Allen Iverson

Danzig · #1 11-28-2008, 11:29 PM

iverson apologized and said it won't happen again...and funny you mention marbury hoss, i thought of him when i saw the thread.
the players union is filing a grievance, marbury said the words 'i will not play' didn't ever come out of his mouth. this has been coming for a while tho, the coach pretty much told him earlier this season that he didn't need him. seems the whole situation has been building, and perhaps handled poorly from the get-go. marbury needs to go elsewhere, and most likely will.

King Glorious · #2 11-29-2008, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

iverson apologized and said it won't happen again...and funny you mention marbury hoss, i thought of him when i saw the thread.
the players union is filing a grievance, marbury said the words 'i will not play' didn't ever come out of his mouth. this has been coming for a while tho, the coach pretty much told him earlier this season that he didn't need him. seems the whole situation has been building, and perhaps handled poorly from the get-go. marbury needs to go elsewhere, and most likely will.

The Marbury situation is a strange one. He says that coach told him there were 30-35 minutes available that night if he wanted them. If that's the case, Marbury was well within his rights to say no. If the coach told him to suit up because he was playing that night and Marbury said no, that could be a problem. I can see both sides of this. The coach has told Marbury to himself and said publicly that he was not in the plans for this team. Once he did that, he created a huge problem. One side says that Marbury is being paid $21 million and as a professional, has a responsibility to be ready at all times, whether the coach decides to use him for 40 minutes, for 10 minutes, or not at all. The other side says that unless they have suspended him or he's injured, the coach has an obligation to use him if he's on the roster and ready if he gives your team it's best chance to win. Obviously, Marbury is better than whoever the 9-12 guys on the roster are so he should have been playing. The coach can't have it both ways. He can't tell a guy that's ready to play that he's not in the plans and won't play.....and then tell him be ready cause he needs him.

King Glorious · #3 11-29-2008, 01:21 PM

As for Iverson, I think some of his veteran teammates should have been on his side and skipped practice too. There's nothing worse than getting a new, inexperienced head coach in there trying to prove himself and making dumb calls like having practice on Thanksgiving. The Pistons aren't a young team full of guys that don't know the game. They are veterans that know what they need to do, know what's important and will get the job done. Several of the players complained about having to practice but they showed up anyway. There could have been 1/5 odds that Iverson wasn't going to show up. The others should have missed it too.

Cannon Shell · #4 11-29-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

As for Iverson, I think some of his veteran teammates should have been on his side and skipped practice too. There's nothing worse than getting a new, inexperienced head coach in there trying to prove himself and making dumb calls like having practice on Thanksgiving. The Pistons aren't a young team full of guys that don't know the game. They are veterans that know what they need to do, know what's important and will get the job done. Several of the players complained about having to practice but they showed up anyway. There could have been 1/5 odds that Iverson wasn't going to show up. The others should have missed it too.

why shouldnt they practice on Thanksgiving? They get the whole summer off and it isnt like Detroit is playing great.

Danzig · #5 11-29-2008, 03:56 PM

i'm surprised that no one has brought up plaxico yet. dude shot himself in the leg-the same thigh with the bad hamstring.

#6 11-30-2008, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

As for Iverson, I think some of his veteran teammates should have been on his side and skipped practice too. There's nothing worse than getting a new, inexperienced head coach in there trying to prove himself and making dumb calls like having practice on Thanksgiving. The Pistons aren't a young team full of guys that don't know the game. They are veterans that know what they need to do, know what's important and will get the job done. Several of the players complained about having to practice but they showed up anyway. There could have been 1/5 odds that Iverson wasn't going to show up. The others should have missed it too.

Dumars runs the ship. Dumars had to know there would be practice and approve. Stupid move by Iverson. And he knows it. And one of the reasons stated for the practice was to do some work on how to better utilize Iverson.
Iverson has backed down and the Pistons forgive so all is good.
Except that Detroit made themselves worse with the trade imo. Not that its gonna matter.

King Glorious · #7 11-30-2008, 03:16 PM

Making the analogy of what people in other jobs have to do is meaningless here. Danzig, if your husband knew that if he didn't show up on Christmas, nothing would happen to him, would he still show up? If you work at gas station or supermarket and don't show up and you know that nothing will happen to you at all, do you still bother to show up? I don't. What was Iverson's punishment? Not being allowed to start. Maybe he was fined a couple of thousand dollars. He still played 27 minutes and led the team scoring for the game.

In the NBA, the coaches don't run things. In college, they do. Not at the pro level. If LeBron James went to Danny Ferry tonight and said "I want Mike Brown out of here this week or there's NO WAY I'm staying", Brown would need the classifieds very quickly. Same thing in Miami with Wade, Toronto with Bosh, etc. The star players have all the power in the NBA. After the players, it's the GM's, then the owners, then the coaches.

ArlJim78 · #8 11-30-2008, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Making the analogy of what people in other jobs have to do is meaningless here. Danzig, if your husband knew that if he didn't show up on Christmas, nothing would happen to him, would he still show up? If you work at gas station or supermarket and don't show up and you know that nothing will happen to you at all, do you still bother to show up? I don't. What was Iverson's punishment? Not being allowed to start. Maybe he was fined a couple of thousand dollars. He still played 27 minutes and led the team scoring for the game.

