Best horses of the 1980's by division

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

And what about John Henry? Even though he ran more often on the grass, he was just as good on the dirt as the grass. He was a much better horse than Ferdinand.

I don't agree at all that John Henry was just as good on dirt as he was on grass.

Here's John Henry's career on dirt in stakes races - races from most recent on:

Hollywood Gold Cup: 2nd by 2

Santa Anita Handicap: 5th by 8

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 5th by 7

Meadowlands Cup: 3rd by 6

Santa Anita Handicap: 2nd by a nose - placed 1st through DQ

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 1st by a head over Peat Moss

Hollywood Gold Cup: 4th by 3

Santa Anita Handicap: 1st by 1 over King Go Go

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 2nd by 5.5

San Marcos Stakes: 1st by 2.5 over El Fantastico

Capital City Handicap: 4th by 2 (33K stake at Penn National)

Mass Cap: 10th by 8.5

I think John Henry was clearly a better turf horse. At age 9, he won the final six turf races of his career - all major turf races.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

I don't agree at all that John Henry was just as good on dirt as he was on grass.

Here's John Henry's career on dirt in stakes races - races from most recent on:

Hollywood Gold Cup: 2nd by 2

Santa Anita Handicap: 5th by 8

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 5th by 7

Meadowlands Cup: 3rd by 6

Santa Anita Handicap: 2nd by a nose - placed 1st through DQ

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 1st by a head over Peat Moss

Hollywood Gold Cup: 4th by 3

Santa Anita Handicap: 1st by 1 over King Go Go

Jockey Club Gold Cup: 2nd by 5.5

San Marcos Stakes: 1st by 2.5 over El Fantastico

Capital City Handicap: 4th by 2 (33K stake at Penn National)

Mass Cap: 10th by 8.5

I think John Henry was clearly a better turf horse. At age 9, he won the final six turf races of his career - all major turf races.

Looking at the stats, I think you are right. It was so long ago. I remembered him winning the SA Handicap a couple of times. He was my favorite horse at the time. I remember him winning a lot of big races on the dirt.

Are you sure he ran 2nd in the Jockey Club Gold Cup? At pedigreequery.com, it shows that he won that race. It was so long ago, I can't remember whether he won it or ran 2nd. I think he won it but I'm not sure.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Looking at the stats, I think you are right. It was so long ago. I remembered him winning the SA Handicap a couple of times. He was my favorite horse at the time. I remember him winning a lot of big races on the dirt.

Are you sure he ran 2nd in the Jockey Club Gold Cup? At pedigreequery.com, it shows that he won that race. It was so long ago, I can't remember whether he won it or ran 2nd. I think he won it but I'm not sure.

Maybe you should look at the list again.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Maybe you should look at the list again.

I see it now. He had a win and a 2nd in the JCGC.

[keithting]

Conquistador Cielo's Met Mile followed shortly by his Belmont victory was one of the highlights of the 1980's - but I don't know if it would have occurred without the Masterful training of Woody Stephens - look at the career of Creme Fraiche and you can only start to appreciate his great talents as a horse trainer

I was at Silver Buck's win in the July 4, 1982 Suburban at Belmont and remember that Eliott Burch had the colt in peak condition - I don't think anyone could have beaten him that day

IMO Winter Tale was much better than his race record due to chronic shin problems that plagued him alot

I was curious how high Track Barron and Vanlandingham were ranked on the list of 1980 horses

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Cardus

Manila first.

no way. i can only think of one u.s. turf horse i would rank ahead of the great john henry, and that would be round table. i was a fan of manila, but no way he is ahead of john.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Manila beat the toughest BC Turf field ever assembled - and I think it's likely his best turf races were a little better than John Henry's best ... but when you take overall body of work into account .. it's really not that close between the two.