Horse of the Year?

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by smuthg

Better than Commentator's Whitney?

Exactly. Of course Big Brown's races looked good. He wasn't facing anything, especially in Florida. Big Brown's Florida Derby didn't LOOK any better than Commentator's Whitney and certainly didn't LOOK any better than Commentator's Mass Cap. They didn't LOOK better than Proud Spell's Ky Oaks or Music Note's CCA Oaks or her Gazelle or Indian Blessing's Test or Ventura's BC F/M Sprint or Goldikova's BC Mile.

[RollerDoc]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Exactly. Of course Big Brown's races looked good. He wasn't facing anything, especially in Florida. Big Brown's Florida Derby didn't LOOK any better than Commentator's Whitney and certainly didn't LOOK any better than Commentator's Mass Cap. They didn't LOOK better than Proud Spell's Ky Oaks or Music Note's CCA Oaks or her Gazelle or Indian Blessing's Test or Ventura's BC F/M Sprint or Goldikova's BC Mile.

I disagree. FL Derby Big Brown did face some talent. Hey Bern and Ilysium Fields were very good horses in April. He also destroyed the Belmont winner in that race.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

I disagree. FL Derby Big Brown did face some talent. Hey Bern and Ilysium Fields were very good horses in April. He also destroyed the Belmont winner in that race.

Were you hired as a witness for the prosecutor or the defense? You weaken your argument on Big Brown's behalf by the mere mention of Hey Bryn and Ilysium Fields in the same sentence with the words "good horses". You completly destroy your argument by calling them VERY good horses.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Were you hired as a witness for the prosecutor or the defense? You weaken your argument on Big Brown's behalf by the mere mention of Hey Bryn and Ilysium Fields in the same sentence with the words "good horses". You completly destroy your argument by calling them VERY good horses.

And the Belmont winner is about the most awful horse to win a classic race in quite some time, as far as I can recall, so I don't think that helps either.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by Cardus

Gun to your head, who wins: Da' Tara, or Commendable?

Well luckily for me, Commendable is just at the very beginning of my caring about horse racing....

But gun to my head I'm wheeling both underneath Jazil.

[RollerDoc]

Originally Posted by brianwspencer

Well luckily for me, Commendable is just at the very beginning of my caring about horse racing....

But gun to my head I'm wheeling both underneath Jazil.

Jazil was underrated and not a slouch by any stretch.

[brianwspencer]

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Jazil was underrated and not a slouch by any stretch.

Strangely enough, I kind of agree.

But I'm willing to freely admit that my thinking may be a product of the fact that I always liked Jazil from the beginning, rather than a rational, evidence-based conclusion...

...since he kind of wasn't actually that good in the big picture.

He was a neat horse who was good for what he was good for, and he was fortunate to have run a couple of decent races and to mostly inherit a Belmont Stakes in which it seemed like he was the only 12-furlong runner in the field anyway. I liked his Derby better.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

Jazil was underrated and not a slouch by any stretch.

this makes me embarrassed that i have ever come close to agreeing with you on anything.
at any rate, i think hoy is curlins, but certainly i can't fault anyone for voting for brown.

[RollerDoc]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

You're digging yourself into a real deep hole now.

As a three year old Jazil won the Belmont, placed 4th in one of the most KY Derbys in this decade, and finished 2nd in the Wood Memorial. He also was 2nd in an Allowance race. How is that a slouch?

[Indian Charlie]

Originally Posted by Cardus

Gun to your head, who wins: Da' Tara, or Commendable?

sarava

[RollerDoc]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Were you hired as a witness for the prosecutor or the defense? You weaken your argument on Big Brown's behalf by the mere mention of Hey Bryn and Ilysium Fields in the same sentence with the words "good horses". You completly destroy your argument by calling them VERY good horses.

I said in April they were very good horses. I stand by that. Not very good as in past years but we are talking about 2008. And in April 2008 they were amonst the contenders for the Derby. To your point, neither one did anything special beyond that.

[King Glorious]

Originally Posted by RollerDoc

I said in April they were very good horses. I stand by that. Not very good as in past years but we are talking about 2008. And in April 2008 they were amonst the contenders for the Derby. To your point, neither one did anything special beyond that.

Just because you said it in April didn't mean it was true then. I said Galloping Grocer was going to win the TC after his first couple of races. After a few more, I realized he was garbage and admitted as much. If you can't learn to adjust your opinion as more and more evidence pours in, your arguments really will have no merit because you will always be speaking from the perspective of trying to prove yourself right instead of objectively looking at things.

[RollerDoc]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Just because you said it in April didn't mean it was true then. I said Galloping Grocer was going to win the TC after his first couple of races. After a few more, I realized he was garbage and admitted as much. If you can't learn to adjust your opinion as more and more evidence pours in, your arguments really will have no merit because you will always be speaking from the perspective of trying to prove yourself right instead of objectively looking at things.

I understand your points. I can still be correct in my statement based on when I was referring too. Hey Bern was very good in April and stunk by June. That happens to many horses including GG. Ilysium Fields got injured and we will never know but he was a very good horse in April.