In the NBA, the coaches don't run things. In college, they do. Not at the pro level. If LeBron James went to Danny Ferry tonight and said "I want Mike Brown out of here this week or there's NO WAY I'm staying", Brown would need the classifieds very quickly. Same thing in Miami with Wade, Toronto with Bosh, etc. The star players have all the power in the NBA. After the players, it's the GM's, then the owners, then the coaches.

was that your letter in the DRF?

timmgirvan · #9 11-30-2008, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Making the analogy of what people in other jobs have to do is meaningless here. Danzig, if your husband knew that if he didn't show up on Christmas, nothing would happen to him, would he still show up? If you work at gas station or supermarket and don't show up and you know that nothing will happen to you at all, do you still bother to show up? I don't. What was Iverson's punishment? Not being allowed to start. Maybe he was fined a couple of thousand dollars. He still played 27 minutes and led the team scoring for the game.

In the NBA, the coaches don't run things. In college, they do. Not at the pro level. If LeBron James went to Danny Ferry tonight and said "I want Mike Brown out of here this week or there's NO WAY I'm staying", Brown would need the classifieds very quickly. Same thing in Miami with Wade, Toronto with Bosh, etc. The star players have all the power in the NBA. After the players, it's the GM's, then the owners, then the coaches.

sad...but true

Danzig · #10 11-30-2008, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

Making the analogy of what people in other jobs have to do is meaningless here. Danzig, if your husband knew that if he didn't show up on Christmas, nothing would happen to him, would he still show up? If you work at gas station or supermarket and don't show up and you know that nothing will happen to you at all, do you still bother to show up? I don't. What was Iverson's punishment? Not being allowed to start. Maybe he was fined a couple of thousand dollars. He still played 27 minutes and led the team scoring for the game.

In the NBA, the coaches don't run things. In college, they do. Not at the pro level. If LeBron James went to Danny Ferry tonight and said "I want Mike Brown out of here this week or there's NO WAY I'm staying", Brown would need the classifieds very quickly. Same thing in Miami with Wade, Toronto with Bosh, etc. The star players have all the power in the NBA. After the players, it's the GM's, then the owners, then the coaches.

yes, he would. neither one of us believes in missing work, for any reason. couldn't tell you the last time he called in. besides, he gets paid pretty well for working a holiday...matter of fact, he got double time on friday while we were at the game-holiday pay + vacation.

years ago, i was an assistant manager at a store that was opened 24-7, 365 days a year. we all took a four hour shift on christmas, which made it fair to everyone.

King Glorious · #11 11-30-2008, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danzig

yes, he would. neither one of us believes in missing work, for any reason. couldn't tell you the last time he called in. besides, he gets paid pretty well for working a holiday...matter of fact, he got double time on friday while we were at the game-holiday pay + vacation.

years ago, i was an assistant manager at a store that was opened 24-7, 365 days a year. we all took a four hour shift on christmas, which made it fair to everyone.

Ok then he, and you, are the exceptions. I think. I wonder if we can agree on the fact that knowing the penalty (or lack thereof) of your actions beforehand can play a huge part in whatever decision you would make in a circumstance? Perhaps if Iverson had thought his contract could be violated, he wouldn't have done it. But knowing he'd only get what amounted to less than a slap on the wrist, he figured it was more important to do whatever it was he decided to skip practice for.

Danzig · #12 11-29-2008, 02:36 PM

if coach called a practice, everyone should have been there. i've worked holidays, my husband hasn't had a christmas off in years. that's life.
hard to feel bad for millionaires who play a sport for a living.

Cannon Shell · #13 11-29-2008, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Glorious

The Marbury situation is a strange one. He says that coach told him there were 30-35 minutes available that night if he wanted them. If that's the case, Marbury was well within his rights to say no. If the coach told him to suit up because he was playing that night and Marbury said no, that could be a problem. I can see both sides of this. The coach has told Marbury to himself and said publicly that he was not in the plans for this team. Once he did that, he created a huge problem. One side says that Marbury is being paid $21 million and as a professional, has a responsibility to be ready at all times, whether the coach decides to use him for 40 minutes, for 10 minutes, or not at all. The other side says that unless they have suspended him or he's injured, the coach has an obligation to use him if he's on the roster and ready if he gives your team it's best chance to win. Obviously, Marbury is better than whoever the 9-12 guys on the roster are so he should have been playing. The coach can't have it both ways. He can't tell a guy that's ready to play that he's not in the plans and won't play.....and then tell him be ready cause he needs him.

This take which I have heard other places is hard to swallow. Marbury is a cancer and isnt playing because of his attitude not his ability. The size of his contract should not be an issue as to whether he wants to play or not. The mistake that D'antoni made was showing him any respect and asking him if he wanted to play instead of simply telling him to suit up or get out. Any issues or perceived unfair treatment that starbury may feel should be directed right back at himself. He may have made a lot of money and has a big reputation but he is a dog and the whole world knows it. And yes KG the coach can have it all, the players dont have the right to decide if they want to play or not because their feeling may be hurt. The biggest mistake the knicks made was not simply cutting the mutt and giving him his money because he has done nothing but cause trouble as usual and noone is going to give them anything for him.