Baffert, Point Given among Hall of Fame finalists

[NTamm1215]

Originally Posted by KirisClown

Out of curiosity.. how did Silverbulletday do outside of age restricted races?

Terribly. She made seven starts against older horses and won only once, the aforementioned Doubledogdare. She was beaten in six of her last seven starts, including twice by Beautiful Pleasure, twice by Heritage of Gold and twice to end her career by Lu Ravi.

All in all, Silverbulletday's final seven losses came either to males or older females in graded stakes races.

I've personally believed she was overrated for quite some time, but the two she's up against might not be enough to keep her from getting into the Hall.

NT

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by NTamm1215

Terribly. She made seven starts against older horses and won only once, the aforementioned Doubledogdare. She was beaten in six of her last seven starts, including twice by Beautiful Pleasure, twice by Heritage of Gold and twice to end her career by Lu Ravi.

All in all, Silverbulletday's final seven losses came either to males or older females in graded stakes races.

I've personally believed she was overrated for quite some time, but the two she's up against might not be enough to keep her from getting into the Hall.

NT

Open Mind was never better than 3rd in her 5 tries outside of age restricted races.

The three times Sky Beauty was not more than 0.40-to-1 outside of age restricted races - she got wholloped each time as well.

Sillverbulletday didn't win those good races against older - but she ran quite fast in all but one of them. Her Beyers of 109 and 110 in defeat look pretty good when you consider Azeri only twice reached those levels.

Silverbullletday won the Alabama by 9 lengths with a 115 Beyer. Sky Beauty got just a 98 Beyer in her Alabama win by comparison.

Silverbulletday won 11 straight Graded Stake races against members of her own sex - and ran a triple digit Beyer in each one. She also shipped well ... which is why I think she gets the slight nod.

[KirisClown]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

The three times Sky Beauty was not more than 0.40-to-1 outside of age restricted races - she got wholloped each time as well.

Giving 7lbs to Inside Information at Belmont at a mile.. not many would be able to overcome that..

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by KirisClown

Giving 7lbs to Inside Information at Belmont at a mile.. not many would be able to overcome that..

I think weight is really overrated unless you're talking a 20-30 pound spread.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

I think weight is really overrated unless you're talking a 20-30 pound spread.

Do me a favor and go post that on the Thoro-Graph or Ragozin board.

[Travis Stone]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Do me a favor and go post that on the Thoro-Graph or Ragozin board.

Will you be my bodyguard if I do?

[KirisClown]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

I think weight is really overrated unless you're talking a 20-30 pound spread.

When you're talking about a horse with the quality of Inside Information.. I think it would matter somewhat.. She's good enough as it is.. having to carry 7 more pounds than her for a mile has to factor in slightly..

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by KirisClown

Giving 7lbs to Inside Information at Belmont at a mile.. not many would be able to overcome that..

Believe it or not ... that wasn't one of the times.

She was 0.35-to-1 against Inside Information that day ... her 14-for-14 lifetime record at Belmont Park had a lot to do with that no doubt.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

She was 0.35-to-1 against Inside Information that day ... her 14-for-14 lifetime record at Belmont Park had a lot to do with that no doubt.

That she was 1-5 against future Hall of Famer Inside Information speaks volumes about her ability.

[KirisClown]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Believe it or not ... that wasn't one of the times.

She was 0.35-to-1 against Inside Information that day ... her 14-for-14 lifetime record at Belmont Park had a lot to do with that no doubt.

Must have been the Hempstead then... she was awful in there and obviously no longer the same horse.

[Thunder Gulch]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Open Mind was never better than 3rd in her 5 tries outside of age restricted races.

The three times Sky Beauty was not more than 0.40-to-1 outside of age restricted races - she got wholloped each time as well.

Sillverbulletday didn't win those good races against older - but she ran quite fast in all but one of them. Her Beyers of 109 and 110 in defeat look pretty good when you consider Azeri only twice reached those levels.

Silverbullletday won the Alabama by 9 lengths with a 115 Beyer. Sky Beauty got just a 98 Beyer in her Alabama win by comparison.

