Havent they done enough to destroy american business?

[ArlJim78]

Bush sucked, yet we can already look back on those 8 years as "the good old days".

[phystech]

Chuck, you have to remember - it's not about the people, it's about the power!

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Bush sucked, yet we can already look back on those 8 years as "the good old days".

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Danzig

Some of the stuff you read on here will make you reconsider everything you thought you knew about human intelligence and perception.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Some of the stuff you read on here will make you reconsider everything you thought you knew about human intelligence and perception.

Thanks for your insight Adam Smith. So you think this "plan" is a good thing? Are you going to use the BWS theory of you have to do something even if it is bad for the vast majority of people because doing nothing wouldnt pay back all the special interest groups that got me in and I really dont know what to do so I will pay these people back and be a hero to the sicko liberals and people who dont work and the clueless people in academia that you seem so enamored of?

^^^Scuds style

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Thanks for your insight Adam Smith. So you think this "plan" is a good thing? Are you going to use the BWS theory of you have to do something even if it is bad for the vast majority of people because doing nothing wouldnt pay back all the special interest groups that got me in and I really dont know what to do so I will pay these people back and be a hero to the sicko liberals and people who dont work and the clueless people in academia that you seem so enamored of?

^^^Scuds style

Actually Chuck, the BWS theory doesn't hold that "doing nothing wouldnt pay back all the special interest groups that got me in" at all.

It holds that doing nothing is a bad idea because watching the economy tank all around you and watching people hurt and deciding that the only thing that will help is to make the rich richer (which seems to have been working really well leading us into this mess, eh?!) is....well, just a bad idea.

You're making it sound far too complicated and far too political.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

Actually Chuck, the BWS theory doesn't hold that "doing nothing wouldnt pay back all the special interest groups that got me in" at all.

It holds that doing nothing is a bad idea because watching the economy tank all around you and watching people hurt and deciding that the only thing that will help is to make the rich richer (which seems to have been working really well leading us into this mess, eh?!) is....well, just a bad idea.

You're making it sound far too complicated and far too political.

But it IS complicated and it IS political. The stock market continues to plunge BECAUSE of the policies and decisions made by the new administration and his team. To say that doing nothing is a bad idea is to ignore the daily machinations of the market and the millions of people who see their life savings dwindling away. You obviously have zero economic background or understanding because you would realize that despite the propaganda it is the Rich who are losing the most and the rest of us who will ultimately pay. And believing that tax cuts have contributed much to this economic crash is to ignore the worldwide issues that we are seeing. You and many liberals continue to buy into the theory that the rich (or George Bush) are to blame for all the problems of the world. That is the class warfare that the Democrats wish to use to get votes. Actually believing that it is true is inexcusable.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

1. But it IS complicated and it IS political.

2. The stock market continues to plunge BECAUSE of the policies and decisions made by the new administration and his team.

3. That is the class warfare that the Democrats wish to use to get votes.

1. yep

2. I have a huge problem with the financial news networks "finding" reasons why the stockmarket has an up or a down day. No one ever seems to question the rather dubious claims made and very often taken as gospel. "The stock market plunged on news that..." bull you dont know this.
The stock market has been extraordinarily shaky for a while now and is in a downward spiral and it seems that the most likely reason is uncertainty. People dont know if the "cure" will work or not, or even if there is a cure...
I heard some people say the only cure is 2 years of pain. This is as good as any I have ever heard.
The stock market looks backwards (monthly/weekly etc... reports that come in 1 month after the fact) and forwards. It seems to me it is much more complicated than "the stock market reacted to Iran's bellicose statements towards Israel"

3. The thing I hate most about the Democratic party.
Its way too easy and dangerous- setting people against each other.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You obviously have zero economic background or understanding because you would realize that despite the propaganda it is the Rich who are losing the most and the rest of us who will ultimately pay. And believing that tax cuts have contributed much to this economic crash is to ignore the worldwide issues that we are seeing. You and many liberals continue to buy into the theory that the rich (or George Bush) are to blame for all the problems of the world. That is the class warfare that the Democrats wish to use to get votes. Actually believing that it is true is inexcusable.

