Pletcher going to California

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Pletcherism spreads.....first Ellis Park...now California....what's next? El Commandante?

I think it's actually pretty big news he's going to California and a big reason for doing so is Polytrack. When the leading money-won trainer makes a move like this, it's news.

As an aside, I've spent many a fine afternoon at El Commandante. Always an enjoyable visit.

[blackthroatedwind]

He is moving about 15% of his stock out there. Hardly a significant move.

Truth is it's better for everyone. Now he won't control 70% of the horses eligible for every non-claiming condition....only 50% of them.

[SentToStud]

15% of his ytd earnings would put him ahead of all but a handful of West coast trainers. It also affords him a new pool of potential clients. I can't imagine any of the West coast trainers are doing handstands in celebration that Pletcher's going west. Hardly insignificant.

[Cannon Shell]

Just speculation but I would believe that he has so many young horses that are maidens and nw1x he needs to find new places to expand to. I mean how many maiden special weight horses does he have that are within a work or 2 of racing. With full divisions at Belmont, Saratoga, Monmouth, Delaware, and Churchill, where else could he expand to?

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Just speculation but I would believe that he has so many young horses that are maidens and nw1x he needs to find new places to expand to. I mean how many maiden special weight horses does he have that are within a work or 2 of racing. With full divisions at Belmont, Saratoga, Monmouth, Delaware, and Churchill, where else could he expand to?

That's pretty much what I was trying to say ( obviously not that well ).

[Round Pen]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

He is moving about 15% of his stock out there. Hardly a significant move.

Truth is it's better for everyone. Now he won't control 70% of the horses eligible for every non-claiming condition....only 50% of them.

Sure it is a significant move any time the leading trainer in the Country annouces he going to a new venue it doesn't matter if he takes only 10 horses out there.

[blackthroatedwind]

The guy trains hundreds of horses. He controls an unprecedented number of the most expensive and well bred yearlings every year. How can anyone be surprised that he eventually sent a string to California.

Sorry if I'm hardly shocked or bowled over by this news.

Stud,
Thats not the real reason. I told you this past summer I had spoken to more than one trainer(Todd wasnt one of them) who was fed up with the purses and lack of allowances and msw's at Gulf. There are more who will announce it in the future.
But none of em are gonna come out and bash Gulf. 1) because they all train for or want the opportunity to train for Stronach. 2) Because they don't want their stall space reduced.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Stud,
Thats not the real reason. I told you this past summer I had spoken to more than one trainer(Todd wasnt one of them) who was fed up with the purses and lack of allowances and msw's at Gulf. There are more who will announce it in the future.
But none of em are gonna come out and bash Gulf. 1) because they all train for or want the opportunity to train for Stronach. 2) Because they don't want their stall space reduced.

When Gulfstream starts, the Santa Anita meet will be going on. Pletcher did not say that he will run horses at Santa Anita. The track is terrible there. It will be interesting to see if he keep the horses out here once Santa Anita starts. The article only said that he will run them at Hollywood this Fall. It didn't say anything about running at Santa anita this winter.

[Honu]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

When Gulfstream starts, the Santa Anita meet will be going on. Pletcher did not say that he will run horses at Santa Anita. The track is terrible there. It will be interesting to see if he keep the horses out here once Santa Anita starts. The article only said that he will run them at Hollywood this Fall. It didn't say anything about running at Santa anita this winter.

You really think the track is terrible? How about Del Mar and Arlington , have you even been out to see what the track is like now after they revamped it this summer . For the 5 days I was there working horses on it I thought it was a great improvement, it feels softer , yet not "cuppy" and loose it even seems to be a diffirent color which means to me that they have added something to the texture of the surface.
Im all for Polytrack and the surfaces if it makes it kinder on the horses. My biggest comcern with the polytrack and such is that because its kinder that trainers are going to think they can train harder over it, and believe me they will if they think they can, and I just dont get it .

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Honu

You really think the track is terrible? How about Del Mar and Arlington , have you even been out to see what the track is like now after they revamped it this summer . For the 5 days I was there working horses on it I thought it was a great improvement, it feels softer , yet not "cuppy" and loose it even seems to be a diffirent color which means to me that they have added something to the texture of the surface.
Im all for Polytrack and the surfaces if it makes it kinder on the horses. My biggest comcern with the polytrack and such is that because its kinder that trainers are going to think they can train harder over it, and believe me they will if they think they can, and I just dont get it .

I don't know how SA compares to Del Mar or Arlington. I heard the track at Del Mar was really bad this year. I don't know about Arlington. I know there have been a lot of breakdowns there.

