A Saratoga wrap up, best and worst

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

you say that Del Mar has a consistently weak quality of racing? What are you smoking? Del Mar has the best quality of racing in the country. Del Mar and Saratoga have the two best meets in the country in terms of quality. Look at the horses who have run at Del Mar over the years. Last year, the BC Juvenille winner Stevie Wonderboy ran at Del Mar, Wild Fit the BC Juvenille Filly runner-up ran at Del Mar. I don't think I need to bore you and name all the Breeder's Cup winners such as Singletary, Sweet Catomine, and Pleasantly Perfect have run at Del Mar. Del Mar has never lacked in their quality of racing. They have had just as many superstars over the years as Saratoga if not more.

But Rupertk they run so many cheap claimers. I'm talking 10 claimers, and a lot at that.
Spa has claimers, but not like that. ANd they must have set the record this meet for maiden claimers, state bred maiden claimers. Yuch.
Its just that those cheap races seem to oevrshadow the quality races they do have. And if you think that racing is on a par with Spa,s well. I dunno what you are seeing. 12 grade ones at the spa, just as many grade 2's. I don't see that at Del mar.
And besides its the evevry day product thats so weak there.

[Revolution]

the saratoga v del mar argument is rather boring. both are excellent and have their own good things. the average purse distribution though at saratoga, del mar and i believe keeneland fall are virtually identical.

[Gander]

Delmar has some nice races on the weekends, but those undercards leave a lot to be desired. The weekdays are usually an utter mess, although tomorrow has a decent sprint stake.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Yes, that is true that Del Mar does have some crappy races but that's true everywhere. Keeneland actually runs some claiming races for lees than $10k.

Saratoga may not have as many cheap claiming races, but they have a ton of state-bred races. A lot of those races are pretty weak in terms of quality. Overall, I would give the edge in quality to Saratoga, but I certanly would not say that the quality of racing is weak at Del Mar. It's one of the best meets in the country.

[dalakhani]

Originally Posted by Rupert Pupkin

Yes, that is true that Del Mar does have some crappy races but that's true everywhere. Keeneland actually runs some claiming races for lees than $10k.

Saratoga may not have as many cheap claiming races, but they have a ton of state-bred races. A lot of those races are pretty weak in terms of quality. Overall, I would give the edge in quality to Saratoga, but I certanly would not say that the quality of racing is weak at Del Mar. It's one of the best meets in the country.

Agreed. I, too, get defensive about California racing when people down the top stars for "only racing in cali". Why do the california horses have to ship east but the New York horses dont have to ship west?

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Agreed. I, too, get defensive about California racing when people down the top stars for "only racing in cali". Why do the california horses have to ship east but the New York horses dont have to ship west?

I agree with you. However, the problem nowadays is that the tracks are so dangerous in California, that a guy would have to be crazy to ship to California to run his horse. If I had a horse back East, I wouldn't want to ship to California to run on those rock-hard tracks. The horse may not come back in one piece.

[Revolution]

Originally Posted by dalakhani

Agreed. I, too, get defensive about California racing when people down the top stars for "only racing in cali". Why do the california horses have to ship east but the New York horses dont have to ship west?

this is an excellent point. i just spent the entire summer at saratoga and it was great but i have spent an entire summer at del mar and the racing was just as good. there is a huge east coast bias in horse racing. even midwestern racing does not get the respect it deserves. saratoga has plenty of 2yr old and new york bred races that leave a lot to be desired. gulfstream park had some of the worst racing in the country last year but because there are so many new york trainers there is gets a better reputation than it deserves.

[Gander]

there is a huge east coast bias in horse racing

I would agree with that. Horses like Lava Man dont get the credit they are due. I find it funny that this year's older horse division in the east is apparently so much stronger than that in the west. Exactly (besides Invasor) is so fabulous?

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Gander

there is a huge east coast bias in horse racing

I would agree with that. Horses like Lava Man dont get the credit they are due. I find it funny that this year's older horse division in the east is apparently so much stronger than that in the west. Exactly (besides Invasor) is so fabulous?

As I have stated before, I don't think Invasor is anything special. I think Bernardini would beat him by 4-5 lengths.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Gander

there is a huge east coast bias in horse racing

I would agree with that. Horses like Lava Man dont get the credit they are due. I find it funny that this year's older horse division in the east is apparently so much stronger than that in the west. Exactly (besides Invasor) is so fabulous?

don't forget everyone bent over backwards to excuse st liams bad run in the big cap last year. but lava man isn't given the same consideration, when he was vanned off in his last start prior to shipping east and the far east. obviously a tired horse, obviously the trainer thought he was of sterner stuff. they're lucky they didn't ruin him for good...thankfully some time and some patience, and he's back better than ever. this is lava mans best year ever--anyone can go look at his prior years to see that he's at the top of his game.

i know a lot of people, myself included, gave mineshaft a get out of jail free card when he skipped the bcc in cali. just imagine the uproar that would erupt if they tried the same with lava man!! and he's undefeated this year, while mineshaft ( who i really like(d)) was not in his HOY year. ah, but that was different...he beat east coasters!! lol


if the west coast is as hard and difficult to run over, and stay healthy on, as we all believe it be, shouldn't lava man get that much MORE credit for doing it all year, without a blemish?????? i mean, if the easterners are such cream puffs they can't do it, how is lava man somehow the lesser???

