Barbaro (the Champ)

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by Danzig188
yeah, the derby winner gets it. i don't care if his name is green eggs and ham.


has nothing to do with which has which name. at this point (and yeah, i've gone a bit over the top because no one will let this go, so what the hell) they are 'tied'. both with two gr 1's, both with four overall graded wins. you can compare the two side by side, they're practically even. so who gets the nod? the derby winner must, right? AT THIS POINT, which everyone seems wont to go over ad infinitum, who's gonna be chicken and proclaim a tie?? not me. there has to be a tie-breaker. shouldn't THE race for three year olds, often times the ONLY time that three year olds from coast to coast meet all year, the best since the year began, be the decider?? how could it not be? it's the derby. you don't have to call it by it's full name, just THE DERBY will do. one winner a year....

just think tho--another point. it's taken bernardini almost NINE months to earn the graded stakes that barbaro earned in FIVE.

it doesn't matter tho. it's august.


Don't really see the relevance of money won. The derby is a 2 million dollar race, and the Florida Derby is a million. Win them both and you're looking at 1.8 mil right there. In this day and age of giant purses, money earned is sort of lost, because there are so many races with giant purses. look at the Delta Jackpot, initially run for a million, but now $750,000. No way that race should be worth that much money. The point is, and Kentuckyrosesinmay made it quite well, this isn't about what the best story is. Take the emotion out of it, if you can. When Bernardini wins the JCC, I hope you will then give him his credit.



-----------oh, i think i see something....you apparently thought i meant graded earnings when i said graded stakes in that post...no, i meant graded races won. not purse money, they both have won four graded races. i never mentioned money there.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Either way, your point is kind of weak. What difference does it make? Invasor has only won 3 graded stakes this year, does that taint his resume? Discreet cat has zero graded wins, and Henny Hughes has 1. How about them?

how is my point weak? tell me where i'm wrong. i've shown exactly who won what, what is there to dispute?

invasor only won three? ONLY? graded placed in a fourth. and earned all those after dubai, and the dread 'curse', his second there is his only loss ever, he's got a great resume....discreet cat does have a graded win in the uae derby. of the three, DC ran once since march, last friday in an allowance. henny has run twice all year. not sure exactly what kind of resume they even have based on that. a lot of promise shown, a lot of talent. i have no problem praising a horse for what he's done. what's been accomplished.

tell me this, when is the last time i posted that barbaro would have beaten bernadini?? i've made NO comparisons between the two other than their records, which are right there for everyone to see.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm not trying to discount Invasor at all, I'm saying that it's not a black and white issue. there is a lot of gray area with something like this, so how many graded wins you have is sort of useless. I guess I'm a little off but I don't see how Bernardini doesn't win this award. He will never capture the hearts of people like Barbaro did, but he has been as, if not more impressive when compared to Barbaro.

lol
are we even arguing?? you're saying the same things i've been saying....he is just as impressive. all i'm saying is it isn't over yet, indeed it isn't black and white.

it's bernardinis to win or lose. barbaro can do no more than he has.

one more win and that guy has it. that WOULD set him apart. and bernardini would be a truly deserving winner.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

No arguing, we are having a intelligent discussion, lol. I agree with what you have said here 100%.

fantastic, i enjoy intelligent conversation....

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm not trying to discount Invasor at all, I'm saying that it's not a black and white issue. there is a lot of gray area with something like this, so how many graded wins you have is sort of useless. I guess I'm a little off but I don't see how Bernardini doesn't win this award. He will never capture the hearts of people like Barbaro did, but he has been as, if not more impressive when compared to Barbaro.

Barbaro has captivated a nation. He is a great horse. The media has really been hyping Bernardini up lately too though. It is a good sign for horse racing. They are calling Bernardini a superstar and a superhorse. I just read an article on the whole Barbaro vs. Bernardini debate in the NY Times. You know, Barbaro captivated a nation because of his heart, courage, and determination through a brillant win streak and a painful, life-threatening mishap. Wouldn't it be great for racing if Bernardini really does become a superhorse with all of the negatively surrounding the sport right now? It would be something postive and warming. Maybe God threw us some heartbreaks because he was finally going to give us HIM...THE NEXT COMING. What if Bernardini really is HIM? I can't imagine seeing a horse run live like those greats that ran in the 1970's. It has been one of my biggest dreams for years and years...to see one on live TV that we could honestly call one of the best that has ever been. To be there in that moment would be priceless. Maybe we are in that moment and we just don't know it yet.

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm a lot like you are. I had very similar feelings about this whole situation, like maybe we were dealt that awful blow in the Preakness, because we were going to be rewarded with bernardini. As captivating as he is on TV, I'm telling you he is even more in person. I truly felt like I was watching something special on Saturday, and I had the goosebumps to prove it.

I didn't even know who won the Preakness on Preakness day because of what happened to Barbaro, but when I watched the replay (of course skipping the part where the incident occurred) I was stunned at the wonderful performance that Bernardini put in. At this point and time, Bernardini's performance was being widely over-looked by a concerned/devastated racing community. I really wish I could see Bernardini in person (now, not on Preakness day, all the money in the world wouldn't have made me go to that Preakness). You should feel privileged that you got the opportunity!