One of my trainers thought the track was so bad at Santa Anita just 4 weeks ago, that he sent all of our 2 year olds out to the farm and put them on the aqua-tread for 3 weeks until Hollywood Park re-opened. When Hollywood re-opened and only the training track was opn and not the main track, he moved all his horses to Hollywood. He thought the main track was so bad at Santa Anita that he preferred to train on the training track at Hollywood. He said that he could see a difference in a lot of the horses immediately. He said they travelled much better over the training track at Hollywood than the main track at Santa Anita.

[SentToStud]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Stud,
Thats not the real reason. I told you this past summer I had spoken to more than one trainer(Todd wasnt one of them) who was fed up with the purses and lack of allowances and msw's at Gulf. There are more who will announce it in the future.
But none of em are gonna come out and bash Gulf. 1) because they all train for or want the opportunity to train for Stronach. 2) Because they don't want their stall space reduced.

I follow. But why California? Why not Oaklawn or Fair Grounds?

[Nostradamus]

By 2010, every track in america will be poly. They just have to tweak it but it is safer and lets horses run more frequently. Pletcher is smart to go out there. He may hit $30M next year.

[Round Pen]

I must be reading this differently than some of you guys the only reason he is expanding to California is on account of the polytrack. More than likely it is to keep Michael Tabor happy too. He wants all of his horses training on it when ever possible.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Round Pen

I must be reading this differently than some of you guys the only reason he is expanding to California is on account of the polytrack. More than likely it is to keep Michael Tabor happy too. He wants all of his horses training on it when ever possible.

I think you are right.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

I think you are right.

Then why do his KY horses train at Churchill Downs instead of Turfway? What do you think he going to say? "I have so many freaking maidens that I cant possibly run them all. Please dont send me anymore!" Business expand when they are growing and no business in racing is growing more than Todd Pletchers.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Nostradamus

By 2010, every track in america will be poly. They just have to tweak it but it is safer and lets horses run more frequently. Pletcher is smart to go out there. He may hit $30M next year.

I don't know if every track will switch. There are some places where I don't think they need it. I think the tracks in New York are very good. I don't think they need it in New York.

It will be interesting to see how the fans and bettors embrace polytrack in California. Some people like Oracle say that a lot of big bettors say that they won't bet on California racing once polytrack is installed. If Oracle is right and the handle goes way down, I don't think that you will be seeing polytrack at too many other tracks. I don't know if Oracle is right or not. My guess is that the fans will be fine with it. It make take them a little while to get used to it but I think they will embrace it within a relatively short period of time. I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by SentToStud

I follow. But why California? Why not Oaklawn or Fair Grounds?

Guys the stakes schedule at SA is heavily loaded with grass stakes, that actually have decent purses.
Pletcher is known for his fast and early two year olds but if you really look at his stable these days hes amassed a slew of grass horses and he simply doesnt have the venue at Gulf to run them all.
The purses there are very good as well. The polytrack thing just sounds like an excuse to me as Santa Anita will not be conducting racing on polytrack.
Gulfstreams racing has been woeful, especially the last two years.
They have a few Saturdays with a bunch of stakes races but the weekday and even Sunday cards are just disastrous. Dominated by cheap claimers and maiden claimers.
Makes no sense to race everything there that has to go on grass.
He will have a full division at Aqueduct and a full division at Gulf and the group at SA, which I will bet will be heavily loaded with grass horses.

[georgewashington]

Originally Posted by oracle80

Stud,
Thats not the real reason. I told you this past summer I had spoken to more than one trainer(Todd wasnt one of them) who was fed up with the purses and lack of allowances and msw's at Gulf. There are more who will announce it in the future.
But none of em are gonna come out and bash Gulf. 1) because they all train for or want the opportunity to train for Stronach. 2) Because they don't want their stall space reduced.

This is absolutely wrong.

1) I am sure very few think they are going to train for Frank. He isn't exactly holding auditions for trainers. Give me a break.

2) If the racing is so bad and they hate it so much, why are they so concerned with stall space reductions, which would not happen anyway.

Where do you think up these ridiculous things?

Where are all the announcements that you are talking about leaving for California. You know that is an outright lie. What are they waiting on. Pletcher plans to have some out there by Nov. 1.

Pletchers decision to go West was based on numerous things (track safety) and Michael McCarthy (KY Based) will be running the show. He will have just as many horses at Gulfstream as he always has and his top 2yr olds are headed to gulfstream.

Pletcher's parents live in Ocala and the Gulfstream winters are instrumental to his operation.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by georgewashington

.

Hmmmm, George Washington, the horse, was sold by Lael Stables.

Where have we seen this before? Gets a little tiresome.