Legends swing into gavel action

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

Just curious, not counting Lukas, because I agree, can you name me a few horses Zito butchered or underachieved with? Or baffert for that matter? Just because they sell for a lot of money doesn't mean they have talent as you know. I'm not making excuses, but what more could Zito or Baffert have done in their career?

By your line of thinking Pletcher underachived with The Green Monkey, when in reality the horse was just a rat. he couldn't help it.

The difference is that "the legends" usually pick their horses out for their clients at the sales. Which accounts for the under-achieving. Its the same as when these NFL coaches want to do all the drafting. It never works out.

As for The Green Donkey, he was the result of a pissing match of 2 ego-maniacs that actually look at the times in 2yo in training sales while they are being ridden like they are in the all-american fut. at Riodoso.

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by DaHoss9698

So you can't name any. That's fine. I understand the way the sales work. It seems like you guys are angry they seemingly have an open check book. I get that, I can't stand Godolphin for the same reason. But Zito and Baffert seem different IMO. Now that Bob Lewis has passed, Baffert doesn't seem to have a lot of multimillion dollar horses and Zito never really has. They get a lot of horses, but they aren't the ones spending the ridiculous amounts.

The days of the $5 million horses are over. Id bet you couldnt find a handfull of horses in BB or NZ barn that went thru he ring under $300k-$500k.

And winning a N2X with a $500k horse is not exactly a success story.

[blackthroatedwind]

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

The days of the $5 million horses are over. Id bet you couldnt find a handfull of horses in BB or NZ barn that went thru he ring under $300k-$500k.

And winning a N2X with a $500k horse is not exactly a success story.

War Pass......$180K

Cool Coal Man.....$200K

Da' Tara........$175K

Coal Play.......$280K

Anak Nakal.......homebred

[VOL JACK]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

War Pass......$180K

Cool Coal Man.....$200K

Da' Tara........$175K

Coal Play.......$280K

Anak Nakal.......homebred

Sorry, I got the breakage wrong.

[philcski]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

War Pass......$180K

Cool Coal Man.....$200K

Da' Tara........$175K

Coal Play.......$280K

Anak Nakal.......homebred

LaPenta has been absolutely KILLING it this year, hasn't he??

Farmer has had several "reasonably" priced/homebreds with major success with Zito as well.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by VOL JACK

The days of the $5 million horses are over. Id bet you couldnt find a handfull of horses in BB or NZ barn that went thru he ring under $300k-$500k.

And winning a N2X with a $500k horse is not exactly a success story.

Actually, that is very untrue about Zito. I can't speak to Baffert.

Eric

[ELA]

As trainers, like them or don't, that's a different issue. As far as buying power, I can't speak to the Baffert aspect specifically, but by his own admittance he lost a lot of buying power between Lewis, Sanan and Zayat (to whatever extent you would consider that). Lukas hasn't had carte blanche for quite some time. Does he still have power to buy a big ticket horse? Two? Sure. But that is far from carte blanche, say for example, like Pletcher had the last X number of years. At this point, I think Lukas may get more "homebred" babies than purchases, and in that world -- you play the cards your dealt.

Zito is another story. For many years his buying power was mostly in the $300k and below range. He was also getting "homebreds" -- like the Whintey horses. There would always be the odd expensive buyback from LaPenta, or an odd expensive purchase from Live Oak, but they were very few and far between. His purchasing power in recent years has increased, and LaPenta is playing the game in a bigger way, and he has bought back more horses (and more expensive ones); but for years Zito produced without having anywhere near carte blanche.

Don't get me wrong -- there's no doubt these guys have strong buying power. Being able to buy just one million dollar baby is more than 99% of the trainers in the game, so they start out with big dollars.

I think Pletcher had a run where he had carte blanche.

Eric