SUN: Racing's media makeover paying off

[cmorioles]

Will these new, younger and female fans bet in the future?

[Kasept]

@CHUCK: You have to start a turnaround somewhere. Would it be better if the viewership had stayed even or dropped?

@CJ: The typical transition of intigued patron to horseplayer is that of someone introduced to the game at ages 18-30, and then is drawn into the sport more and more as they mature. With more leisure time and expendable income, those increasingly intrerested parties begin to bet more. I don't think that gender will mean anything long term, and that it's rather sexist and presumptuous to suggest that the young women that may be getting interested earlier in the sport now via Bravo or whatever are less likely to bet than young men. And in fact, I'd suggest that they'd be a lot MORE inclined to take up horseplaying than getting involved in trying to become sports gamblers where access is tremendously limited.

As I've suggested before on ATR, females, Afro-Americans and especially Hispanics are the areas of the potential patron/player growth the game has stupidly failed to court.

[Indian Charlie]

I like females.

I love lamp.

[Riot]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

Will these new, younger and female fans bet in the future?

Women are financially self-sufficient, they have plenty of disposable income, they can access horse racing from the snuggly comfort of their homes, and they are far more likely to have successful gambling experiences than their male counterparts, IMO. You won't see a college girl lose the entire semester's financial aid in one drunken afternoon at the track, and swear off gambling forever.

I'd love to see YouBet or Xpressbet's demographics. I'd guess 1/3 are women.

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by Riot

Women are financially self-sufficient, they have plenty of disposable income, they can access horse racing from the snuggly comfort of their homes, and they are far more likely to have successful gambling experiences than their male counterparts, IMO. You won't see a college girl lose the entire semester's financial aid in one drunken afternoon at the track, and swear off gambling forever.

I'd love to see YouBet or Xpressbet's demographics. I'd guess 1/3 are women.

I would take the under.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

I would take the under.

For a couple million please?

[MaTH716]

Originally Posted by Scav

For a couple million please?

I just don't see it. When my wife and I were dating, she had a great job and enjoyed to gamble. We both used to go to Atlantic City often. Then I started taking her to Monmouth in the summer and she liked it. But it was more of a day out type thing. She would look at a program and pick names. She wasn't spending minute's/hours capping races and sequances. She wanted to pick her horses and go back to her magazines that she used to bring. Even when we were home and I would bet by phone, she really couldn't care less about it. And she had the base as well. Meaning her father and brother played the horses and her mother works at OTB.
Now that I really think about it, I think the number is way under the 1/3rd that Riot is looking for.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

I just don't see it. When my wife and I were dating, she had a great job and enjoyed to gamble. We both used to go to Atlantic City often. Then I started taking her to Monmouth in the summer and she liked it. But it was more of a day out type thing. She would look at a program and pick names. She wasn't spending minute's/hours capping races and sequances. She wanted to pick her horses and go back to her magazines that she used to bring. Even when we were home and I would bet by phone, she really couldn't care less about it. And she had the base as well. Meaning her father and brother played the horses and her mother works at OTB.
Now that I really think about it, I think the number is way under the 1/3rd that Riot is looking for.

It is more like 1 in 20 or maybe even 1 in 30.

The thought that woman are going to take a 1/4 of their paycheck, spend the night before handicapping, get to the track before the first race for their favorite area, get a voucher, send in some $24 P3 tickets, and focus all day at the track is absolutely nuts.

Don't get me wrong, I love woman at the racetrack but 99% of them are there for one or many of the following reasons

1) Nothing to do in the area so they can go be outside and have some drinks
2) Their group of guy friends are going out there and they are tagging along
3) It is a 'big deal' day and they get to dress up and look all hot, thus gathering massive amounts of attention all day
4) They are taking their family out there to show the kids the jockeys and the ponies
5) They are getting dragged out there by their boyfriend
6) They are on a date out there (actually a great idea for anyone that hasn't tried this, just go to a different track then your local hole)
7) They are there because they actually like racing, and they are betting, but in small amounts

I think even the girls on this board will admit they are not rolling to the track with $300 ready to go apeshit the whole day. I have been to the track with both Sightseek and Uncly. Sightseek was all dressed up and all about the horses, including repeativitly telling me how awesome She Be Wild was, when I didn't use her at all, and she maybe bet $50-$60 the whole day ..Uncly went and had a beer with me and was yelling exactas and win bets at this kid and bet all of maybe $60 the whole day and she was happy as pie.

Both of these girls have decent jobs, can handle themselves in a horse racing conversation and are completely competent with a Form, more then probably 90% of the woman in this world, and they are still aren't firing away.