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by Revolution

this is an excellent point. i just spent the entire summer at saratoga and it was great but i have spent an entire summer at del mar and the racing was just as good. there is a huge east coast bias in horse racing. even midwestern racing does not get the respect it deserves. saratoga has plenty of 2yr old and new york bred races that leave a lot to be desired. gulfstream park had some of the worst racing in the country last year but because there are so many new york trainers there is gets a better reputation than it deserves.

One of the best things about Saratoga is all the 2 year old races. Those are my favorite races. You get to see a lot of the future stars. For me, they are the best betting races too.

I was close, it was 4. But it looks like an exceptional card for them. Quite nice!!!

[Revolution]

more evidence of an east coast bias here. tomorrow's del mar card is excellent by any standard. saratoga is no better than del mar or keeneland. all three are basically the same. they all have good things about them. personally i like the keeneland meet better than saratoga and saratoga better than del mar. it all depends what you like. saratoga is very elitist though. not a fan of that.

Originally Posted by Revolution

more evidence of an east coast bias here. tomorrow's del mar card is excellent by any standard. saratoga is no better than del mar or keeneland. all three are basically the same. they all have good things about them. personally i like the keeneland meet better than saratoga and saratoga better than del mar. it all depends what you like. saratoga is very elitist though. not a fan of that.

I just said I hadn't looked. And that it was only 4.
And if you think all three are the same, you are kidding yourself. The other two run very cheap claiming races. As low as 5 grand at Keeneland, and 10 grand at Del Mar.
You do not get those at Saratoga.
I might point out, that closing day at Saratoga contained only two claiming races.
Touche!!!
And if you really wanna get into it, and want me to start pulling out facts, lets get to it!!!
Shall we compare Saturday cards at each track this past summer and see who ran more cheaper races than who, and who ran more stakes and allowances. And who has more grade one races? Sounds like fun to me.

[Revolution]

Originally Posted by oracle80

I just said I hadn't looked. And that it was only 4.
And if you think all three are the same, you are kidding yourself. The other two run very cheap claiming races. As low as 5 grand at Keeneland, and 10 grand at Del Mar.
You do not get those at Saratoga.
I might point out, that closing day at Saratoga contained only two claiming races.
Touche!!!
And if you really wanna get into it, and want me to start pulling out facts, lets get to it!!!
Shall we compare Saturday cards at each track this past summer and see who ran more cheaper races than who, and who ran more stakes and allowances. And who has more grade one races? Sounds like fun to me.

the average purses at keeneland are higher than saratoga. that is all i need to know. i do not care about claiming races. many claiming races are better than those awful new york bred races. some of those horses are glorified cheap claimers. those new york horses are terrible.

Originally Posted by Revolution

the average purses at keeneland are higher than saratoga. that is all i need to know. i do not care about claiming races. many claiming races are better than those awful new york bred races. some of those horses are glorified cheap claimers.

yeah Ny breds like Fleet Indian who are kicking the hell out of all those blueblood Ky breds right?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by Revolution

more evidence of an east coast bias here. tomorrow's del mar card is excellent by any standard. saratoga is no better than del mar or keeneland. all three are basically the same. they all have good things about them. personally i like the keeneland meet better than saratoga and saratoga better than del mar. it all depends what you like. saratoga is very elitist though. not a fan of that.

Keeneland is WAY easier to handicap than Saratoga...actually I think Santa Anita is as well. Speed! Speed! Speed! Since Saratoga was full swing I didn't cap much at Del Mar, but I've been told it isn't as favoring as SA.

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I agree, but not anymore. Good luck capping that polytack crap. I tried at Woodbine on Sat, and lets just say I had no luck. Or Turfway last winter.

I'm hoping someone writes a book about Capping on Poly by Christmas!

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by oracle80

I was close, it was 4. But it looks like an exceptional card for them. Quite nice!!!

(oh and I don't mean to be picky but you could have added Kent D's ride on Relaxed Gesture as the worst ride of the meet! The day after his car accident wasn't all that successful either)

Originally Posted by Sightseek

(oh and I don't mean to be picky but you could have added Kent D's ride on Relaxed Gesture as the worst ride of the meet! The day after his car accident wasn't all that successful either)

Well no, it wasn't worse than Milwaukee. Kent made one stupid mistake in that race. Gomez made 14 or 15 in his ride on Milwaukee. Rupert has an agenda, so dont listen to him so far as GG(you can listen to him on everything else), he has the audacity to say she had no run when clear!! LOL!!!! Well geez, after steadying and being choked 14 or 15 times for 11 panels of a 12 panel race, horses tend not to fire so hot the last 1/8th.