Wayne Catalano-Frank Calebrese

[Split Rock]

A few months ago I posted the question.... "When will we see a trainer win 100% for a meeting"? It was made in jest but what is happening with Wayne Catalano (owner Frank Calebrese) is not to be believed.

Arlington Park 2008 meet:
17 starts
12 wins (71%)
15 in the money (88%)

Last 6 months overall:
88 starts
43 wins (49%)
62 in the money (71%)

Watch the winner he had in race #4 at AP on Sunday, May 11, 2008. The #3 Housebout was ridden by first time rider Brandon Meier. She was checked back to last yet still cruised up to win by 6 lengths in a hand ride.

We thought Mullins, Lake, etc was bad in the late '90's, this is borderline absurd.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Split Rock

A few months ago I posted the question.... "When will we see a trainer win 100% for a meeting"? It was made in jest but what is happening with Wayne Catalano (owner Frank Calebrese) is not to be believed.

Arlington Park 2008 meet:
17 starts
12 wins (71%)
15 in the money (88%)

Last 6 months overall:
88 starts
43 wins (49%)
62 in the money (71%)

Watch the winner he had in race #4 at AP on Sunday, May 11, 2008. The #3 Housebout was ridden by first time rider Brandon Meier. She was checked back to last yet still cruised up to win by 6 lengths in a hand ride.

We thought Mullins, Lake, etc was bad in the late '90's, this is borderline absurd.

Easy, the horse was much the best within the race. YOu have to realize that they can care less about losing horses via the claim box, matter of fact, they love being claimed of, they get fresher stock then. All they care about is wins, you regularly see them claim for 10k and drop to 5k, and they make a profit because of the purse structure.

They are on fire right now yes, but you have to realize that they plan for this meet. Arlington tests ALL winners I think

[ArlJim78]

its getting ridiculous, even to the point that they can let anyone ride the horse whether its the ancient Earlie Fires who needs victories so he can retire, or a kid like Brandon Meier who in his very first race rode a cat/cal horse to a romping win.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Scav

Easy, the horse was much the best within the race. YOu have to realize that they can care less about losing horses via the claim box, matter of fact, they love being claimed of, they get fresher stock then. All they care about is wins, you regularly see them claim for 10k and drop to 5k, and they make a profit because of the purse structure.

They are on fire right now yes, but you have to realize that they plan for this meet. Arlington tests ALL winners I think

bs, he wasn't much the best based on previous record, but he somehow moved up dramatically like all the others.

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by Scav

Easy, the horse was much the best within the race. YOu have to realize that they can care less about losing horses via the claim box, matter of fact, they love being claimed of, they get fresher stock then. All they care about is wins, you regularly see them claim for 10k and drop to 5k, and they make a profit because of the purse structure.

They are on fire right now yes, but you have to realize that they plan for this meet. Arlington tests ALL winners I think

I looked at all the Catalano horses.... He is winning with all different kinds. Horses are moving up dramatically off the claim or trainer change. No way to justify a guy winning with these percentages. It appears to be crooked.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

its getting ridiculous, even to the point that they can let anyone ride the horse whether its the ancient Earlie Fires who needs victories so he can retire, or a kid like Brandon Meier who in his very first race rode a cat/cal horse to a romping win.

Brandon Meier has been working with Catalano for the last 4 years or something, it isn't like he was given this mount.

He is not getting movements, he is spotting correctly.

Listen, I don't know what is going on, but the board tells you everything you need to know about Calabrese horses. If you can't beat them, which you can't right now, join them...

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Scav

Brandon Meier has been working with Catalano for the last 4 years or something, it isn't like he was given this mount.

He is not getting movements, he is spotting correctly.

Listen, I don't know what is going on, but the board tells you everything you need to know about Calabrese horses. If you can't beat them, which you can't right now, join them...

they're all hitting new lifetime tops, how can you say its just spotting?
i'm going to play lightly until this madness is over. no sense joining them because you can't make money.

did you see brandons race? he found trouble but it didn't matter.

[Scav]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

they're all hitting new lifetime tops, how can you say its just spotting?
i'm going to play lightly until this madness is over. no sense joining them because you can't make money.

did you see brandons race? he found trouble but it didn't matter.

It didn't matter because their were a bunch of cows in that race. That horse was there for one reason, to win for the kid.

How do you know they are reaching lifetime tops, I am speaking in relation to figures??

A horse like Rebounded is strictly a good claim, Tagg offered him for 30k and they took him.