It's not that I believe that the rich are the root of all evil.

It's that when the ONLY real option that Repubs are giving is "tax cuts" & "tax cuts" & "tax cuts" while offering NOTHING of substance to the debate that could actually help, then yes, I prefer taking other chances.

There's what Obama's doing and there's just cutting taxes and crossing your fingers as our two apparent options. If nothing in the middle is offered, then I'll take an overreach rather than just cutting taxes. That certainly didn't help us steer clear of this mess in the first place.

If there's a substantive debate to be had, then the Republicans are failing pretty miserably right now, because there's an awful lot of badgering Obama on the plan he came up with to fix it, and not a whole lot other than "just cut some more taxes" as an alternate solution. That's not helpful, and it's not effective as a singular strategy.

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Thanks for your insight Adam Smith. So you think this "plan" is a good thing? Are you going to use the BWS theory of you have to do something even if it is bad for the vast majority of people because doing nothing wouldnt pay back all the special interest groups that got me in and I really dont know what to do so I will pay these people back and be a hero to the sicko liberals and people who dont work and the clueless people in academia that you seem so enamored of?

^^^Scuds style

Clearly that's what I said. I'm just getting a huge kick out of this thread. Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I'm reserving my opinion on how well Obama is doing on the economy considering the stimulus just passed last week. I think his closing of Guantanamo and denunciation of torture is a major step in the right direction, and the fact that the unnecessary $2 trillion war that your guy started will end is pretty cool, though I'm not happy with his planned "surge" in Afghanistan. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable or radical to not yet make extreme declarations about his Presidency one way or another.

It's just 40 sumphin days durrrh

A year from now..

It's just 405 days durrh b..b..b..but Bush ahurr

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Clearly that's what I said. I'm just getting a huge kick out of this thread. Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I'm reserving my opinion on how well Obama is doing on the economy considering the stimulus just passed last week. I think his closing of Guantanamo and denunciation of torture is a major step in the right direction, and the fact that the unnecessary $2 trillion war that your guy started will end is pretty cool, though I'm not happy with his planned "surge" in Afghanistan. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable or radical to not yet make extreme declarations about his Presidency one way or another.

yeah,the war in iraq will end-but i don't think obama will end it any sooner than a rep would have-and any troops he moves from there will be heading to afganistan, not home. any savings he's claiming from cutting back on the war is false-he's only moving the troops and materiel.
and, like i read earlier, things contracted more in the fourth quarter last year than they originally gave out, and obamas budget paints a rosier picture of growth than practically every economist out there.

a rush to do something to turn things around is just that-a rush job. you get out what you put in. i think a bit more patience was called for. but the dems took the opportunity to pass a massive spending bill-two actually-based on fear. and they passed. and now we wait and see what happens. considering how pols usually do, i'd say this won't go any better than any thing else that's been tried on capital hill lately.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Clearly that's what I said. I'm just getting a huge kick out of this thread. Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I'm reserving my opinion on how well Obama is doing on the economy considering the stimulus just passed last week. I think his closing of Guantanamo and denunciation of torture is a major step in the right direction, and the fact that the unnecessary $2 trillion war that your guy started will end is pretty cool, though I'm not happy with his planned "surge" in Afghanistan. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable or radical to not yet make extreme declarations about his Presidency one way or another.

Joey you may not like the response but you are really not seeing what is going on in the world right now. You are in college and dont have a family to support or mortage to pay or business to run. You arent seeing your hard earned retirement money being burned at the stake daily. You dont understand that business is terrified by the economic decisions made by the Obama administration. you dont seem to get that the reason that Wall Street has tanked worse since Obama took over is Obama. The market is speaking on the economy daily. You are in the wonderful world of academia where theories abound and everything is insulated especially since Obama is sending more money. The real world isnt that concerned with torture or Guantamano right now. I would be willing to bet that many who were appalled at torture would sign up to wear the black hood since they got laid off and cant find work. The war ISNT ending anytime soon regardless of what Obama or his people have said. Obama is still campaigning to keep up his approval ratings. He will soon find out that he will be judged by his actions just like Bush was. Remember that at one time Bush had an 80% approval rating. Obama cant campaign forever. The Pelosification of the country will eventually lead to his downfall. He got 53% of the vote last time. There arent many people that will believe his centerist fiction in three years if he is as bad for the next three years as he has been for the first 2 months. Of course you can continue to worry about torture. Maybe since there will be no jobs when you graduate you can write press releases for Amnesty International or become a professional protester against Free trade?

