7/3-5 (BEL): Suburban (G2); Prioress (G1); Bed of Roses (G3)

[RolloTomasi]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Agree to disagree.... I don't think he is much, I see RR or Convocation winning this. IWR will struggle, IMO.

You don't think he's much based on his race record or are you banking on his injury/layoff compromising his chances?

[philcski]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

You don't think he's much based on his race record or are you banking on his injury/layoff compromising his chances?

No chance I would bet this horse at his 7/5 ML off the injury/layoff. I think that's what Joe's saying as well.

Given the amount of speed in here, I like Convocation- but if Eldaafer drifts up to 15-1 or so I'll throw a little bit that way as well.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by RolloTomasi

You don't think he's much based on his race record or are you banking on his injury/layoff compromising his chances?

I want no part of him at all off of this injury and this layoff... I actually heard a public handicapper today, say he could be the best horse in the country if he comes back ok.... I spit my soda out, thats how hard it made me laugh, then cringe. So many reassons why that is not likely to happen, his injury was serious, not the type that all horses just come back from, its been 15 months, who knows if he can even run at all anymore? Then if everything goes 100% great and perfect for the connections, and he comes back strong, now he is better then Quality Road and Blame? I dont buy it, I dont buy it at all... I like Regal Ransom moving forward, and I could be wrong about him... But in this spot, Im playing Regal Ransom and Convocation in some order...

As for his race record, I am normally the guy who goes crazy off of big efforts, and I never did for this horse. I never liked him much, I never liked what he beat and I just was never sold on him, again maybe Im wrong... I can tell you this though, the list of horses who jump up 10-25 beyer points from synthetic-dirt is ENDLESS... It happens every weekend in a stakes at Lone Star or Belmont, horses are bred for dirt. So IWR improved a lot, and beat up on total ****. He dodged QR, because QR was busy turning in triple digit beyers taking the Florida route to the Derby and when he face POTN on synthetics he could not beat him, not that that really matters.

So to officialy answer your question I think his race record is dressed up, and I think the layoff/injury are huge huge concerns and I dont think he was ever that good to begin with.

[blackthroatedwind]

I'm not very smart, so bear with me....but how is prefacing a statement with " he could " incorrect?

By the way, I Want Revenge has gone from " suspect returning from an injury " to " mortal lock " with your gibberish.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

By the way, I Want Revenge has gone from " suspect returning from an injury " to " mortal lock " with your gibberish.

Has Rudy or Sidney taken over the training of the horse?

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I'm not very smart, so bear with me....but how is prefacing a statement with " he could " incorrect?

By the way, I Want Revenge has gone from " suspect returning from an injury " to " mortal lock " with your gibberish.

I could be better then you?

I could be president?

Very silly, right?

Its just my opinion Andy, your likely right.... I just dont think he is much.
I do have to defend myself a little, and I dont think anything I said was gibberish. Also, I said not likely to happen, the older crop is not **** like last year, he would have to come back as good and then improve to be the best.

[10 pnt move up]

The Prioress is usually a really good race between the Acorn and the Test, any idea why it attracted such a small field?

[blackthroatedwind]

Once again, since you didn't answer my question, how is saying " he could " wrong?

Regardless of your opinion, which whether good or bad can be wrong, I Want Revenge was the pre-Derby co-favorite with Quality Road, and the favorite when that one was scratched. His two dirt races last year were tremendous. Of course he is tremendously suspect on Saturday. That goes without saying. But, that doesn't change the possibility that he COULD pick up where he left off last year. Yes, I too will believe it when I see it, but that doesn't change the existance of the possibility.

[NTamm1215]

I'm no veterinarian but wasn't IWR's injury one that horses normally don't return from or are rarely the same afterwards?

NT

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I'm no veterinarian but wasn't IWR's injury one that horses normally don't return from or are rarely the same afterwards?

NT

So it seems....but are we absolutely sure what exactly was wrong with him and haven't there been some recent advances treating his supposed injury?

Believe me, I'm dubious, or at least was until reading some recent posting here. Now I can't see him losing.

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Once again, since you didn't answer my question, how is saying " he could " wrong?

Regardless of your opinion, which whether good or bad can be wrong, I Want Revenge was the pre-Derby co-favorite with Quality Road, and the favorite when that one was scratched. His two dirt races last year were tremendous. Of course he is tremendously suspect on Saturday. That goes without saying. But, that doesn't change the possibility that he COULD pick up where he left off last year. Yes, I too will believe it when I see it, but that doesn't change the existance of the possibility.

