shaq to the Cavs

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

I honestly can't believe I am reading that.

That makes two of us. How can anyone argue that a shot with nobody around you is no easier than one with a guy in your face or running at you with a hand in your face?

[horseofcourse]

These are getting funny. I shouldn't speak for Cannon, but I think what he is saying is if you are open by 3 feet or open by 12 feet it is the same thing...you are still open. BAsically, if you're in rhythm, without blanket coverage and a hand 0.25 inches from your eyeballs, you're open.

[King Glorious]

If you are Glen Rice or Ray Allen and you only need an inch, I agree. For the vast majority of guys though, I completely disagree.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

If you are Glen Rice or Ray Allen and you only need an inch, I agree. For the vast majority of guys though, I completely disagree.

Do you really see a lot of guys taking heavily contested, covered like a blanket three pointers in a NBA game? I don't. I rarely see heavily contested 3 pointers unless it's a shot clock emergency.

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

If you are Glen Rice or Ray Allen and you only need an inch, I agree. For the vast majority of guys though, I completely disagree.

Still if you watch those guys in warmups they will hit 80% from that same distance. It isn't just having a hand in your face, it is how quickly you have to release the shot.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Still if you watch those guys in warmups they will hit 80% from that same distance. It isn't just having a hand in your face, it is how quickly you have to release the shot.

Again why are you assuming that guys are going to start taking contested threes?

[Cannon Shell]

Here is an example of a typical NBA players three point shooting % on a yearly basis

John Salmons
year 1- .323
year 2- .340
year 3- .341
year 4- .299
year 5- .357
year 6- .325
year 7 -.417

See the wide variance? No superstars to account for the rise or dips unless you count his first 4 years with AI which he shot worse than without him the next three.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

That makes two of us. How can anyone argue that a shot with nobody around you is no easier than one with a guy in your face or running at you with a hand in your face?

You are making the assumption that guys playing without a star are taking contested three pointers. Why? Do only the teammates of superstars get open looks? That is really ridiculous. The whole premise that you guys are using is that a team with a great player will get guys easier shots. However since the three point line does not move the shots are equally hard. BECAUSE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THREE POINT ATTEMPTS ARE OPEN SHOTS REGARDLESS OF THE TEAMS ON THE FLOOR!!! Seriously how many players that arent stars have the leeway to shoot contested 25 foot shots?

[SniperSB23]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are making the assumption that guys playing without a star are taking contested three pointers. Why? Do only the teammates of superstars get open looks? That is really ridiculous. The whole premise that you guys are using is that a team with a great player will get guys easier shots. However since the three point line does not move the shots are equally hard. BECAUSE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THREE POINT ATTEMPTS ARE OPEN SHOTS REGARDLESS OF THE TEAMS ON THE FLOOR!!! Seriously how many players that arent stars have the leeway to shoot contested 25 foot shots?

We area talking about a 3 to 5 percent difference. You really think it is unreasonable that a guy playing with a star who is going to draw double teams is going to get 3 to 5 more wide open looks out of 100 shots? You saw the numbers on Steve Kerr and that was over 5 years with the Bulls and 10 years with other teams so there was plenty of sample size.

[horseofcourse]

I present the case of James Posey.

'04 Memphis 290 3s 39 percent
'06 Miami 290 3s 40 percent
'07 Miami 259 3s 38 percent
'08 Boston 279 3s 38 percent
'09 New Orleans 314 3s 37 percent

It appears to me in accordance with Dennis Green he is what he is and always has been. OF course he's played with mega stars his last 3 locales, but who was the mega star in Memphis getting him all those wide open looks?? Gasol?? Is Paul not a star enough to get his percentage to jump?? This is a bench player who takes a bunch of 3s who seems to be what he is regardless of his teammates.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

We area talking about a 3 to 5 percent difference. You really think it is unreasonable that a guy playing with a star who is going to draw double teams is going to get 3 to 5 more wide open looks out of 100 shots? You saw the numbers on Steve Kerr and that was over 5 years with the Bulls and 10 years with other teams so there was plenty of sample size.

Steve Kerr is not a good example because he simply got to play so much more with the Bulls than he did everywhere else. In Cleveland his 2nd year he shot just as well when he played 1600 minutes. His other non Bulls years he never played more than 900 minutes yet with chicago he played 2036, 1839, 1919, 1861 and his final year when hurt 1119 (when he shot his worst % by far)

Over the next three years post bulls he didnt play as many minutes total as he averaged a season with them. Not to mention his first season with Chicago when you figure you would see an uptick based on the superstar theory he actually shot 4 % below his career figure which is pulled down by his last few years as a 36 and 37 year old.

Personally I think for a good number of 3 point shooters it depends on where they get the shot from, and whether they are stepping into the shot or shooting it set, off a ball fake, off a right hand dribble and such. There are clearly spots and rythyms for most players that are comfort threes when open. Teams of course scout the 3 point shooters and attempt to take the comfortable 3 away. Shot charts can be useful for this of course as well as video.

So the variation from year to year might have something to do with where and during what situations guys are getting their 3's, especially with diff. coaches and teammates. Imo there are clearly teammates on some teams that do not recognize or care where and during what situations a good 3 guy is getting three point shot from.

[Cannon Shell]

Kidd to Lakers?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Kidd to Lakers?

Would be a horrible move.

How about Yao Ming possibly out all season and maybe done for his career?