3/28 (GP): Florida Derby (G1); Swale (G2); Appleton (G3)

[justindew]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

That may be the all time lame excuse. They got rain last Sunday?

Agreed. Pletcher is correct to bitch, although he could have scratched.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by justindew

Agreed. Pletcher is correct to bitch, although he could have scratched.

True. he should have bitched after the 1st.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

True. he should have bitched after the 1st.

There are days when the track is souped up - times are lightning fast - and wide closers do very well throughout the card. Have an edge.

Just as there are days - like today in Dubai - when the track is very slow and tiring - times are slow - and the inside speed is at an extreme advantage.

Dunkirk labored over one of those slow tiring tracks in his debut at GP when he won in 1:25 and change.

A lot of times path and style biases seem to occur on funky weather days - and they said the winds were blowing at 25 MPH.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

There are days when the track is souped up - times are lightning fast - and wide closers do very well throughout the card. Have an edge.

Just as there are days - like today in Dubai - when the track is very slow and tiring - times are slow - and the inside speed is at an extreme advantage.

Dunkirk labored over one of those slow tiring tracks in his debut at GP when he won in 1:25 and change.

A lot of times path and style biases seem to occur on funky weather days - and they said the winds were blowing at 25 MPH.

Looking at the flags it looked like a strong tailwind down the backstretch

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by justindew

Agreed. Pletcher is correct to bitch, although he could have scratched.

Exactly. Pletcher could have showed a little more class. Why didn't he run in the Wood to begin with??

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

Exactly. Pletcher could have showed a little more class. Why didn't he run in the Wood to begin with??

probably because he thought he could win here. now, let's see if cooler heads prevail with the horse and future plans.

[fpsoxfan]

Originally Posted by Danzig

probably because he thought he could win here. now, let's see if cooler heads prevail with the horse and future plans.

Good Point. Obviously Dunkirk has a load of talent. He just ran into a very tough horse today. I'd hate to see him miss the derby because of earnings, especially when he's arguably one of the top five three year olds.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

Exactly. Pletcher could have showed a little more class. Why didn't he run in the Wood to begin with??

I would imagine it's difficult when you lose, and they jam the mic in your face right away. It is hard to complain like that without looking like you're trying to take away from the winners performance. They would of been closer together. That's all you can really say. There were easier spots. For whatever reason, they chose this spot.

[Bobby Fischer]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I would imagine it's difficult when you lose, and they jam the mic in your face right away. It is hard to complain like that without looking like you're trying to take away from the winners performance. They would of been closer together. That's all you can really say. There were easier spots. For whatever reason, they chose this spot.

Good point.

I was having a discussion with a handicapper (Draynay) yesterday evening, and the topic of how fast the track was yesterday came up. With The Bonnie Miss going fast in spite of hard fractions, Dr. Pleasure equaling Quality Road's FOY time in an allowance, and the last race 18K claimers buzz sawing through a sub 1:16.

I feel bad for Pletch, but you can't take it away from Quality Road. If a 2nd in this truely top class race doesn't get you in, the blame isn't as much on the track as it is on circumstance.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I would imagine it's difficult when you lose, and they jam the mic in your face right away. It is hard to complain like that without looking like you're trying to take away from the winners performance. They would of been closer together. That's all you can really say. There were easier spots. For whatever reason, they chose this spot.

i don't think anyone would react well when someone is basically asking 'how'd it feel to lose?'

[mbahadur]

Originally Posted by fpsoxfan

Exactly. Pletcher could have showed a little more class. Why didn't he run in the Wood to begin with??

It would have been just as difficult to win the Wood (which has the same $750K purse as the Fla Derby) with I Want Revenge in there as it would have been the Florida Derby. On HRTV before the race, when asked about the comparison to Big Brown going into the Florida Derby last year, Jeff Siegel stated that this was a much tougher field than Big Brown had to face.

The $1 million Arkansas Derby may have been a good fit for Dunkirk's running style if Pletcher could have waited 2 more weeks (second in the Arkansas Derby is also worth more than second in the Fla Derby).

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by mbahadur

The $1 million Arkansas Derby may have been a good fit for Dunkirk's running style if Pletcher could have waited 2 more weeks (second in the Arkansas Derby is also worth more than second in the Fla Derby).

Not an easy track to close on... and right now there isn't loads of speed in Arkansas. Silver City is not going... so it's Papa Clem and who else on the front?

