Is Haskin joking?

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Thunder Gulch

Absolutely...and the year before that. That's one of the reasons it's hard to make the "Big Brown/ Curlin 3 starts isn't enough" argument. As we know, Curlin turned into a great racehorse, but he still did manage 3rd with a troubled trip behind two that would trounce this field.

As I said above I have absolutely no idea who will be the best horse of this crop or on the 1st week of May. This year is an immense puzzle to me. I'm just mystified. The only thing concrete thing I can go on is the report by track staff on the workouts. Since I am relatively a small player I can live with that. But also the best horse does not always win the derby, as we know know Curlin is head and shoulders the best horse of the crop in 2007, Street Sense got the trip and was a CD horse for the course. Since very few have run over the strip at CD and alot of these are coming in off poly/cushion preps. This race for me is not a race I am going to invest alot of money on.

But I agree with you, any of the top 3 of last year probably would crush...I hate that word as it is over dramatic but probably crush the 2008 field.

[sumitas]

the Churchill strip has been much maligned. a dirt horse like High Yield never fired. countless others never did either. 2006 you had Sharp Humor who was in great position around the first turn. then he broke his knee cap - end of career. ya never know on that track but it's the same for all...

[slotdirt]

^^^^ I think I need another Wilbury for interpreting purposes.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by sumitas

the Churchill strip has been much maligned. a dirt horse like High Yield never fired. countless others never did either. 2006 you had Sharp Humor who was in great position around the first turn. then he broke his knee cap - end of career. ya never know on that track but it's the same for all...

Eddie D said Hollywood Wildcat didn't handle it in the BC Distaff when she returned as defending champion. Reportedly it is an oval that not all horses can handle.

[slotdirt]

The funny part is someone just corrected him - yesterday, I think - on how Sharp Humor actually raced after the Derby, thus not ending his career.

[Cannon Shell]

Was Curlin heads and shoulders above the rest of his three year old crop? He ran 3rd in the Derby, won the Preakness by a head, got beat by a filly in the Belmont, lost in the Haskell, won a subpar GC Gold Cup by a nose and then won the BC Classic impressively. He may have been the best 3 yo but he was hardly a standout as he ran in 4 grade 1's for 3yo's and won 1 of them.

[The Indomitable DrugS]

He was clearly the overall standout, even going into the Breeders Cup Classic where he went off at 4.4/1 odds - yes - no question.

[CSC]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Was Curlin heads and shoulders above the rest of his three year old crop? He ran 3rd in the Derby, won the Preakness by a head, got beat by a filly in the Belmont, lost in the Haskell, won a subpar GC Gold Cup by a nose and then won the BC Classic impressively. He may have been the best 3 yo but he was hardly a standout as he ran in 4 grade 1's for 3yo's and won 1 of them.

I can see your point, but in my opinion he is head and shoulders the best horse of the crop based on what he did in the BC Classic. He certainly is the most talented horse of the class while Rags, Street S and AGS have all been retired. He's shown his versatilty by being able to handle most tracks and his durabilty by still racing today.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by CSC

I can see your point, but in my opinion he is head and shoulders the best horse of the crop based on what he did in the BC Classic. He certainly is the most talented horse of the class while Rags, Street S and AGS have all been retired. He's shown his versatilty by being able to handle most tracks and his durabilty by still racing today.

He may have been heads and shoulders above the crop at the end of the year but he still lost a whole lot of races to other 3 year olds to be considered vastly superior. It is easy to say this after he has continued to race effectively at 4 while the other 3 year olds are no longer here. But winning and winning decisively against other 3 year olds would be a benchmark for me to consider him head and shoulders above the other three year olds and in the four biggest 3 year old races he ran in he lost 3 of them and the one win was by a nose.

[Danzig]

Originally Posted by CSC

I can see your point, but in my opinion he is head and shoulders the best horse of the crop based on what he did in the BC Classic. He certainly is the most talented horse of the class while Rags, Street S and AGS have all been retired. He's shown his versatilty by being able to handle most tracks and his durabilty by still racing today.

i disagree. he beat hard spun in the fall by about the same margin as street sense in the spring-the same street sense who finished behind hard spun more than once. they all took turns beating each other (don't forget hard spun was ahead of curlin in the derby) and beating a woefully inadequate group of older horses in the classic.
the only reason anyone would call curlin head and shoulders above the rest is that he remains in training, for the moment.
i'd call last years crop better than average, as there were several who ran top races-but i'd also say they were all pretty even talent-wise. no absolute stand out from last year imo.
also, don't forget this is curlins second year racing, he didn't race at two like some of his peers. also might have to give the nod to street sense really as far as overall talent, as he was the champ at two, and then won the derby.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Was Curlin heads and shoulders above the rest of his three year old crop? He ran 3rd in the Derby, won the Preakness by a head, got beat by a filly in the Belmont, lost in the Haskell, won a subpar GC Gold Cup by a nose and then won the BC Classic impressively. He may have been the best 3 yo but he was hardly a standout as he ran in 4 grade 1's for 3yo's and won 1 of them.

I disagree, by the end of the year he was decisively better than the other 3 yo's. His last three races to me clearly show Curlin as the standout of his class. Street Sense and Hard Spun plateaued, Curlin kept raising his game.
you say the Gold Cup was subpar, but he did beat the best older horse going at the time and the rest of the field was left in the dust and that performance earned him a figure better than anything Hard Spun or Street Sense earned all year. His Classic win said it all really.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by ArlJim78

I disagree, by the end of the year he was decisively better than the other 3 yo's. His last three races to me clearly show Curlin as the standout of his class. Street Sense and Hard Spun plateaued, Curlin kept raising his game.
you say the Gold Cup was subpar, but he did beat the best older horse going at the time and the rest of the field was left in the dust and that performance earned him a figure better than anything Hard Spun or Street Sense earned all year. His Classic win said it all really.

His haskell loss showed you he was clearly what? The fact remains that he lost 3 of 4 races against 3 yo's in grade 1 races. Did you consider Sunday Silence head and shoulders better than Easy Goer? Probably not and he beat him 3 out of 4. He was a head bob away from being 0 for 4 in the big 3 year old races. The rest of the year counts too. He was clearly the best 3 year old in November and December.

[ArlJim78]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

His haskell loss showed you he was clearly what? The fact remains that he lost 3 of 4 races against 3 yo's in grade 1 races. Did you consider Sunday Silence head and shoulders better than Easy Goer? Probably not and he beat him 3 out of 4. He was a head bob away from being 0 for 4 in the big 3 year old races. The rest of the year counts too. He was clearly the best 3 year old in November and December.

he came back a different horse more mature, whatever, in the JCGC, and consistently performed at that higher level four consecutive times now.
to me there is no doubt who the best horse to come out of 07 was. Curlin is a standout. It was unclear during the TC season, but it didn't end up that way.