Direct answer to your question....
I never said you were wrong, go read it again... My exact words were, "So manys reassons why thats not likely to happen"

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

Direct answer to your question....
I never said you were wrong, go read it again... My exact words were, "So manys reassons why thats not likely to happen"

I know what you wrote. It was a veiled cheap shot.

Be a man if you're going to do it in the future.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

I'm no veterinarian but wasn't IWR's injury one that horses normally don't return from or are rarely the same afterwards?

NT

From what I know, you are correct.

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

So it seems....but are we absolutely sure what exactly was wrong with him and haven't there been some recent advances treating his supposed injury?

Believe me, I'm dubious, or at least was until reading some recent posting here. Now I can't see him losing.

By all reports I've heard it was a suspensory, which in my only slightly-above-layman's understanding is when it is severely injured it's like a rubber band that has been stretched too far. It rarely regains it's previous strength/form. There supposedly has been advances in electromagnetic treatments, but I still think it's still pretty dubious. Let's face it, if there was any stallion market at ALL out there he would have been long gone. I think it's 1 in 10 that he returns to his previous form.

[miraja2]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

As for his race record, I am normally the guy who goes crazy off of big efforts, and I never did for this horse. I never liked him much, I never liked what he beat and I just was never sold on him, again maybe Im wrong... I can tell you this though, the list of horses who jump up 10-25 beyer points from synthetic-dirt is ENDLESS... It happens every weekend in a stakes at Lone Star or Belmont, horses are bred for dirt. So IWR improved a lot, and beat up on total ****. He dodged QR, because QR was busy turning in triple digit beyers taking the Florida route to the Derby and when he face POTN on synthetics he could not beat him, not that that really matters.

So to officialy answer your question I think his race record is dressed up, and I think the layoff/injury are huge huge concerns and I dont think he was ever that good to begin with.

If you didn't like him the days leading up to last year's Derby I think you were crazy. I went to bed last year on that Friday night more convinced than I ever had been that I knew who was going to win that race. His Wood Memorial was simply outstanding and there is every reason to believe that without the injury he could have had a dominant season last year.

None of that means that playing against him in this race is the wrong move, but his return certainly has me intrigued.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by miraja2

If you didn't like him the days leading up to last year's Derby I think you were crazy. I went to bed last year on that Friday night more convinced than I ever had been that I knew who was going to win that race. His Wood Memorial was simply outstanding and there is every reason to believe that without the injury he could have had a dominant season last year.

None of that means that playing against him in this race is the wrong move, but his return certainly has me intrigued.

I didn't like him going into the Derby. Between reports of his possible injury and my utter lack of trust of Mullins under any type of scrutiny I was not going to bet him at 2-1. That's not to discount his Wood Memorial performance which was outstanding of course.

That being said, last years' Derby is still inscrutable to me and we know the results!

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by miraja2

If you didn't like him the days leading up to last year's Derby I think you were crazy. I went to bed last year on that Friday night more convinced than I ever had been that I knew who was going to win that race. His Wood Memorial was simply outstanding and there is every reason to believe that without the injury he could have had a dominant season last year.

None of that means that playing against him in this race is the wrong move, but his return certainly has me intrigued.

I did not like him at all going into the Derby.... I loved QR till he got hurt. IWR was a hype horse IMO that I was not falling for and trying to beat based on him running 2 giant races vs horrible competition. I thought the FL races were stronger, and POTN would improve on dirt, just like IWR did.
Derby day I based all my bets around Pioneer of the Nile and Dunkirk....
I guess Im crazy to like the horse who ran second.

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by RockHardTen1985

I did not like him at all going into the Derby.... I loved QR till he got hurt. IWR was a hype horse IMO that I was not falling for and trying to beat based on him running 2 giant races vs horrible competition. .

You mean..

kinda like....

Eskenderya?

[RockHardTen1985]

Originally Posted by Indian Charlie

You mean..

kinda like....

Eskenderya?

Maybe, but I doubt it. Esky was the goods.

[Kasept]

MONDAY 9th (5:17) Bed o' Roses H. (G3)

7 Furlongs | Fillies and Mares | 3 Year Olds And Up Stakes | Purse: $150,000

1 Qualia Maragh R 115 L
2 Devil by Design Desormeaux K J 114 L
3 Amazing Luzzi M J 115 L
4 My Dinah Espinoza J L 112 L
5 Lady Alexander Lopez C C 115 L
6 Rightly So Velasquez C 114 L
7 Nicksappealinglady Garcia Alan 112 L
8 McVictory Dominguez R A 114 L

[Left Bank]

WOW! Haynesfield looked like he wasn't even trying.