How Many Points

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

I took so much crap for saying this guy was the one to keep.Seems like 75% of people favored keeping Shaq,and dumping Kobe.This is the guy who was always in shape n' ready to win(not Shaq full of Cheeseburger.) Shaq was hurt here 'cuz he was playing while fat.

Nice redboard 5 years later when Shaq is over the hill and Memphis decides to become a charitable organization.

[King Glorious]

75% of the people in Miami may have been in favor of the Lakers trading Shaq. That's about it. Here in LA, it wasn't even close. Jerry Buss absolutely made the right decision IF it was coming down to a one or the other ultimatum. Sometimes, you have to sacrifice the immediate future for the long term good. If the Lakers hadn't already won three titles, then there may have been a different conclusion. The funny thing to me is that everyone says that if the Lakers had kept them both, they would have been able to win more. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't they play together two more years after the three-peat and lose out both times, once in the conference playoffs and once in the league finals? They weren't showing signs that they were going to be better than San Antonio or Detroit even with both guys.

As for Kobe, he's an amazingly talented player. But please stop with all the talk about him being the MVP. He's in the discussion for sure but he's not the MVP. Before the Lakers made the trade for Gasol, the Lakers had just lost Bynum and went through a stretch where they had lost to SA, Phx, Dal, Det, and Clev while barely beating Memphis 100-99 and going to overtime to beat Seattle 123-121. They were looking just like they had in the previous couple of years, all Kobe and nothing else. With less of a supporting cast, LeBron James has done more. Now, all of a sudden they get Gasol and Kobe's the MVP again? I don't buy that. I think that the record since they've gotten Gasol has been misleading. They have played an absolute garbage schedule since the trade. In the 14 games, they've only played against five teams that are over .500. Now, granted they are 4-1 in those five games but look at them closer:

117-113 over Orlando. In the game, Howard was limited to 29 minutes and Turkoglu to 33 because of fouls. Orlando put up 44 on them in the first quarter and led the game with 1:49 left.

130-124 over Phoenix. That was Shaq's first game with the Suns and they gave up 124 points.

96-83 over Portland. Lakers led by only two going to the fourth. Brandon Roy didn't play.

111-119 loss to Portland. This time, it was the Lakers who wilted in the fourth, getting outscored by nine. Roy did play in this game.

108-104 over Dallas. Game went to overtime. Lakers shot 50 free-throws to 25 for Dallas. Bryant alone shot 27 and it takes a monster game from him to win. Dallas, the league's best free-throw shooting team at 82%, shoots 68% here.

So yes, they have been getting the job done. But when it comes to playing the good teams, they haven't been as dominant as their record seems since Gasol has come. In those five games, they have given up an average of 108.6 points a game and when it comes to playoff time, they are going to have to do better than that. I understand that Bynum's return will help a lot in that area but they have a lot of work to do. If I was an opposing team, I'd definitely be worried about the Lakers but I wouldn't be ready to hand over the trophy just yet. The playoffs are a different game and the Laker players outside of Kobe and Fisher don't have the experience that is crucial once you start advancing.

Back to Kobe and LeBron. I just don't see how people say Kobe is the MVP over him. LeBron's scoring more, rebounding more, averaging more assists, and is shooting a better percentage from the field. In two meetings this year, LeBron's team beat Kobe's both times. In the first game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by nine in the fourth to win by four. LeBron had 33 to Kobe's 21. In the second game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by five in the fourth to win by three. LeBron had 41 to Kobe's 33, including outscoring him 14-9 in the last quarter.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

75% of the people in Miami may have been in favor of the Lakers trading Shaq. That's about it. Here in LA, it wasn't even close. Jerry Buss absolutely made the right decision IF it was coming down to a one or the other ultimatum. Sometimes, you have to sacrifice the immediate future for the long term good. If the Lakers hadn't already won three titles, then there may have been a different conclusion. The funny thing to me is that everyone says that if the Lakers had kept them both, they would have been able to win more. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't they play together two more years after the three-peat and lose out both times, once in the conference playoffs and once in the league finals? They weren't showing signs that they were going to be better than San Antonio or Detroit even with both guys.

