Play had a rather on sided rivalry as Colin was never beaten. The horse I'd love to time travel to see would be Domino, but only if I could catch a day when he was sprinting.

Don't get me started on the changing of race names. I hate it with the white hot heat of a thousand suns. NOTHING will sway me, nothing.

It wasn't for lack of trying on Fair Play's part.

About changing race names, I agree. As much as I loved Barbaro, c'mon The Sir Barton was named after a Triple Crown winner. Is nothing sacred? And now there's more than one race named after him. La Troienne was another I was frustrated about. Is the point of changing the race name that it gets to keep grading it already has? I can understand that but geez, some names have a lot of history. I guess I could see renaming the Martha Washington given Rachel's accomplishment there and the fact that a lot of her other wins like the Woodward are gonna stay as they are for sure, but I could see them renaming an Oaks day race. Somebody remind me, what are the options there?

Originally Posted by Danzig

i was thinking sysonby, but too tired to look it up... i read the farley man o'war book-hell, i read everything walter farley wrote!

Rachel could totally school Black Minx. RA doesn't go getting sweet on any of the colts she's racing, now does she? She knows the Godfather maxim, it's not personal, it's business.

[Linny]

Renaming races takes away from the history of the game. When races are named for famous horses or people in the game, carry the name forward, carries a bit of what they did with it. The great mare Maskette deserved a race named for her but if they still run it, it's not the Maskette now. Changing the name of the "John A Morris" undercuts one of the founders of American racing in the "modern" era. I understand that today's observer may identify more with Personal Ensign than Mr Morris, but guess what, in another 50 years people won't be associating with PE and the name Phipps will be an obscurity and the Ogden Phipps H (formerly the Hempstead) will be renamed for the flavor of the month.

[Phalaris1913]

Renaming races takes away from the history of the game. When races are named for famous horses or people in the game, carry the name forward, carries a bit of what they did with it. The great mare Maskette deserved a race named for her but if they still run it, it's not the Maskette now. Changing the name of the "John A Morris" undercuts one of the founders of American racing in the "modern" era. I understand that today's observer may identify more with Personal Ensign than Mr Morris, but guess what, in another 50 years people won't be associating with PE and the name Phipps will be an obscurity and the Ogden Phipps H (formerly the Hempstead) will be renamed for the flavor of the month.

The Maskette became the Go for Wand.

On a slightly different topic, one of my pet peeves is naming races for horses over conditions that have little to nothing to do with what the horse actually accomplished. It irks me how many major turf races are named for horses that never ran on the turf, or never won on it, and likewise, there are numerous major sprint races named for horses that were not best known for sprinting.

[Merlinsky]

Originally Posted by Phalaris1913

The Maskette became the Go for Wand.

On a slightly different topic, one of my pet peeves is naming races for horses over conditions that have little to nothing to do with what the horse actually accomplished. It irks me how many major turf races are named for horses that never ran on the turf, or never won on it, and likewise, there are numerous major sprint races named for horses that were not best known for sprinting.

Secretariat was his stellar self on turf, but I really don't think he or MOW should be having turf races named after them if their most famous races were on dirt unless I'm just missing something that makes it logical. There's no dirt race at Belmont we could give to either one? Given the weight they kept offering to MOW and what they threatened him with at age 4 (140+ lbs) when Riddle asked about running hypothetically, I say a Man O' War Handicap on dirt would be appropriate.

I realize the sponsorship of sporting events by cigarette companies is a problem, but I miss the Marlboro Cup. There ought to be a special allowance by Congress for just that one race. Who's with me?

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by DaTruth

You should feel honored by the Antitrust 32 Handicap, which is restricted to geldings.

lol

[Linny]

Originally Posted by Phalaris1913

The Maskette became the Go for Wand.

On a slightly different topic, one of my pet peeves is naming races for horses over conditions that have little to nothing to do with what the horse actually accomplished. It irks me how many major turf races are named for horses that never ran on the turf, or never won on it, and likewise, there are numerous major sprint races named for horses that were not best known for sprinting.

Like the aformentioned Gallorette. Some of the grass races named for old time horses were on dirt to start but when grass racing becaome popular, they were moved onto turf.

I'm a big GFW fan but still prefer to see old timers remembered with races.

As for the La Troienne, I always thought that a race of that name should be at KEE not CD as she wasn't much of a racemare but earned immortality in the breeding world. KEE is much more a "breeders" track, being in Lexington etc.

[Danzig]

http://www.xpressbet.com/columns.asp...uthor=JonWhite

[dean smith]

Jon White is just tremendous. He is far and away my favorite segment of the week on ATR. He had me drinking that Pioneerof the Nile Kool-Aid during Derby season. I was glad to do it, too.

[Merlinsky]

I was reading the Tim Ice transcript on Bloodhorse http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/talki...isten-now.aspx and he was asked about HOY. He talked about figuring Rachel had it, and he referenced the Haskell, so of course I felt the need to go relive that. Then I clicked on the Woodward video for some more RA fun and saw a couple links to crowd reaction at Saratoga during the race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shsQn...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdGM-OWLPEo&NR=1

Do they do it justice? Tim's such a classy guy, it was great to hear him be so generous.