Lord Kipling Odds Drop 2 Minutes In

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by GBBob

So who is in on this conspiracy?

So, a guy like you, who is around the track, hasn't noticed all the odds changes AFTER they break? Not at AP? Not at MTH? Not at DEL? no where?

If YOU aren't noticing it, then it must not be happening.

Past posting is NOT an issue and whales aren't getting rebates.

[infield_line]

other than a criminal conspriacy.... all of these betting outlets are presumably transmitting wagering data across the internet through various links, routers, hubs.

every organization in the country deals with the challenge of keeping up with hardware, software patches, and just slow connections from various ISP's and even providers like Verizon that can be hosed up on a given day. A single large wager coming from somewhere posted close to post that just has to wait for traffic, someone in the local track downloading a big porn file...who knows...

I agree that is very late, but I would not immediately assume it is monkey business

I/L

[Bobby Fischer]

it's worth mentioning that the horse paid $6.90.

he dropped from "5-2" to 2.45-1.
46K on kipling total


the concerns are valid. there shouldn't be odds changes this late into the race, whether its on the level or not.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

it's worth mentioning that the horse paid $6.90.

he dropped from "5-2" to 2.45-1.
46K on kipling total


the concerns are valid. there shouldn't be odds changes this late into the race, whether its on the level or not.

Correct on the math, was going to mention this. I agree that the concerns are valid, and there definitely is past posting going on as evidenced by this race, but the drop on this one was small so whomever got their bet in late it wasn't a huge wager.

[cmorioles]

There are also big bets being canceled after the break...that is fact and allowed at many tracks around the country.

Those canceled bets aren't on horses that break well and go to the front either.

[chucklestheclown]

[andrasi]

I'll put Northfield Park up against any track for allowing cancelled bets at the start, and gate callers an extra second or two. The High Roller room lets those boys get away with murder, and that is a fact. For those who dont remember or know, the story of the clerks from the Florida dog tracks in the late 70's. Dont want to misquote story, but the high low was they had a way to punch a few tickets after race complete. Really amazing, especially how they got popped. Its is the SI archives. think the title was Win, Place, or Steal.

[Kasept]

I don't have time to give a thorough explanation, but as has been brought up here and on air several times, the video packages that display odds on screen are directly involved in the appearences of odds increases or decreases.

1.) Odds that the video displays start with the numbers that are an estimated 93% of the pool 30-45 seconds before the start of the race.

2.) There is another tabulation before the gates open which will be the second set of reflected odds displayed on screen and are an estimated 97% of the pool.

3.) The final odds are reflected after the 'flush' 10 seconds into a race.

The changes on screen reflect these snapshots of the odds ONLY IF THERE HAS BEEN A CHANGE IN THE RUNNING ORDER OF THE HORSES. So there is frequently a lag in the odds being reflected.

It's funny how no one ever notes when there are increases in odds on screen. Of course it happens in completely equal proportion to decreases... Happened to bring one up on air a few weeks ago in fact...

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

There are also big bets being canceled after the break...that is fact and allowed at many tracks around the country.

Those canceled bets aren't on horses that break well and go to the front either.

I know a former teller that stated at most tracks there is one machine that allows you to cancel tickets up to 45 seconds into the race in case they screw up on a large wager, they have the opportunity to cancel it and not have to pay out of their own pockets.

[gales0678]

Originally Posted by kgar311

I know a former teller that stated at most tracks there is one machine that allows you to cancel tickets up to 45 seconds into the race in case they screw up on a large wager, they have the opportunity to cancel it and not have to pay out of their own pockets.

wasn't there a teller who had it down pat and could get down a big win bet if he saw the lone speed break well from the gate .... i think it was at GP or somewhere down in florida or like you say above the teller could cxl the ticket in time if the lone speed didn't break well and lost all chance at the start, who polices the tellers?

[johnny pinwheel]

Originally Posted by Bobby Fischer

it's worth mentioning that the horse paid $6.90.

he dropped from "5-2" to 2.45-1.
46K on kipling total


the concerns are valid. there shouldn't be odds changes this late into the race, whether its on the level or not.

you are right on! the odds barely moved. why would anyone complain, that horse was an overlay.

[randallscott35]

Originally Posted by johnny pinwheel

you are right on! the odds barely moved. why would anyone complain, that horse was an overlay.

Ok that's idiotic, the horse could've been 2.9-1 before the 2.45 to one click. We don't know....But saying what you said makes it sound like you should just make a donation to the track.

[reese]

Originally Posted by infield_line

other than a criminal conspriacy.... all of these betting outlets are presumably transmitting wagering data across the internet through various links, routers, hubs.

every organization in the country deals with the challenge of keeping up with hardware, software patches, and just slow connections from various ISP's and even providers like Verizon that can be hosed up on a given day. A single large wager coming from somewhere posted close to post that just has to wait for traffic, someone in the local track downloading a big porn file...who knows...

I agree that is very late, but I would not immediately assume it is monkey business

I/L

That is exactly correct.

Technology would easily support direct links to load data directly from a satillite betting site to the host unlike the current situation for most places... daisy chain where site A uploads wagering data to site B who collects data from 5 other satillites before the data is bundled and uploaded (sent) to the to the host track for number crunching.

The betting had stopped, but the data is still being sent to the host AFTER the windows close and the race is running. This is becasue the transmission is slowed by collecting and uploading. Most tracks are too cheap to use point to point technology.

[kgar311]

Originally Posted by reese

That is exactly correct.

Technology would easily support direct links to load data directly from a satillite betting site to the host unlike the current situation for most places... daisy chain where site A uploads wagering data to site B who collects data from 5 other satillites before the data is bundled and uploaded (sent) to the to the host track for number crunching.

The betting had stopped, but the data is still being sent to the host AFTER the windows close and the race is running. This is becasue the transmission is slowed by collecting and uploading. Most tracks are too cheap to use point to point technology.

Thats great and all and im sure true to an extent but how do you account for the winners odds going DOWN EVERY TIME. And why when you look at exacta probables as horses are going to the gate your exacta is paying $20 and then when you hit and the race goes official it only pays $15. Can anyone honestly say that their exacta has ever paid more then when the last time you saw it before the race went off? I think I can say with complete confidence that it has NEVER happened. I think bettors have become so accustomed to it that they dont think twice about it because its been the norm for so long. Something isnt right.