As for Kobe, he's an amazingly talented player. But please stop with all the talk about him being the MVP. He's in the discussion for sure but he's not the MVP. Before the Lakers made the trade for Gasol, the Lakers had just lost Bynum and went through a stretch where they had lost to SA, Phx, Dal, Det, and Clev while barely beating Memphis 100-99 and going to overtime to beat Seattle 123-121. They were looking just like they had in the previous couple of years, all Kobe and nothing else. With less of a supporting cast, LeBron James has done more. Now, all of a sudden they get Gasol and Kobe's the MVP again? I don't buy that. I think that the record since they've gotten Gasol has been misleading. They have played an absolute garbage schedule since the trade. In the 14 games, they've only played against five teams that are over .500. Now, granted they are 4-1 in those five games but look at them closer:

117-113 over Orlando. In the game, Howard was limited to 29 minutes and Turkoglu to 33 because of fouls. Orlando put up 44 on them in the first quarter and led the game with 1:49 left.

130-124 over Phoenix. That was Shaq's first game with the Suns and they gave up 124 points.

96-83 over Portland. Lakers led by only two going to the fourth. Brandon Roy didn't play.

111-119 loss to Portland. This time, it was the Lakers who wilted in the fourth, getting outscored by nine. Roy did play in this game.

108-104 over Dallas. Game went to overtime. Lakers shot 50 free-throws to 25 for Dallas. Bryant alone shot 27 and it takes a monster game from him to win. Dallas, the league's best free-throw shooting team at 82%, shoots 68% here.

So yes, they have been getting the job done. But when it comes to playing the good teams, they haven't been as dominant as their record seems since Gasol has come. In those five games, they have given up an average of 108.6 points a game and when it comes to playoff time, they are going to have to do better than that. I understand that Bynum's return will help a lot in that area but they have a lot of work to do. If I was an opposing team, I'd definitely be worried about the Lakers but I wouldn't be ready to hand over the trophy just yet. The playoffs are a different game and the Laker players outside of Kobe and Fisher don't have the experience that is crucial once you start advancing.

Back to Kobe and LeBron. I just don't see how people say Kobe is the MVP over him. LeBron's scoring more, rebounding more, averaging more assists, and is shooting a better percentage from the field. In two meetings this year, LeBron's team beat Kobe's both times. In the first game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by nine in the fourth to win by four. LeBron had 33 to Kobe's 21. In the second game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by five in the fourth to win by three. LeBron had 41 to Kobe's 33, including outscoring him 14-9 in the last quarter.

I agree

[whodey17]

Originally Posted by King Glorious

75% of the people in Miami may have been in favor of the Lakers trading Shaq. That's about it. Here in LA, it wasn't even close. Jerry Buss absolutely made the right decision IF it was coming down to a one or the other ultimatum. Sometimes, you have to sacrifice the immediate future for the long term good. If the Lakers hadn't already won three titles, then there may have been a different conclusion. The funny thing to me is that everyone says that if the Lakers had kept them both, they would have been able to win more. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't they play together two more years after the three-peat and lose out both times, once in the conference playoffs and once in the league finals? They weren't showing signs that they were going to be better than San Antonio or Detroit even with both guys.

As for Kobe, he's an amazingly talented player. But please stop with all the talk about him being the MVP. He's in the discussion for sure but he's not the MVP. Before the Lakers made the trade for Gasol, the Lakers had just lost Bynum and went through a stretch where they had lost to SA, Phx, Dal, Det, and Clev while barely beating Memphis 100-99 and going to overtime to beat Seattle 123-121. They were looking just like they had in the previous couple of years, all Kobe and nothing else. With less of a supporting cast, LeBron James has done more. Now, all of a sudden they get Gasol and Kobe's the MVP again? I don't buy that. I think that the record since they've gotten Gasol has been misleading. They have played an absolute garbage schedule since the trade. In the 14 games, they've only played against five teams that are over .500. Now, granted they are 4-1 in those five games but look at them closer:

117-113 over Orlando. In the game, Howard was limited to 29 minutes and Turkoglu to 33 because of fouls. Orlando put up 44 on them in the first quarter and led the game with 1:49 left.

