Rachel Alexandra (116 Beyer for Haskell)

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I think Chuck's point at its roots is obvious..Clearly, the more good publicity the better and if Rachel were to run in the BC it would be a higher rated telecast.. Unfortunately, Chuck's simpliest view fails IMO to address the real issues. Poly is a third surface..I am not against a third surface, I don't think there is ANYTHING wrong with it. I just think it needs to be treated as such. You want a poly champship? I do I love racing i have no issue watching and betting 9 Poly races with big fields and quality horses. I just don't think its fair to make dirt horses run on poly when it isn't in their best interest or the sports.

No that isnt the biggest issue. The biggest issue is that the sports biggest star and probably best horse should run in its biggest non triple crown race. Horseracing will again get slammed because unlike you guys the general public and sportwriters dont understand or care about the internal issues. They want to know why we cant get our **** straight especially with a horse who has already handled the artificial surfaces before. Regardless of Sightseeks assertions the fact that Lukas ran Winning Colors in the Derby and Preakness never earned him the "sportsmans" praise. He just wasn't afraid to run fillies against colts in spots that they fit in. And yes I'm sure she did garner a lot of eextra attention because she was a filly. While I am a believer that we have larger issues in the treatment of our core customers than any "sporting" related issue, saying that the tv coverage of the BC isnt a positive or that the public wouldnt turn on to see a super filly is stupid.

Jackson skipping the BC isnt going to change anything.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

No that isnt the biggest issue. The biggest issue is that the sports biggest star and probably best horse should run in its biggest non triple crown race. Horseracing will again get slammed because unlike you guys the general public and sportwriters dont understand or care about the internal issues. They want to know why we cant get our **** straight especially with a horse who has already handled the artificial surfaces before. Regardless of Sightseeks assertions the fact that Lukas ran Winning Colors in the Derby and Preakness never earned him the "sportsmans" praise. He just wasn't afraid to run fillies against colts in spots that they fit in. And yes I'm sure she did garner a lot of eextra attention because she was a filly. While I am a believer that we have larger issues in the treatment of our core customers than any "sporting" related issue, saying that the tv coverage of the BC isnt a positive or that the public wouldnt turn on to see a super filly is stupid.

Jackson skipping the BC isnt going to change anything.

Oh the scary sports writers who focus on racing 20 minutes a year are going to write nasty uninformed and mostly unread editorials.. Imagine that.. Come on bro if you are going to rep something can you get a little more into it then Bill Rhoden is going to tell America racing sucks!
The real reason trainers don't run fillies against colts is because 99% of the time they aren't good enough to beat them and financially it doesn't make sense. When the sport does have a filly that truly is extraordinary we do tend to see them against colts. There just isn't a SUPER filly every year. If you had a colts like Easy Goer and Sunday Silience or maybe even Hard Spun, Street Sense, and Curlin you might not even have seen Rachel against those types..

The sport needs Zenyatta vs. Rachel on dirt at 9f's period. This Breeders Cup is a dead issue..The b team from Europe is going to win whatever it needs to. You are trying to make chicken salad from Chicken sheat.. Poly is a third surface..It shouldn't be treated as dirt. Dirt horses shouldn't be forced to run on it.. Why not just run all the races on grass?

Running Rachel on Pro ride is not in the best interest of Rachel and running her on it doesn't prove or help anything.. You want some half assed grass horse that is 6 and a Group 2 winner to come her and beat Rachel on the line?? For what to prove it isn't her best surface?

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

Oh the scary sports writers who focus on racing 20 minutes a year are going to write nasty uninformed and mostly unread editorials.. Imagine that.. Come on bro if you are going to rep something can you get a little more into it then Bill Rhoden is going to tell America racing sucks!
The real reason trainers don't run fillies against colts is because 99% of the time they aren't good enough to beat them and financially it doesn't make sense. When the sport does have a filly that truly is extraordinary we do tend to see them against colts. There just isn't a SUPER filly every year. If you had a colts like Easy Goer and Sunday Silience or maybe even Hard Spun, Street Sense, and Curlin you might not even have seen Rachel against those types..

The sport needs Zenyatta vs. Rachel on dirt at 9f's period. This Breeders Cup is a dead issue..The b team from Europe is going to win whatever it needs to. You are trying to make chicken salad from Chicken sheat.. Poly is a third surface..It shouldn't be treated as dirt. Dirt horses shouldn't be forced to run on it.. Why not just run all the races on grass?

Running Rachel on Pro ride is not in the best interest of Rachel and running her on it doesn't prove or help anything.. You want some half assed grass horse that is 6 and a Group 2 winner to come her and beat Rachel on the line?? For what to prove it isn't her best surface?