I am not saying they are choir boys, but they usually win at 40% anyways, so now they are just hot, they have had plenty of weekends where they have won 5 out of 8 races they have run in. It wasn't like the horses that are winning haven't made 100% logicial sense, there hasn't been an illogical winner yet from them

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Scav

It didn't matter because their were a bunch of cows in that race. That horse was there for one reason, to win for the kid.

How do you know they are reaching lifetime tops, I am speaking in relation to figures??

A horse like Rebounded is strictly a good claim, Tagg offered him for 30k and they took him.

I am not saying they are choir boys, but they usually win at 40% anyways, so now they are just hot, they have had plenty of weekends where they have won 5 out of 8 races they have run in. It wasn't like the horses that are winning haven't made 100% logicial sense, there hasn't been an illogical winner yet from them

and what happens when their horses are claimed away? hmmm
proof that they're moved up is that they all drop off drastically when they're done with them.

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by Scav

It didn't matter because their were a bunch of cows in that race. That horse was there for one reason, to win for the kid.

How do you know they are reaching lifetime tops, I am speaking in relation to figures??

A horse like Rebounded is strictly a good claim, Tagg offered him for 30k and they took him.

I am not saying they are choir boys, but they usually win at 40% anyways, so now they are just hot, they have had plenty of weekends where they have won 5 out of 8 races they have run in. It wasn't like the horses that are winning haven't made 100% logicial sense, there hasn't been an illogical winner yet from them

Really wish I could believe it was legit Scav but, given the nature of horse racing, I am more inclined to believe a fat man with a red suit and white beard will bring me presents in late December.

I hate to say it, but the game of horse racing is not being governed by anyone. There is absolutely no accountability. The trends Catalano is hitting should be a red flag for investigation. Nothing will happen.

[Uncle Daddy]

What is really touching is their love and mutual respect for each other. I think this year is the 1ST I can remember with a public falling out

[Scav]

Originally Posted by Uncle Daddy

What is really touching is their love and mutual respect for each other. I think this year is the 1ST I can remember with a public falling out

It will happen, just a matter of time

[MISTERGEE]

the avg win % of all trainers in the hall of fame is 17%, these guys make them look like crap then

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by MISTERGEE

the avg win % of all trainers in the hall of fame is 17%, these guys make them look like crap then

Great point!!

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

and what happens when their horses are claimed away? hmmm
proof that they're moved up is that they all drop off drastically when they're done with them.

Here are some nice stats for you:


Since 2003 horses claimed by Catalano (next start):
35% wins and 67% in the money
(385 starters. 136 wins and 257 in the money)

Since 2003 horses claimed away from Catalano (next start):
9% wins and 39% in the money
(479 starters. 44 wins and 187 in the money)

[MISTERGEE]

only one explanation
catalano=miracle worker

Jamie Ness owns Catasoprano.

[ELA]

Originally Posted by Split Rock

Here are some nice stats for you:


Since 2003 horses claimed by Catalano (next start):
35% wins and 67% in the money
(385 starters. 136 wins and 257 in the money)

Since 2003 horses claimed away from Catalano (next start):
9% wins and 39% in the money
(479 starters. 44 wins and 187 in the money)

I was going to stay out of this one, but I just wanted to clarify one item. The results should not be justified by statistical data like the above. I am not saying they are saints, and I am not saying they are sinners. I am not saying either, although plenty of people absent of facts seem to be willing to do so.

The statistics are distorted, and if you need someone to explain why, then this is a futile discussion. Pick up a condition book and you can read why.

By the way -- does anyone know when was the last time Catalano got a positive test? What about a "high" test?

Eric

[Split Rock]

Originally Posted by ELA

I was going to stay out of this one, but I just wanted to clarify one item. The results should not be justified by statistical data like the above. I am not saying they are saints, and I am not saying they are sinners. I am not saying either, although plenty of people absent of facts seem to be willing to do so.

The statistics are distorted, and if you need someone to explain why, then this is a futile discussion. Pick up a condition book and you can read why.

By the way -- does anyone know when was the last time Catalano got a positive test? What about a "high" test?

Eric

This gibberish means zero to me. Just silly talk.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by ELA

I was going to stay out of this one, but I just wanted to clarify one item. The results should not be justified by statistical data like the above. I am not saying they are saints, and I am not saying they are sinners. I am not saying either, although plenty of people absent of facts seem to be willing to do so.

The statistics are distorted, and if you need someone to explain why, then this is a futile discussion. Pick up a condition book and you can read why.

By the way -- does anyone know when was the last time Catalano got a positive test? What about a "high" test?

Eric

Exactly

and I would think the claimed away win % is getting higher as there aren't as many who will claim off a Cat/Cal claim and drop anymore