Henny Hughes

[Danzig]

mach ride has an excuse..but i wouldn't call it objective analysis to point out that the lone speed was taken out of his game. sounds more like pointing out the obvious. as to whether he gets closer to the win if he gets a clean break, well that's pure speculation.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by Danzig188

mach ride has an excuse..but i wouldn't call it objective analysis to point out that the lone speed was taken out of his game. sounds more like pointing out the obvious. as to whether he gets closer to the win if he gets a clean break, well that's pure speculation.

It's all speculation....isn't it?

He was never " lone speed ", and his connections made it obvious they were rating him, something that could have been easily accomplished from his outside post. He wasn't " taken out of his game ", he was stunned by almost going down at the start, and took himself out of the race thereafter. Furthermore, as anyone that actually watched the race could have seen, he was completely stymied and squeezed out when attempting to rally between horses into the stretch, and was forced to severly alter course and rally inside of horses, something which is very difficult to do.

The point is that somehow NONE of this was pointed out in this misguided lovefest which leads anyone who actually watched the entire race to believe that nobody involved is anything other than result oriented and oblivious to what is REALLY going on.

Larger gaps than today's have been made up when the contestants actually get comparable trips. If you don't understand that then you are doomed to a lifetime of poor wagering choices. Better for me.

[sumitas]

when a competitor comes out of the gate on all fours, just cool the accolades ok.

I was very impressed with Mach's race. Obviously the start compromised him and he still ran on the best he could on a track was favoring speed. Its fair to say(I had already said this) that he would have been 2nd easily without the trouble. I just don't think he was going to beat Henny.

AT least Blackthroat gives us his opinion of what he sees without an agenda. That I respect.
For all those who criticize people here, funny how so many have turned into obvious phony shills who have an agenda. Its sickening and a new low here.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by sumitas

when a competitor comes out of the gate on all fours, just cool the accolades ok.

but don't they all come out of the gate on all fours?!

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

It's all speculation....isn't it?

He was never " lone speed ", and his connections made it obvious they were rating him, something that could have been easily accomplished from his outside post. He wasn't " taken out of his game ", he was stunned by almost going down at the start, and took himself out of the race thereafter. Furthermore, as anyone that actually watched the race could have seen, he was completely stymied and squeezed out when attempting to rally between horses into the stretch, and was forced to severly alter course and rally inside of horses, something which is very difficult to do.

The point is that somehow NONE of this was pointed out in this misguided lovefest which leads anyone who actually watched the entire race to believe that nobody involved is anything other than result oriented and oblivious to what is REALLY going on.

Larger gaps than today's have been made up when the contestants actually get comparable trips. If you don't understand that then you are doomed to a lifetime of poor wagering choices. Better for me.

Please show us misguided clods the way oh great one. Once again, watched the race over and over, including the head on. Not a lovefest just an opinion.

Here is what I feel REALLY went on here. mach ride was shocked at the beginning of the race and lost ground which he made up quickly late. What you fail to realize is that if he were to have broke cleanly and was able to run up closer to the pace, it would have required much more energy from him in the early part of the race, which means he wouldn't have had the required energy for the kick that we saw yesterday. Notice the other horses that had run up with Henny near the lead. In the stretch they were done. The end result in my opinion is that Mach Ride would have finished roughly the same amount of beaten lengths behind Henny Hughes even with a clean getaway. Talk about poor wagering choices, betting horses that get bad starts and assuming that a clean break moves them way up is a big underlay. In a race with an overly hot pace, a missed break will actually move a horse forward. It's counterintuitive but that's what makes it a play to watch for.

It is just opinion on here, but it doesn't mean that others with different opinions than yours are in a love fest or are misguided. You obviously needed Mach Ride real bad yesterday which is fine. Just spare me the condescension.

Its a matter of opinion as to how the race would have played out had mach broken. I also liked him to be 2nd in that spot yesterday. he had a brutal dead rail trip last time out at Calder and looked like he might be a more effective stalker in addition to that. had he broken I'm quite sure he would have been 2nd in the race, no doubt on my mind of that.
But Henny broke their hearts with a knockout blow on the turn in which he turned it up a notch into the hot pace part of the race and basically broke his opponents backs. Mach is a very nice horse though, one who I think will be heard from again in the very near future.

[ArlJim78]

Mach Ride IS a very nice horse that i am keeping my eye on. we haven't heard the end from him but he is not ready for Henny yet especially the way that one can turn on the afterburners on the turn and top of the stretch.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Please show us misguided clods the way oh great one. Once again, watched the race over and over, including the head on. Not a lovefest just an opinion.

Here is what I feel REALLY went on here. mach ride was shocked at the beginning of the race and lost ground which he made up quickly late. What you fail to realize is that if he were to have broke cleanly and was able to run up closer to the pace, it would have required much more energy from him in the early part of the race, which means he wouldn't have had the required energy for the kick that we saw yesterday. Notice the other horses that had run up with Henny near the lead. In the stretch they were done. The end result in my opinion is that Mach Ride would have finished roughly the same amount of beaten lengths behind Henny Hughes even with a clean getaway. Talk about poor wagering choices, betting horses that get bad starts and assuming that a clean break moves them way up is a big underlay. In a race with an overly hot pace, a missed break will actually move a horse forward. It's counterintuitive but that's what makes it a play to watch for.

It is just opinion on here, but it doesn't mean that others with different opinions than yours are in a love fest or are misguided. You obviously needed Mach Ride real bad yesterday which is fine. Just spare me the condescension.