[hockey2315]

Repeativitly?

[DerbyCat]

Originally Posted by Scav

The thought that woman are going to take a 1/4 of their paycheck, spend the night before handicapping, get to the track before the first race for their favorite area, get a voucher, send in some $24 P3 tickets, and focus all day at the track is absolutely nuts.

I think even the girls on this board will admit they are not rolling to the track with $300 ready to go apeshit the whole day.

Well, I guess I'm not the typical DT chick, I buy the form regularly from the local smoke shop, I take hundreds with me to the track (lost $250 Sunday) and I fire with both fists at P3's and P4's. I love this game but if I didn't have disposable income I could never afford it. I also collect racing art and other memorabilia, donate to rescue groups and listen to Byk's radio show But I know I am the rare female fan.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Scav

It is more like 1 in 20 or maybe even 1 in 30.

The thought that woman are going to take a 1/4 of their paycheck, spend the night before handicapping, get to the track before the first race for their favorite area, get a voucher, send in some $24 P3 tickets, and focus all day at the track is absolutely nuts.

Don't get me wrong, I love woman at the racetrack but 99% of them are there for one or many of the following reasons

1) Nothing to do in the area so they can go be outside and have some drinks
2) Their group of guy friends are going out there and they are tagging along
3) It is a 'big deal' day and they get to dress up and look all hot, thus gathering massive amounts of attention all day
4) They are taking their family out there to show the kids the jockeys and the ponies
5) They are getting dragged out there by their boyfriend
6) They are on a date out there (actually a great idea for anyone that hasn't tried this, just go to a different track then your local hole)
7) They are there because they actually like racing, and they are betting, but in small amounts

I think even the girls on this board will admit they are not rolling to the track with $300 ready to go apeshit the whole day. I have been to the track with both Sightseek and Uncly. Sightseek was all dressed up and all about the horses, including repeativitly telling me how awesome She Be Wild was, when I didn't use her at all, and she maybe bet $50-$60 the whole day ..Uncly went and had a beer with me and was yelling exactas and win bets at this kid and bet all of maybe $60 the whole day and she was happy as pie.

Both of these girls have decent jobs, can handle themselves in a horse racing conversation and are completely competent with a Form, more then probably 90% of the woman in this world, and they are still aren't firing away.

This is very narrow. It is thinking like this that limits the sport. You can't make statements like "99%" of anything based on the limited sampling of people in which you have come in contact. Its a big world out there Scav.

I am bringing a $1000 to the Preakness on Saturday. Yeah, its not break the bank money but it will be enough to play pick 4's, three horse exacta boxes and maybe some tri's in the bigger fields and yes I will keep firing until the last race.

Some of what you say is true. Book club is not exactly packed with horseplayers or girlfriends that would even know how to make a wager. At the same time, I run into plenty of women that are either into the sport in some fashion or would LIKE to be.

I would love some demographic breakdowns on poker, table games or even lotteries. I would bet (more than $2 scav) that the percentage of females in these gambling endeavors is rising. Forget just gaming, look at the way the NFL markets to women. Is it just a coincidence that the meteoric rise of the NFL as the overwhelmingly dominant sport in the US coincided with the way the sport marketed to women? How about Nascar? How about professional poker? Look at what hockey is doing during this renaissance.

Steve said it perfectly. Do you guys really think that the trends of women and minorities as sports fans and gamblers is going to suddenly begin to revert?

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Scav

It is more like 1 in 20 or maybe even 1 in 30.

The thought that woman are going to take a 1/4 of their paycheck, spend the night before handicapping, get to the track before the first race for their favorite area, get a voucher, send in some $24 P3 tickets, and focus all day at the track is absolutely nuts.

Don't get me wrong, I love woman at the racetrack but 99% of them are there for one or many of the following reasons

1) Nothing to do in the area so they can go be outside and have some drinks
2) Their group of guy friends are going out there and they are tagging along
3) It is a 'big deal' day and they get to dress up and look all hot, thus gathering massive amounts of attention all day
4) They are taking their family out there to show the kids the jockeys and the ponies
5) They are getting dragged out there by their boyfriend
6) They are on a date out there (actually a great idea for anyone that hasn't tried this, just go to a different track then your local hole)
7) They are there because they actually like racing, and they are betting, but in small amounts

I think even the girls on this board will admit they are not rolling to the track with $300 ready to go apeshit the whole day. I have been to the track with both Sightseek and Uncly. Sightseek was all dressed up and all about the horses, including repeativitly telling me how awesome She Be Wild was, when I didn't use her at all, and she maybe bet $50-$60 the whole day ..Uncly went and had a beer with me and was yelling exactas and win bets at this kid and bet all of maybe $60 the whole day and she was happy as pie.

