Derby replaces graded earnings with point system

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by Danzig

i like the idea. anything that persuades more starts is a good thing.

This point system will not persuade more starts...I'm not sure how that conclusion is reached.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

This point system will not persuade more starts...I'm not sure how that conclusion is reached.

well, i guess i'm hoping there will be a minimum point level you'd need to reach?

[NTamm1215]

Where is this 40 pt barrier coming from that's setting off hysteria about the number of horses who would not have made the field in prior years? I see no way that the minimum would be around 40 pts.

[Calzone Lord]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Where is this 40 pt barrier coming from that's setting off hysteria about the number of horses who would not have made the field in prior years? I see no way that the minimum would be around 40 pts.

Probably around 23 to 25 points.

A horse like El Padrino had 53 points after he won the Risen Star. On the point system, he's a lock to get in.

On the Graded Earning system he was only 23rd on April 15th even after he added $50,000 more in the FLA Derby.

The way Pletcher is going with his layoffs ... it's only a matter of time until he wins the Tampa Derby or Risen Star and skips a major prep to come into the Derby "fresh"

[Danzig]

i think they also need to pare the field size down. but then i've been saying that for some time. that would also force a need to run more to make the field.

[Calzone Lord]

The part that's most puzzling to me is how they think this will help make new fans of horse racing or increase interest in the event.

I can understand a point system during the triple crown series. I can understand a point system during the season to crown divisional champions or a Horse of the Year.

From a gimmicky marketing angle -- that might be a good idea...and it might get the affect they're looking for.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

The part that's most puzzling to me is how they think this will help make new fans of horse racing or increase interest in the event.

I can understand a point system during the triple crown series. I can understand a point system during the season to crown divisional champions or a Horse of the Year.

From a gimmicky marketing angle -- that might be a good idea...and it might get the affect they're looking for.

i think it's just to generate more interest in the other races-wonder if nbc suggested some changes? they have to be happy that even tho IHA scratched, the belmont still had a ratings increase. anything that helps get more viewers, generates interest in all these other big races (i hate that many races are no called preps when they're good races in their own right) is a good thing.

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by Calzone Lord

Probably around 23 to 25 points.

A horse like El Padrino had 53 points after he won the Risen Star. On the point system, he's a lock to get in.

On the Graded Earning system he was only 23rd on April 15th even after he added $50,000 more in the FLA Derby.

The way Pletcher is going with his layoffs ... it's only a matter of time until he wins the Tampa Derby or Risen Star and skips a major prep to come into the Derby "fresh"

But, the thing about that is, a number of the races that were used by horses who were ahead of him on the earnings list at that point don't matter anymore. Sabercat was ahead of him at that point, as were Liaison and Rousing Sermon.

Discounting the 2YO races is a good idea IMO, but the Juvenile should have been given more weight. While he was certainly an exception, Action This Day probably would have not made it into the 2004 Derby field under this system.

[slotdirt]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Where is this 40 pt barrier coming from that's setting off hysteria about the number of horses who would not have made the field in prior years? I see no way that the minimum would be around 40 pts.

http://news.cincinnati.com/usatoday/...t%7CSports%7Cs

I believe the article states to feel "safe," one needs 40 points.

[Linny]

Originally Posted by Danzig

well, i guess i'm hoping there will be a minimum point level you'd need to reach?

There is no minimum level, it's just the top 20. Just like using graded earnings, the cutoff if dependant upon what others do. Forty was bandied about as being a probably minimum.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Linny

There is no minimum level, it's just the top 20. Just like using graded earnings, the cutoff if dependant upon what others do. Forty was bandied about as being a probably minimum.

oh, i see.
well, i think they should institute a minimum, and i think the other two spring classics should consider something like this as well.
they also need to try to get a sponsor for a bonus involving the three races, something to encourage more horses to run the series. only one horse 'ran' in all three this year, optimizer.

[Linny]

The Preakness and Belmont are rarely oversubscribed so they have not had to implement a system, though te Preakness does have one.

It would be nice to have a way to encourage participation in all three races. For a while there was a bonus system that rewarded horses who ran in all three. It came to an end when someone (can't recall who) won the bonus for having run something like 3rd or 4th or 5th in all of them.