Silverbulletday won 11 straight Graded Stake races against members of her own sex - and ran a triple digit Beyer in each one. She also shipped well ... which is why I think she gets the slight nod.

I loved Silverbulletday and think she was amazing in the spring of her 3yo year. Maybe she didn't develop past that, but the races up until her Belmont Stakes race were as impressive as any other filly in the last 20 years IMO.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Silverbullletday won the Alabama by 9 lengths with a 115 Beyer. Sky Beauty got just a 98 Beyer in her Alabama win by comparison.

Sky Beauty was an exhausted filly the day that she won the Alabama. Coming off the three filly Triple Crown races at Belmont, she won that day on her class alone.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

Sky Beauty was an exhausted filly the day that she won the Alabama. Coming off the three filly Triple Crown races at Belmont, she won that day on her class alone.

The Alabama was Sky Beauty's 5th start of the year over her 3rd different track. It was the 8th start of the year for Silverbulletday - over her 7th different track.

Silverbulletday was more exhusted when she won the race by 9 with her 115 Beyer ... thankfully her class carried her through.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

The Alabama was Sky Beauty's 5th start of the year over her 3rd different track. It was the 8th start of the year for Silverbulletday - over her 7th different track.

Silverbulletday was more exhusted when she won the race by 9 with her 115 Beyer ... thankfully her class carried her through.

No, it just means that Silverbulletday had run a few more races. If my memory is correct, SBD was coming off a far less taxing effort prior to the Alabama (in the 8.5F Monmouth Oaks against a few hopelessly outmatched rivals). Sky Beauty was coming off a far more taxing effort in the CCA Oaks, also run at 10F, which was far from her optimal trip.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Originally Posted by parsixfarms

Sky Beauty was coming off a far more taxing effort in the CCA Oaks, also run at 10F, which was far from her optimal trip.

Yeah - she won that one with just a 96 Beyer.

The same 96 Beyer that Silverbulletday got in the Belmont where she set a strong pace while head and head with the Derby and Preakness winner.

... ah, the Belmont, always an easy race for a heavily raced 3yo filly to bounce right back from.

[parsixfarms]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Yeah - she won that one with just a 96 Beyer.

The same 96 Beyer that Silverbulletday got in the Belmont where she set a strong pace while head and head with the Derby and Preakness winner.

... ah, the Belmont, always an easy race for a heavily raced 3yo fily to bounce right back from.

Sorry but everything in racing cannot be reduced to a speed figure, and who's to say what helped SBD bounce back so quickly from her Belmont.

The fact is that SBD had more time between her race in the (shorter, easier) Monmouth Oaks and the Alabama than Sky Beauty did between the (longer, tougher) CCA Oaks and her Alabama.

[King Glorious]

When you have to have this much debate on whether or not a horse should be in, should that horse really be in? Shouldn't the hall of famer be for the very best of the best, not just the really good in comparison to's?

[Sightseek]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Open Mind was never better than 3rd in her 5 tries outside of age restricted races.

The three times Sky Beauty was not more than 0.40-to-1 outside of age restricted races - she got wholloped each time as well.

Sillverbulletday didn't win those good races against older - but she ran quite fast in all but one of them. Her Beyers of 109 and 110 in defeat look pretty good when you consider Azeri only twice reached those levels.

Silverbullletday won the Alabama by 9 lengths with a 115 Beyer. Sky Beauty got just a 98 Beyer in her Alabama win by comparison.

Silverbulletday won 11 straight Graded Stake races against members of her own sex - and ran a triple digit Beyer in each one. She also shipped well ... which is why I think she gets the slight nod.

Azeri's PP's, I think these are going into the Apple Blossom?
www.drf.com/eclipse/2003/pps/azeri.pdf

[The Indomitable DrugS]

Yep.

The pp's for her final season can be found here ...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2004/pps/of.pdf

[10 pnt move up]

Originally Posted by The Indomitable DrugS

Yep.

The pp's for her final season can be found here ...

http://www.drf.com/eclipse/2004/pps/of.pdf

whats funny is how much faster, on the figures, Azeri is then Zenyatta.