Curlin works on turf

ELA · #1 07-01-2008, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DogsUp

I wonder if Curlin is able to run in a pack and then sprint to the finish like they do in Europe. I also wonder if Alborado is able to adjust his style. Or are these of no concern?

If it's an issue of "true" European style racing, OK. However, if it's an Albarado issue -- no, no concern at all as far as I am concerned. He knows the horse, he's been to the big dances, he'll do his homework and he'll be ready. We're not talking about a "local" jock who gets to "keep the mount" and is kind of "out of his league" so to speak. He's a professional, national stage, etc. jock.

Eric

SentToStud · #2 07-01-2008, 05:25 PM

I am eagerly awaiting Curlin's first start on turf.

I will bet against the steed.

With both fists.

blackthroatedwind · #3 07-01-2008, 05:26 PM

If they wanted to have any shot whatsoever in the Arc they would secure the services of Andre Fabre and Oliver Pesslier.

Of course, those two would probably prefer to be associated with a horse with at least an outside chance.

LARHAGE · #4 07-01-2008, 05:32 PM

Christophe Clement was asked on HRTV last week what he thought of Curlin attempting the Arc, he said if they sent him over early enough to work a few times and was ridden by a European rider he would be interesting, hey it's the same as when the European riders ride laughingly bad in the big dirt races here, when in Rome do as the Romans.

docicu3 · #5 07-01-2008, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

If they wanted to have any shot whatsoever in the Arc they would secure the services of Andre Fabre and Oliver Pesslier.

Of course, those two would probably prefer to be associated with a horse with at least an outside chance.

Your best guess at odds for Curlin in the "Arc".

Bobby Fischer · #6 07-02-2008, 10:35 PM

http://www.churchilldowns.com/video/...ases-turf-work

too lazy to sign in/out, but the video of his work with commentary may be available to all

GBBob · #7 07-03-2008, 06:44 AM

Good news for Belmont, bad for AP?

http://www.bloodhorse.com/Now/News/N...ews/45965.aspx

zippyneedsawin · #8 07-03-2008, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBBob

Good news for Belmont, bad for AP?

http://www.bloodhorse.com/Now/News/N...ews/45965.aspx

Certainly looks like it. This may also change Curlin's course for the rest of the year.

parsixfarms · #9 07-03-2008, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by docicu3

Your best guess at odds for Curlin in the "Arc".

I thought I saw somewhere that on a European bookmaker's "future book" for the Arc, Curlin is listed at 14-1.

blackthroatedwind · #10 07-03-2008, 08:06 AM

It would be great if he showed up at Belmont.

Then he can run in the Woodward at Saratoga.

SniperSB23 · #11 07-03-2008, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

It would be great if he showed up at Belmont.

Then he can run in the Woodward at Saratoga.

Is that your way of saying you think the France plans are a bunch of BS or that you think he'd get beat in the Man o War?

Scav · #12 07-03-2008, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Is that your way of saying you think the France plans are a bunch of BS or that you think he'd get beat in the Man o War?

I think it is his way of saying that he doesn't think the horse is much on the turf

While I have no real opinion on it, the horse is bred out the ass for the lawn, so he could even be better then he is on the dirt, which would be real freaky

ateamstupid · #13 07-03-2008, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Is that your way of saying you think the France plans are a bunch of BS or that you think he'd get beat in the Man o War?

I wonder if this latest development would make them consider ditching -- or at least delaying -- the turf plans and going in the Whitney instead of the Man O' War. You'd have to imagine the former would be the easier race for him, but then again, as weak as the turf division is, he may be able to be win the Man O' War..

SentToStud · #14 07-03-2008, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperSB23

Is that your way of saying you think the France plans are a bunch of BS or that you think he'd get beat in the Man o War?

I would answer yes and yes.

Cannon Shell · #15 07-01-2008, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELA

If it's an issue of "true" European style racing, OK. However, if it's an Albarado issue -- no, no concern at all as far as I am concerned. He knows the horse, he's been to the big dances, he'll do his homework and he'll be ready. We're not talking about a "local" jock who gets to "keep the mount" and is kind of "out of his league" so to speak. He's a professional, national stage, etc. jock.