[Betsy]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

I'm a lot like you are. I had very similar feelings about this whole situation, like maybe we were dealt that awful blow in the Preakness, because we were going to be rewarded with bernardini. As captivating as he is on TV, I'm telling you he is even more in person. I truly felt like I was watching something special on Saturday, and I had the goosebumps to prove it.

You saw him in person, Da Hoss? Wow, I hope to have the same priviledge on Gold Cup day. I am in awe of this horse - not just for his talent, but because he is the most gorgeous speciman I've ever seen. In addition, he's simply beautiful to watch - what a stride. Seeing Bernardini in the post parade of the Withers really floored me.......I never expected him to look like that. I've heard that the colt looked fresh as a daisy after the Travers - he could probably run 2 miles. How refreshing in this day and age of speed. Plus, he seems very popular with racetrack goers.

I did post after the Jim Dandy that I thought this colt could be a tonic for racing, and I still do. If nothing else, he's certainly stirred things up on racing message boards!

[Cajungator26]

To me, Bernardini looks like a high strung maniac, but that's just me. (Bluegrass Cat does too.) I appreciate the classic thoroughbred appearance and wide set eyes of Barbaro much more so if we're going to be talking about looks. You really can't even compare the two. Barbaro looks the part of a champion IMO.

[Cajungator26]

If this doesn't appear bugged out high strung to you, then I don't know what.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

If this doesn't appear bugged out high strung to you, then I don't know what.

I don't call that high strung at all, he was walking very calm, he was looking at something. Bluegrass Cat and Ministers Bid are the poster childs for high-strung and buggy eyed. I thought Bernardini showed the calm confidence of the champ he is.

[Betsy]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

To me, Bernardini looks like a high strung maniac, but that's just me. (Bluegrass Cat does too.) I appreciate the classic thoroughbred appearance and wide set eyes of Barbaro much more so if we're going to be talking about looks. You really can't even compare the two. Barbaro looks the part of a champion IMO.

In your opinion, Barbaro is a much better looking horse, but that's not fact. If one wanted to, one could certainly compare the two and say that Bernardini is the epitome of thoroughbred elegance. High Strung maniac is something that comes to mind when I think of Minister's Bid, not Bernardini; I haven't looked at your pictures because what's the point? All thoroughbreds are high strung, yes even Barbaro. I'd venture to guess that you are in the minority when it comes to Bernardini not looking the part of a champion.

[kentuckyrosesinmay]

I'm the conformation analysis expert on this board, and I say that both horses are awesome physical specimens of the Thoroughbred breed. I really don't think one outweighs the other in that department. Both look to be extremely intelligent animals because both have those large wide set eyes, especially Bernardini. Barbaro reminds me of one of the classy all-time great turf types, and Bernardini reminds me of the classy all-time great dirt types. You have to admit that Bernardini's presence, power, build, and movement remind you of those great horses such as Seattle Slew, Affirmed, and Secretariat for those of you blinded by your obvious bias against and dislike of Bernardini. BOTH HORSES ARE AWESOME.

[LARHAGE]

Originally Posted by Cajungator26

To me, Bernardini looks like a high strung maniac, but that's just me. (Bluegrass Cat does too.) I appreciate the classic thoroughbred appearance and wide set eyes of Barbaro much more so if we're going to be talking about looks. You really can't even compare the two. Barbaro looks the part of a champion IMO.

Well that is where personal opinions come in, to me Bernardini is absolutely the most beautiful horse I have seen in years, his build and his motion are awesome. I actually think a lot of TB's tend to be a little rangy and long headed ( hey, I'm an Arabian breeder) but every now and then you see a TB like Bernardini that has the beautifully shaped chiselled head, keen ears, set close together and a powerfully arched neck, just a beautiful horse. I absolutely love Barbaro as well, but if judging them in a halter class, it would be Bernardini, hands down.

[Cajungator26]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Well that is where personal opinions come in, to me Bernardini is absolutely the most beautiful horse I have seen in years, his build and his motion are awesome. I actually think a lot of TB's tend to be a little rangy and long headed ( hey, I'm an Arabian breeder) but every now and then you see a TB like Bernardini that has the beautifully shaped chiselled head, keen ears, set close together and a powerfully arched neck, just a beautiful horse. I absolutely love Barbaro as well, but if judging them in a halter class, it would be Bernardini, hands down.

If you're an arab breeder, then I definitely understand why you find him more correct than Barbaro. He's got an arab-like head for sure.

[Betsy]

Originally Posted by LARHAGE

Well that is where personal opinions come in, to me Bernardini is absolutely the most beautiful horse I have seen in years, his build and his motion are awesome. I actually think a lot of TB's tend to be a little rangy and long headed ( hey, I'm an Arabian breeder) but every now and then you see a TB like Bernardini that has the beautifully shaped chiselled head, keen ears, set close together and a powerfully arched neck, just a beautiful horse. I absolutely love Barbaro as well, but if judging them in a halter class, it would be Bernardini, hands down.

I completely agree, Laharge. I didn't even consider that anyone would consider Bernardini anything less than stunning - there is a head shot in the Preakness issue of the Blood Horse that is absolutely spectacular. There's also a great pic in the Jim Dandy issue -the horse moves like he looks, like a dream. He's just a pleasure to look at and to watch.....