[ateamstupid]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You are in the wonderful world of academia where theories abound and everything is insulated especially since Obama is sending more money.

Insulated my ass. I work too, and I've got over $15,000 in student loans racked up with still a year and change to go. So to suggest that I'm not affected by this is stupid. Obviously it's not nearly as dire for me as it is for many, but I'm not on easy street either Chuck.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The real world isnt that concerned with torture or Guantamano right now. I would be willing to bet that many who were appalled at torture would sign up to wear the black hood since they got laid off and cant find work.

if things keep going the way they are, I might be willing to check out that black hood job.
seriously though, my industry seems to be evaporating and blowing away at an alarming rate. the same thing is happening in South America and Europe.
so far at least, the much heralded change in torture policy is having limited impact on our order activity.

[Rupert Pupkin]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Clearly that's what I said. I'm just getting a huge kick out of this thread. Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I'm reserving my opinion on how well Obama is doing on the economy considering the stimulus just passed last week. I think his closing of Guantanamo and denunciation of torture is a major step in the right direction, and the fact that the unnecessary $2 trillion war that your guy started will end is pretty cool, though I'm not happy with his planned "surge" in Afghanistan. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable or radical to not yet make extreme declarations about his Presidency one way or another.

From what I have been reading, Obama's war on terror may resemble Bush's.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29249066

[steve]

there was democracy once in Iran, too, but when their elected officials wanted to nationalize the oil the british and ameicans could not let such a thing happen and the shah was installed.

[trifecta124]

Originally Posted by ateamstupid

Clearly that's what I said. I'm just getting a huge kick out of this thread. Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I'm reserving my opinion on how well Obama is doing on the economy considering the stimulus just passed last week. I think his closing of Guantanamo and denunciation of torture is a major step in the right direction, and the fact that the unnecessary $2 trillion war that your guy started will end is pretty cool, though I'm not happy with his planned "surge" in Afghanistan. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable or radical to not yet make extreme declarations about his Presidency one way or another.

The closing of Guantanamo is a step in the right direction?????? The fact that you are from Brooklyn and you live in the city that is the #1 target for terrorists and you are saying that is a disgrace. This president is returning these pieces of **** to countries that won't even welcome them back. They have admitted that they are in a jihad against innocent Americans and if given the opportunity would love to plan new attacks.....Wake up dude.

[Riot]

Watching the Republicans be the Chicken Littles six weeks into a Democratic presidency when eight years of a disastrous Republican administration caused them no concern is freaking delicious.

I think some would be happier just going in the underground bunker, sealing the door, and listening to Rush Limbaugh while they await the end of the world.

Good lord, the GOP is bowing and scraping to Rush Limbaugh.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by trifecta124

The closing of Guantanamo is a step in the right direction?????? The fact that you are from Brooklyn and you live in the city that is the #1 target for terrorists and you are saying that is a disgrace. This president is returning these pieces of **** to countries that won't even welcome them back. They have admitted that they are in a jihad against innocent Americans and if given the opportunity would love to plan new attacks.....Wake up dude.

i don't think closing gitmo = terrorists on the loose:

Obama also said he was trying to develop a process that "adheres to rule of law" but "doesn't result in releasing people who are intent on blowing us up."

"I think it's going to take some time and our legal teams are working in consultation with our national security apparatus as we speak, to help design exactly what we need to do," Obama said.

"But I don't want to be ambiguous about this. We are going to close Guantanamo and we are going to make sure that the procedures we set up are ones that abide by our Constitution," he said.