Are the Patriots better without Randy Moss?

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

It's not like Steve Young was Matt Cassel though. He was a really good QB in his own right and if I'm remembering it correctly was making more as a backup than many starters were making.

Do you guys think Brady would be Brady without Belichick? If Tom Brady played for the Lions would he be this well thought of? I doubt it. You have to have help. Both Montana and Brady have gotten their fair share of help, both coaching and with their teams.

That's a fair question with Brady and belichick but isn't it just as plausible to wonder where the lions would be if belichick was coaching them? What was bill as a head coach before Brady? Fired once and on his way to being fired again.

I think there are a few people that owe Brady some money. Romeo crennel? That idiot in Denver? Charlie Weiss??

These guys are proven nothings without Brady and really so is belichick although I think he is a great coach.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

That's a fair question with Brady and belichick but isn't it just as plausible to wonder where the lions would be if belichick was coaching them? What was bill as a head coach before Brady? Fired once and on his way to being fired again.

I think there are a few people that owe Brady some money. Romeo crennel? That idiot in Denver? Charlie Weiss??

These guys are proven nothings without Brady and really so is belichick although I think he is a great coach.

The thing is, Matt Cassel won 11 games under the Belichick system. Belichick coached the Browns to an 11 win season and a playoff win. The Browns, think about that.

They are both great but I think neither would be what they are without the other.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by Dahoss

The thing is, Matt Cassel won 11 games under the Belichick system. Belichick coached the Browns to an 11 win season and a playoff win. The Browns, think about that.

They are both great but I think neither would be what they are without the other.

That was the pre-move to Baltimore Browns. It was a completely different organization than the current Browns. A ton of guys won coaching in that organization before the move and still are currently in Baltimore. It's an organization with 5 NFL championships. Winning 11 there was hardly anything special at all.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

That was the pre-move to Baltimore Browns. It was a completely different organization than the current Browns. A ton of guys won coaching in that organization before the move and still are currently in Baltimore. It's an organization with 5 NFL championships. Winning 11 there was hardly anything special at all.

Marty schottenheimer and Sam rutigliano to name two.

[Dahoss]

Originally Posted by horseofcourse

That was the pre-move to Baltimore Browns. It was a completely different organization than the current Browns. A ton of guys won coaching in that organization before the move and still are currently in Baltimore. It's an organization with 5 NFL championships. Winning 11 there was hardly anything special at all.

You're right, Cleveland really has a rich tradition of winning. You guys have had three 11 win seasons in the last 50 years. Belichick coached one of them.

[nebrady]

Who doesn't think vick has learned what its all about! He now realizes he has a gift but knows it not a 9-5 job and has learned to appreciate the god given talent he has. Hes done everything right and can you imagine if moss learned from vick. As for brady being the best, he has 3 rings and right now maybe playing the best ever. Yeah he maybe part of a system, but how many people said the patiriots were rebuilding? Bellichick is a master of the draft and having draft picks for the future. Say what you want he is a great coach. As for montana being overrated, really? How soon we forget the drive against cincy when he got in the huddle and told them were going down the field and winning this game. Which he did!