Eric

I think that he is at a huge disadvantage over there. The tracks are so different and the ground is so soft that a US jock is a possible problem.

ELA · #16 07-01-2008, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I think that he is at a huge disadvantage over there. The tracks are so different and the ground is so soft that a US jock is a possible problem.

Yeah, I see that. As far as the soft ground, I don't know if that is as much a disadvantage vis a vis the jock as it is the horse. At this point, I don't know the actual plans so I don't know who acclimated the horse would be to the potential track conditions. As far as the tracks -- yes, a definite factor. However, I would think they would do what they could -- short of getting another jock -- to try and overcome this factor. Would they not have Albarado over there early, get him some previous mounts, watch, learn, etc. Sure, nothing like real life experience, but we are not talking about complete amateurs here, right? At the same time, can you really see them not using Robby and changing jocks for this? It might make sense, but it's a big trigger to pull. Easy to say, tough to do.

On the other hand -- as good/great/whatever you want to call it, as Curlin is -- going over there and competing in the toughest race, perhaps in the world, that are come incredible hurdles to overcome. He doesn't have to be able to "handle" the turf, he's got to be "great" on it.

Eric

Cannon Shell · #17 07-01-2008, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ELA

Yeah, I see that. As far as the soft ground, I don't know if that is as much a disadvantage vis a vis the jock as it is the horse. At this point, I don't know the actual plans so I don't know who acclimated the horse would be to the potential track conditions. As far as the tracks -- yes, a definite factor. However, I would think they would do what they could -- short of getting another jock -- to try and overcome this factor. Would they not have Albarado over there early, get him some previous mounts, watch, learn, etc. Sure, nothing like real life experience, but we are not talking about complete amateurs here, right? At the same time, can you really see them not using Robby and changing jocks for this? It might make sense, but it's a big trigger to pull. Easy to say, tough to do.

On the other hand -- as good/great/whatever you want to call it, as Curlin is -- going over there and competing in the toughest race, perhaps in the world, that are come incredible hurdles to overcome. He doesn't have to be able to "handle" the turf, he's got to be "great" on it.

Eric

The course is different from distance to distance which is a real issue for an inexperienced rider over the course. The ground being so soft is something our riders are simply not used to riding over. Knowing where he is in relation to the finish will be the biggest issue i would guess.

Danzig · #18 07-01-2008, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The course is different from distance to distance which is a real issue for an inexperienced rider over the course. The ground being so soft is something our riders are simply not used to riding over. Knowing where he is in relation to the finish will be the biggest issue i would guess.

don't the jocks there ride differently over there compared to ours due to the undulating course as well? seems i read not too long ago where they compared euro jocks to americans--americans being able to be more still, less athletic, since our courses are all flat, with just the two turns generally to worry about.

ELA · #19 07-01-2008, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

The course is different from distance to distance which is a real issue for an inexperienced rider over the course. The ground being so soft is something our riders are simply not used to riding over. Knowing where he is in relation to the finish will be the biggest issue i would guess.

OK, so the course is different distance to distance, and if the only answer is to use a jock who is truly experienced over that course -- then I see that being a real issue. Insurmountable? I'm not sure, but very tough. The soft ground, I don't know, if an American jock is just not used to riding over that type of surface, would that be countered by a jock who knows the horse better? A European jock knows the soft turf exceptionally well, but doesn't know the horse as well? I'll go with you on that.

Knowing where he is in relation to the finish -- hey, if that's a big issue, sure I can buy that. He rides a similar distance, but that's not the same, yeah, OK, I got that. Is that too insurmountable? Beats me, LOL.

Eric

parsixfarms · #20 07-01-2008, 08:10 PM

I know we're getting way ahead of ourselves, but I thought they said that, if they were going to send him over for the Arc, they were going to run him in the Prix Foy, a course and distance prep for the Arc. As someone who is not an Albarado fan, I would without question use a European rider who is more in tune with the nuances of European racing. If the concern is that the rider needs to get familiar with the horse, then have him ride Curlin in the Foy as well.