Both of these girls have decent jobs, can handle themselves in a horse racing conversation and are completely competent with a Form, more then probably 90% of the woman in this world, and they are still aren't firing away.

its because I know and learned early that betting lots of money was a sure way to lose lots of money. its more of a fun time for me. If I bet $60 and win back $40 I'm only down 20 bucks and had a blast. If I'd bet $300 and win back $150 i'm down $150 and pissed and I'm not in the mood to struggle with bills. I've been going to the track for half my life now (yeah i know i'm only 27) but i've seen many degenerates lose lots of

Like I said in the other thread.. its the responsibility factor that keeps women away from the windows.

And dont expect Bravo to change that.. history usually repeats itself.. and for history this has been mostly a male dominated sport. And its not at all sexist to feel that way.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Scav

It is more like 1 in 20 or maybe even 1 in 30.

The thought that woman are going to take a 1/4 of their paycheck, spend the night before handicapping, get to the track before the first race for their favorite area, get a voucher, send in some $24 P3 tickets, and focus all day at the track is absolutely nuts.

Don't get me wrong, I love woman at the racetrack but 99% of them are there for one or many of the following reasons

1) Nothing to do in the area so they can go be outside and have some drinks
2) Their group of guy friends are going out there and they are tagging along
3) It is a 'big deal' day and they get to dress up and look all hot, thus gathering massive amounts of attention all day
4) They are taking their family out there to show the kids the jockeys and the ponies
5) They are getting dragged out there by their boyfriend
6) They are on a date out there (actually a great idea for anyone that hasn't tried this, just go to a different track then your local hole)
7) They are there because they actually like racing, and they are betting, but in small amounts

I think even the girls on this board will admit they are not rolling to the track with $300 ready to go apeshit the whole day. I have been to the track with both Sightseek and Uncly. Sightseek was all dressed up and all about the horses, including repeativitly telling me how awesome She Be Wild was, when I didn't use her at all, and she maybe bet $50-$60 the whole day ..Uncly went and had a beer with me and was yelling exactas and win bets at this kid and bet all of maybe $60 the whole day and she was happy as pie.

Both of these girls have decent jobs, can handle themselves in a horse racing conversation and are completely competent with a Form, more then probably 90% of the woman in this world, and they are still aren't firing away.

While I am not betting as much as you and others, you are really underestimating how much I bet. On track, I bet less, especially at a track new to me that I don't normally play, but my Twinspires account gets much more action than you think. Just because I'm not posting in the selections thread, don't think I'm not spending my Saturdays "like a guy" enjoying the racing and betting.


Steve - I really appreciate the open mind on women and horse racing and gambling.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Scav

Both of these girls have decent jobs, can handle themselves in a horse racing conversation and are completely competent with a Form, more then probably 90% of the woman in this world, and they are still aren't firing away.

At the risk of drawing further ire....

You would get a long way if you referred to them as " women. "

On the other highlighted part......what percentage, pray tell, of men are " completely competent with a Form " and feel free to include yourself.

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by MaTH716

I just don't see it. When my wife and I were dating, she had a great job and enjoyed to gamble. We both used to go to Atlantic City often. Then I started taking her to Monmouth in the summer and she liked it. But it was more of a day out type thing. She would look at a program and pick names. She wasn't spending minute's/hours capping races and sequances. She wanted to pick her horses and go back to her magazines that she used to bring. Even when we were home and I would bet by phone, she really couldn't care less about it. And she had the base as well. Meaning her father and brother played the horses and her mother works at OTB.
Now that I really think about it, I think the number is way under the 1/3rd that Riot is looking for.

that could get touchy! I do think that lots of people (women too) sign up for accounts to bet the Derby or something.. so i could see the sign up list being 1/4 women.

If you go by daily active accounts, which I feel is actually gambling.. its probably 1/10 or higher..

[Antitrust32]

Originally Posted by Scav

For a couple million please?

me too

[Port Conway Lane]

Originally Posted by Riot

Women are financially self-sufficient, they have plenty of disposable income, they can access horse racing from the snuggly comfort of their homes, and they are far more likely to have successful gambling experiences than their male counterparts, IMO. You won't see a college girl lose the entire semester's financial aid in one drunken afternoon at the track, and swear off gambling forever.

Yes, but the difference is that the college boy won't swear it off. He'll be back the next semester reloaded.