Getting left in the gate, a problem that is often a recurring one, and stumbling badly at the start, something much more random, are completely different things. I do agree that horses that get left often distribute their energy differently. I also believe, however, that stumbling very badly, as Mach Ride did, affects a horse MUCH differently.

However, besides all that, the trouble he encountered in the stretch also affected him severly. When you put the two together you have a horse who could easily have run significantly better.

As for your opening salvo.....I've earned it. You don't like it....tough. These boards are so oozing with misguided jealousy it makes me want to puke. Why don't you go out and give as much to this game as I have....mostly for no personal gain whatsoever.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

Getting left in the gate, a problem that is often a recurring one, and stumbling badly at the start, something much more random, are completely different things. I do agree that horses that get left often distribute their energy differently. I also believe, however, that stumbling very badly, as Mach Ride did, affects a horse MUCH differently.

However, besides all that, the trouble he encountered in the stretch also affected him severly. When you put the two together you have a horse who could easily have run significantly better.

As for your opening salvo.....I've earned it. You don't like it....tough. These boards are so oozing with misguided jealousy it makes me want to puke. Why don't you go out and give as much to this game as I have....mostly for no personal gain whatsoever.

Fair points, all of them regarding the race.

I respect and admire your racing knowledge. But a bit of humility would go a long way when making your points rather than baseless jabs at the misguided rabble that post their thoughts here. It just sounds like bitter sour grapes to cite all that you've given with no personal gain. That may be true but does that really entitle you here any differently than anyone else?

Didn't want to make some big thing, but to me it seems like being one of the more respected board members you would keep that stuff in check.
But I now know your position, "don't like it, tough". Nice.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

Fair points, all of them regarding the race.

I respect and admire your racing knowledge. But a bit of humility would go a long way when making your points rather than baseless jabs at the misguided rabble that post their thoughts here. It just sounds like bitter sour grapes to cite all that you've given with no personal gain. That may be true but does that really entitle you here any differently than anyone else?

Didn't want to make some big thing, but to me it seems like being one of the more respected board members you would keep that stuff in check.
But I now know your position, "don't like it, tough". Nice.

First of all, by pointing out what really happened in the King's Bishop this thread ended up containing some information that just might be helpful to people who want to learn from the game. Instead of the usual internet goo-goo crap it's just possible that someone might have gleaned something of value.

Baseless jabs? I think not. The simple fact is that for people to talk about the race in question and completely leave out Mach Ride, something that would undoubtably have continued to happen had I not butted in, demonstrates an almost surprising lack of awareness.

Believe me, I keep a LOT " in check ". Frankly, and I don't mean to be nasty as I don't get any feeling that you were trying to be unfair, your suggestion that I should show some humility is WAY out of line. I will leave it at that.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

First of all, by pointing out what really happened in the King's Bishop this thread ended up containing some information that just might be helpful to people who want to learn from the game. Instead of the usual internet goo-goo crap it's just possible that someone might have gleaned something of value.

Baseless jabs? I think not. The simple fact is that for people to talk about the race in question and completely leave out Mach Ride, something that would undoubtably have continued to happen had I not butted in, demonstrates an almost surprising lack of awareness.

Believe me, I keep a LOT " in check ". Frankly, and I don't mean to be nasty as I don't get any feeling that you were trying to be unfair, your suggestion that I should show some humility is WAY out of line. I will leave it at that.

but he wasn't left out, tycharles mentions him early on, while everyone was still discussing the payoffs. sorry that we didn't get to the rest of the horses in the race quickly enough to suit you. page one wasn't even full yet. obviously the winner will be attended to first.
besides, that's what pp's are for. in machs next, no doubt his last would have be taken into account.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

First of all, by pointing out what really happened in the King's Bishop this thread ended up containing some information that just might be helpful to people who want to learn from the game. Instead of the usual internet goo-goo crap it's just possible that someone might have gleaned something of value.

Baseless jabs? I think not. The simple fact is that for people to talk about the race in question and completely leave out Mach Ride, something that would undoubtably have continued to happen had I not butted in, demonstrates an almost surprising lack of awareness.

Believe me, I keep a LOT " in check ". Frankly, and I don't mean to be nasty as I don't get any feeling that you were trying to be unfair, your suggestion that I should show some humility is WAY out of line. I will leave it at that.

You thought that was way out of line? Try this….
The misguided goo-goos that you refer to that had been posting on this thread had the race exactly right. They got what REALLY happened in the Kings Bishop without your assistance, and that is that Henny Hughes affirmed himself as perhaps the best sprinter going right now. Mach Ride was not the subject of what REALLY happened because while he may have lost a few lengths due to his travails, it did not affect the outcome. Your butting in served to draw attention to your sad plight, having selected Mach Ride to beat Henny, but not much else.

Next time, you might want to leave the bitter emotion of a stinging loss at the door before descending from on high to butt in and tell us all what really happened. Or perhaps you might want to read and learn from some of the many threads around here where people such as myself had been saying for weeks to line up to play Henny in the Kings Bishop. Mach Ride was over-matched.

The way I see it if I hadn’t butted in here with my opinion, other people might read this thread and think from your comments that Mach Ride was a wise play against HH and that somehow the trip cost him a victory. What a wonderful thing I’ve done for you people. (lol)

Also people might glean from your comment regarding final time that High Finance would have beaten both Henny Hughes and Mach Ride due to his time being .01 seconds faster. This is the type of simplistic mistaken analysis that a rookie would make, not something one would expect from someone who has put as much time into the game as you have. It was not helpful to those who want to really glean something from the race.