Zenyetta vs Racheal

[letswastemoney]

Synthetic race with decent field....Zenyatta wins

Match race....Rachel wins

Dirt race with decent field......toss up

[tector]

Originally Posted by letswastemoney

Synthetic race with decent field....Zenyatta wins

Match race....Rachel wins

Dirt race with decent field......toss up

Agreed, although RA's recent stalking trips make me lean towards her on the dirt more now.

Zenyatta's figs are lower, but I don't trust poly figs. They may still be a work in progress.

[Smooth Operator]

Seems simple enough to me

Z's the undefeated, undisputed champ.

RA is the young challenger which has yet to face older competition.

If RA wants to be the champ, she needs to come out to the champ's house this fall and take on the undefeated champ in the BIGGEST event of the year.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by Smooth Operator

Seems simple enough to me

Z's the undefeated, undisputed champ.

RA is the young challenger which has yet to face older competition.

If RA wants to be the champ, she needs to come out to the champ's house this fall and take on the undefeated champ in the BIGGEST event of the year.

How many wins does Rachel have this year? And Zenyatta?

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

How many wins does Rachel have this year? And Zenyatta?

That's much too simple.

Let's assume that Z wins the BC Classic, beating the BEST in THE WORLD. And RA is in her stall while this is happening (after having beaten up on the usual suspects in some race at BEL previously).

Hard to make a case for R as horse of the year, IMO.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

That's much too simple.

Let's assume that Z wins the BC Classic, beating the BEST in THE WORLD. And RA is in her stall while this is happening (after having beaten up on the usual suspects in some race at BEL previously).

Hard to make a case for R as horse of the year, IMO.

I was being extremely tongue in cheek with my response.

Z winning the BC Classic would be a huge possible game changer. It depends on what she does between now and then. Right now, she's a lot of lengths behind Rachel Alexandra, who has a few pretty big wins to her name while Zenyatta has just one.

The thing is... Zenyatta has had every chance to elevate herself without having to ship out of California. Hollywood Gold Cup, for example. I hope she does it in the Pacific Classic, because time is running out.

[cmorioles]

Originally Posted by the_fat_man

That's much too simple.

Let's assume that Z wins the BC Classic, beating the BEST in THE WORLD. And RA is in her stall while this is happening (after having beaten up on the usual suspects in some race at BEL previously).

Hard to make a case for R as horse of the year, IMO.

No way. She has run more often and traveled all over. Not only that, she has totally dominated her competition.

Zenyatta has yet to leave the comfy confines of SoCal and done nothing but beat up on high priced claimers, some barely.

If Rachel was in the race yesterday, she'd win geared down by 5 minimum.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

No way. She has run more often and traveled all over. Not only that, she has totally dominated her competition.

Zenyatta has yet to leave the comfy confines of SoCal and done nothing but beat up on high priced claimers, some barely.

If Rachel was in the race yesterday, she'd win geared down by 5 minimum.

It doesnt matter if she travelled or not. If Zenyatta beat older males in the BC Classic, it would trump anything that Rachel did the entire year.

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by cmorioles

If Rachel was in the race yesterday, she'd win geared down by 5 minimum.

Could be true. But her connections are much too stupid to run her as they don't realize that she, unlike Curlin, has the speed to be able to control the race. And I don't mean WIDE, NO COVER kind of speed. Anyone with an on-the-pacer that's not drafting on the POLY is a MORON. Cf. 90% of the connections up at WO.

Then again, when a horse dictates race type in EVERY ONE of over 10 starts, I need to see it LOSE before I concede anything to anyone. I need to see RA run FAST early on the lead, on the POLY and continue on to the wire before I take anything away from Z. Jackson is just playing it safe.

[CSC]

Wouldn't RA be in a singular distinction if she can be equally as good on synth as she is on dirt? Isn't that worth an attempt in The BC? At times I think we make too much of this debate. A great horse, a truly great horse does not need excuses. I pointed out Secretariat's example of trying a new surface(turf) after the tc and beating older horses later that year on dirt. This is not ground breaking stuff we are talking about. Who knows maybe she can do it, Curlin tried it and ran his race, (in the same neighbourhood beyer boys) he just got beat, the surface did not beat him, a very good horse did. He ran exactly to his mediocre 2 races prior. This surface excuse is just a not too inconvenient truth if one asks me.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by CSC

Curlin tried it and ran his race, (in the same neighbourhood beyer boys) he just got beat, the surface did not beat him, a very good horse did. He ran exactly to his mediocre 2 races prior. This surface excuse is just a not too inconvenient truth if one asks me.

If Curlin ran his '07 BC Classic race in '08, it might have a different result. He definitely had lost a step.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

If Curlin ran his '07 BC Classic race in '08, it might have a different result. He definitely had lost a step.

Yes! Finally someone who shares the surface didn't beat him side. Gracious amigo...

[the_fat_man]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

If Curlin ran his '07 BC Classic race in '08, it might have a different result. He definitely had lost a step.

Maybe he lost a step but even if the hadn't he wasn't winning with the setup he got. No horse was making one of the earlier moves in that race and holding on to the wire. While the connections came away with a distaste for POLY, for me, it exposed them as just being lazy and ignorant. They obviously didn't do any research into POLY as opposed to dirt setups and sacrificed the horse, expecting him to win with a dirt type run. No reason why, if he were reserved early and came with the last flow, he's not right there at the end. And now we need to pick it up yet again with RA. What's the problem? She has enough speed to be able sit the absolutely perfect DRAFTING TRIP. Just ask Goldikova. She'll be able to control the race. Suck Up and don't bid till midstretch. And they don't want to run her.

This is almost as bad as the horseplayers who refuse easy money by not playing POLY.

[Smooth Operator]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

If Curlin ran his '07 BC Classic race in '08, it might have a different result. He definitely had lost a step.

No way he ever could've run his '07 BCC race at last year's Cup.




He had to pass a 'roid test before that race..............