[ELA]

Pletcher was disappointed. He was interviewed right there, on the spot, that moment. With everything considered, and of course his horse got beat fairly easily as well, emotion is going to come into play. No matter how he got beat, he got beat and Pletcher would be disappointed. Easy to understand.

As far as the Derby goes, if they want to try and get in -- rushing, pushing the envelope, etc. -- if that's the price they want to pay, they will pay it.

Eric

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by ELA

Pletcher was disappointed. He was interviewed right there, on the spot, that moment. With everything considered, and of course his horse got beat fairly easily as well, emotion is going to come into play. No matter how he got beat, he got beat and Pletcher would be disappointed. Easy to understand.

As far as the Derby goes, if they want to try and get in -- rushing, pushing the envelope, etc. -- if that's the price they want to pay, they will pay it.

Eric

none of the horses seem to have much bottom going in these days. i don't think it would be much of a stretch to run dunkirk. it's not as tho the rest of the field is going in with double-digit starts anymore.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by Danzig

none of the horses seem to have much bottom going in these days. i don't think it would be much of a stretch to run dunkirk. it's not as tho the rest of the field is going in with double-digit starts anymore.

Yes, I'll agree. You can look to Big Brown, Curlin, etc. OK. So, what are they going to do here, run again to get in? Which race? I just don't see it. I think people will debate it all day, but the bottom line is that he didn't do enough to get in. With Big Brown, simply put, he won it so it was clear cut. Curlin -- he had a G3 and a G2 in his last two starts before the Derby.

Regardless, I see your point. I just don't see Dunkirk doing anything but sitting on the bubble and waiting. If he gets in, sure he'll run, but I don't see it being the ideal, far from it.

Eric

[Kasept]

Originally Posted by ELA

Pletcher was disappointed. He was interviewed right there, on the spot, that moment. With everything considered, and of course his horse got beat fairly easily as well, emotion is going to come into play. No matter how he got beat, he got beat and Pletcher would be disappointed. Easy to understand.

As far as the Derby goes, if they want to try and get in -- rushing, pushing the envelope, etc. -- if that's the price they want to pay, they will pay it.

Eric

Eric,

Does that also excuse his berating Gulfstream President Bill Murphy?

I guess this was the first 'big day' track Todd Pletcher ever ran horses on, so we should all sympathize.

They press any further with Dunkirk and they'll be no Dunkirk. He was already noticeably thin and wan...

[justindew]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Eric,

Does that also excuse his berating Gulfstream President Bill Murphy?

I guess this was the first 'big day' track Todd Pletcher ever ran horses on, so we should all sympathize.

They press any further with Dunkirk and they'll be no Dunkirk. He was already noticeably thin and wan...

Steve, come on. Three track records? (Edit: or maybe just two)

However, if your analysis of him looking less than 100% is on the money, then I'd have to agree that pushing on is a bad decision. I had heard he looked like a million bucks.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Eric,

Does that also excuse his berating Gulfstream President Bill Murphy?

I guess this was the first 'big day' track Todd Pletcher ever ran horses on, so we should all sympathize.

They press any further with Dunkirk and they'll be no Dunkirk. He was already noticeably thin and wan...

Also? Steve, I didn't defend what Pletcher said. It just didn't surprise me. In addition, I didn't say anyone should sympathize with Pletcher. I just think it's very easy to understand him being disappointed.

Pletcher's a big boy, playing in the big leagues and if someone in the media wants to "call him out" so to speak regarding these comments, they will. Were there some excuses here? Sure. Like I said, he was disappointed. His horse got beat. Period.

Eric

[prudery]

Originally Posted by Kasept

Eric,

Does that also excuse his berating Gulfstream President Bill Murphy?

I guess this was the first 'big day' track Todd Pletcher ever ran horses on, so we should all sympathize.

They press any further with Dunkirk and they'll be no Dunkirk. He was already noticeably thin and wan...

Childish and unsporting behavior from Pletcher to be sure . Churchill soups for the Derby as well ... I think he was cheesed off about scratchin the rabbit ...

Nice catch on Dunkirk's appearance---it has not been brought up much .

I thought he looked like a skinny filly coming down the stretch, and Kate Moss when they hosed him down--too bloody frail and tucked up .

Not an animal you would expect to have the physical reserves/resources to be bound for the classics ...

[blackthroatedwind]

Not that anyone would misconstrue your remarks as being " on the record " but how exactly are comments made on internet message boards allowed to be considered " off the record? "