The problem with the modern race fan is your last statement. For some reason fans have bought into the bs that a great horse never loses. The fact is that the great horses are the ones that accomplished great things. If Rachel Alexander were to win the BC on the "third surface" against whatever they throw at her she actually would have a claim to being a historically great horse unlike Curlin who was never more than a good three year old and decent handicap horse regardless of the BC result. If she were to lose you are going in with a built in excuse. If she were to win she would be a legend. And no she isnt one yet by beating a couple of 2nd rate Birdstones and a three horse field.

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The problem with the modern race fan is your last statement. For some reason fans have bought into the bs that a great horse never loses. The fact is that the great horses are the ones that accomplished great things. If Rachel Alexander were to win the BC on the "third surface" against whatever they throw at her she actually would have a claim to being a historically great horse unlike Curlin who was never more than a good three year old and decent handicap horse regardless of the BC result. If she were to lose you are going in with a built in excuse. If she were to win she would be a legend. And no she isnt one yet by beating a couple of 2nd rate Birdstones and a three horse field.

And Zenyatta ,who you have to love is, Is Personal Ensign an all time great because she won the Whitney? I didn't suggest she was an all time great yet and if Jess Jackson did who cares, he thinks Curlin was the end all..
So Rachel runs in either the Travers or Woodward beat colts or older AGAIN for the 3rd time and now we need to see some Group 2 winning gelding beat her on Pro Ride or she wins and everyone says all she beat was a couple of Birdstones and a washed up G2 euro slug.. Your kidding right you want it both ways.. Look IF she beats the colts in the Travers and or the real men in the Woodward whomever they are or aren't she will have been the best the sport had on DIRT in 2009.. Were she stacks up vs. Seattle Slew, Secretariat, Affirmed Spectular Bid Cigar Winning Colors or Personal Ensign will always be debateable. None of that is important it's only important to watch her do well vs. the best the sport has on her best surface.. If you feel that she HAS to try Pro Ride again you have to be of the opinion that she has to try grass as well it the same friggin argument.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

And Zenyatta ,who you have to love is, Is Personal Ensign an all time great because she won the Whitney? I didn't suggest she was an all time great yet and if Jess Jackson did who cares, he thinks Curlin was the end all..
So Rachel runs in either the Travers or Woodward beat colts or older AGAIN for the 3rd time and now we need to see some Group 2 winning gelding beat her on Pro Ride or she wins and everyone says all she beat was a couple of Birdstones and a washed up G2 euro slug.. Your kidding right you want it both ways.. Look IF she beats the colts in the Travers and or the real men in the Woodward whomever they are or aren't she will have been the best the sport had on DIRT in 2009.. Were she stacks up vs. Seattle Slew, Secretariat, Affirmed Spectular Bid Cigar Winning Colors or Personal Ensign will always be debateable. None of that is important it's only important to watch her do well vs. the best the sport has on her best surface.. If you feel that she HAS to try Pro Ride again you have to be of the opinion that she has to try grass as well it the same friggin argument.

You keep making assertions that the Euros that came last year were slugs. Why is that? Where she stacks up against the horses of yesteryear will always be debatable but her position as possibly the best horse of the poly era now and going future could not be achieved without a definitive poly victory. It is all rather unsporting to skip a race you may lose because a different horse lost on that surface which may or may not have been the cause of that loss.

[Cannon Shell]

http://popwatch.ew.com/2009/08/03/ra...kell-monmouth/

Yeah she has no crossover appeal...

[freddymo]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You keep making assertions that the Euros that came last year were slugs. Why is that? Where she stacks up against the horses of yesteryear will always be debatable but her position as possibly the best horse of the poly era now and going future could not be achieved without a definitive poly victory. It is all rather unsporting to skip a race you may lose because a different horse lost on that surface which may or may not have been the cause of that loss.

I guess its unsporting for her not to run in the Turf Classic then as well..12f's on the grass 3 turns males sounds like a plan..She may lose BUT if she could win we finally could say she won on Poly, Dirt and finally grass routing long...A TRUE CHAMPION..What's next off to Sheppard for some jumping or perhaps we give her a shot trotting, toss on some trotting hobbles and a cant see back bridle and away she goes.....

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I guess its unsporting for her not to run in the Turf Classic then as well..12f's on the grass 3 turns males sounds like a plan..She may lose BUT if she could win we finally could say she won on Poly, Dirt and finally grass routing long...A TRUE CHAMPION..What's next off to Sheppard for some jumping or perhaps we give her a shot trotting, toss on some trotting hobbles and a cant see back bridle and away she goes.....

She has never won on the turf and that race isnt the premier race of the fall.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by freddymo

I guess its unsporting for her not to run in the Turf Classic then as well..12f's on the grass 3 turns males sounds like a plan..She may lose BUT if she could win we finally could say she won on Poly, Dirt and finally grass routing long...A TRUE CHAMPION..What's next off to Sheppard for some jumping or perhaps we give her a shot trotting, toss on some trotting hobbles and a cant see back bridle and away she goes.....

It didn't hurt Secretariat's legacy to run on turf did it? I'm sure if poly was was around in the 70's he would have ran on that also...