When "Neighborhood Watch" Gets Out of Hand

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Danzig

rupe, i appreciate your detailed assessment but all of the above is not something new to me. however, it seems you completely ignored the part where i said 'he was NOT a member of neighborhood watch. had he been, perhaps he'd have known they don't want their members carrying guns. i guess you also ignored the part where the 911 operator told zimmerman not to confront trayvon.
i've also seen where there is no indication of there having been a scuffle, which belies your post.

There are 2 or 3 published 9-11 tapes of callers reporting a man down on the ground, screaming for help, and then a shot that stills the screams The scuffle (if it lasted during the screaming) is at least 45 (correction, 41) seconds long, not including the time it was happening before people telephoned it in as it was happening. ABC News must have a source, as they have the most information available from the PD (the tapes, etc)

Here's the tape of the 41 seconds of screaming for help, with the gunshot stilling the screams. Warning if you have triggers or PTSD. It's graphic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj4RHJ0taoc

Here's the MSMBC color video of Zimmerman at the police station in handcuffs. You can clearly see, in a couple places, as Zimmerman has very close hair, there is no 2-inch skull laceration on the top of his head as alleged by Daily Caller. And these clothes have zero blood or grass on them (either front of shirt or back) and they are the clothes described by witnesses that Zimmerman was wearing at the time

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...artin-shooting

You know what I think happened? Zimmerman grabbed the kid, and was trying to restrain him for the police (hence the screaming for help by Trayvon, as a stranger grabbed him), he took out his gun from his waist holster to threaten the kid, and it accidentally went off and shot the kid dead on in the chest (yeah, they say it was a front entry wound).

Mortitian also says zero evidence of fight or wounds on Trayvon's body.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Riot

There are 2 or 3 published 9-11 tapes of callers reporting a man down on the ground, screaming for help, and then a shot that stills the screams The scuffle (if it lasted during the screaming) is at least 45 (correction, 41) seconds long, not including the time it was happening before people telephoned it in as it was happening. ABC News must have a source, as they have the most information available from the PD (the tapes, etc)

Here's the tape of the 41 seconds of screaming for help, with the gunshot stilling the screams. Warning if you have triggers or PTSD. It's graphic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj4RHJ0taoc

Here's the MSMBC color video of Zimmerman at the police station in handcuffs. You can clearly see, in a couple places, as Zimmerman has very close hair, there is no 2-inch skull laceration on the top of his head as alleged by Daily Caller. And these clothes have zero blood or grass on them (either front of shirt or back) and they are the clothes described by witnesses that Zimmerman was wearing at the time

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...artin-shooting

You know what I think happened? Zimmerman grabbed the kid, and was trying to restrain him for the police (hence the screaming for help by Trayvon, as a stranger grabbed him), he took out his gun from his waist holster to threaten the kid, and it accidentally went off and shot the kid dead on in the chest (yeah, they say it was a front entry wound).

Mortitian also says zero evidence of fight or wounds on Trayvon's body.

I disagree with you about the video. I think right at :41 seconds on the video, you can see the mark on the back of his head. Before I even read the dailycaller article and saw the still picture, I saw it on the video.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Now that we have the state attorney general, FBI, and the Justice Department involved, are you guys confident that there will be a thorough investigation?

[Riot]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Now that we have the state attorney general, FBI, and the Justice Department involved, are you guys confident that there will be a thorough investigation?

Well, the FBI & Justice only prosecutes a hate crime, to my knowledge. And I thought Justice was also looking at performance of that PD overall due to their past record?

But they have a special prosecutor locally now, she has a great rep. If she says she's done a thorough investigation, and no charges should be brought, I'm good with that. Grand Jury to meet the 10th, but I think she can go ahead on her own before if she wanted.

[GenuineRisk]

Now three experts in voice recognition are saying they are certain the screams on the 911 calls are not Zimmerman's:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,250481.story

Also, a second ambulance was originally called for Zimmerman (first one was for Trayvon's corpse), but then cancelled:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...#ixzz1qiRUs3nD

Which doesn't help the claim that Zimmerman was seriously injured.

I wonder how "temporary" the Sanford Police Chief's stepping down from his position is going to be.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by GenuineRisk

Now three experts in voice recognition are saying they are certain the screams on the 911 calls are not Zimmerman's:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,250481.story

Also, a second ambulance was originally called for Zimmerman (first one was for Trayvon's corpse), but then cancelled:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...#ixzz1qiRUs3nD

Which doesn't help the claim that Zimmerman was seriously injured.

I wonder how "temporary" the Sanford Police Chief's stepping down from his position is going to be.

I think Trayvon's father would know his son's voice. When they played him the tape, he said that the voice yelling for help was not Trayvon. Later he changed his mind but he likely changed his mind after he realized that it would hurt his case if he admitted that it was the other guy that was screaming for help.

I'm certainly no expert on voice recognition but I am still pretty skeptical that they could tell whether it was Zimmerman by comparing his "speaking voice" with his "screaming for help voice". Even from what the article said, it is certainly not an exact science like DNA. It will be interesting to see if any other voice recognition experts come forward and have the opposite opinion of the experts cited in the article.

It is certainly possible that Zimmerman is lying and that he is the one that initiated the physical confrontation. Then maybe when he was losing the fight, he pulled out his gun and shot Trayvon. I can't totally rule that out. If that is what happened then that would not be self-defense. That would probably be manslaughter. But even if that is what happened, they still have to prove it. They have to come up with some evidence that shows that Zimmerman's version of what happened is false.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I think Trayvon's father would know his son's voice. When they played him the tape, he said that the voice yelling for help was not Trayvon. Later he changed his mind but he likely changed his mind after he realized that it would hurt his case if he admitted that it was the other guy that was screaming for help.

I'm certainly no expert on voice recognition but I am still pretty skeptical that they could tell whether it was Zimmerman by comparing his "speaking voice" with his "screaming for help voice". Even from what the article said, it is certainly not an exact science like DNA. It will be interesting to see if any other voice recognition experts come forward and have the opposite opinion of the experts cited in the article.

It is certainly possible that Zimmerman is lying and that he is the one that initiated the physical confrontation. Then maybe when he was losing the fight, he pulled out his gun and shot Trayvon. I can't totally rule that out. If that is what happened then that would not be self-defense. That would probably be manslaughter. But even if that is what happened, they still have to prove it. They have to come up with some evidence that shows that Zimmerman's version of what happened is false.

just saw a headline this morning that the voice recognition guy said the screams weren't zimmerman.
and of course he will say trayvon attacked him-he just killed someone. you think he's not going to say he was defending himself?? the fact is had he not gotten out of his car and gone after him-which is what they told him not to do-we wouldn't be having this conversation. he had no reason to get out of the car, he had no reason or right to confront trayvon. on what basis did he accost the boy? and exactly what did he think he was going to accomplish by approaching a total stranger-with him having absolutely no authority to do so. even if he were a member of neighborhood watch-note the name. WATCH. no, try to emulate clint eastwood.
put yourself in trayvons shoes. you're walking home, with skittles and a drink. some guy is following you, which freaks you out. the guy's not a cop, not in a cop car, not a security guy. just a total stranger.