130-124 over Phoenix. That was Shaq's first game with the Suns and they gave up 124 points.

96-83 over Portland. Lakers led by only two going to the fourth. Brandon Roy didn't play.

111-119 loss to Portland. This time, it was the Lakers who wilted in the fourth, getting outscored by nine. Roy did play in this game.

108-104 over Dallas. Game went to overtime. Lakers shot 50 free-throws to 25 for Dallas. Bryant alone shot 27 and it takes a monster game from him to win. Dallas, the league's best free-throw shooting team at 82%, shoots 68% here.

So yes, they have been getting the job done. But when it comes to playing the good teams, they haven't been as dominant as their record seems since Gasol has come. In those five games, they have given up an average of 108.6 points a game and when it comes to playoff time, they are going to have to do better than that. I understand that Bynum's return will help a lot in that area but they have a lot of work to do. If I was an opposing team, I'd definitely be worried about the Lakers but I wouldn't be ready to hand over the trophy just yet. The playoffs are a different game and the Laker players outside of Kobe and Fisher don't have the experience that is crucial once you start advancing.

Back to Kobe and LeBron. I just don't see how people say Kobe is the MVP over him. LeBron's scoring more, rebounding more, averaging more assists, and is shooting a better percentage from the field. In two meetings this year, LeBron's team beat Kobe's both times. In the first game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by nine in the fourth to win by four. LeBron had 33 to Kobe's 21. In the second game, the Cavs outscored the Lakers by five in the fourth to win by three. LeBron had 41 to Kobe's 33, including outscoring him 14-9 in the last quarter.

One of the best posts you ever had and I agree 100%.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

Nice redboard 5 years later when Shaq is over the hill and Memphis decides to become a charitable organization.

How do you know? You weren't even around on the other board when this was going on.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

How do you know? You weren't even around on the other board when this was going on.

You were the one who said you said it back then. It is a BAD redboard, a self board.

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

You were the one who said you said it back then. It is a BAD redboard, a self board.

Oh really? Well,I know what this is about,and this is for all you white conservatives (like Chucky boy.)

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

White slut was kissin' on a married man,and beggin' to get f'd by the famous Black dude.He is guilty of adultery.About half of the marriages have this involved.He just did it with the wrong color ho,and in a White state.Ho was braggin' about gettin' f'd by him,and still they tried to prosecute it as a rape case.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Oh really? Well,I know what this is about,and this is for all you white conservatives (like Chucky boy.)

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

White slut was kissin' on a married man,and beggin' to get f'd by the famous Black dude.He is guilty of adultery.About half of the marriages have this involved.He just did it with the wrong color ho,and in a White state.Ho was braggin' about gettin' f'd by him,and still they tried to prosecute it as a rape case.

I have no issues with Kobe. It is your redboaring that the issue here.

Originally Posted by Cannon Shell

I have no issues with Kobe. It is your redboaring that the issue here.

Kobe is the MVP right now.
Hands down.

And King your are going stats on us
again. Kobe hits the jumper. Again
and again and again. Lebron?

Lebron is horribly inconsistent.
Lebron's game is bull to the basket
and dish or dunk. His mid-range game
is not even close to Kobe's.
His 3 game is a laugher. Kobe has no
weakness offensively (dribbles a little much
but they dont have a legit PG like other good teams
in the West)

And Kobe is a much better defender.

Its Kobe and it aint close.

[horseofcourse]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Kobe is the MVP right now.
Hands down.

And King your are going stats on us
again. Kobe hits the jumper. Again
and again and again. Lebron?

Lebron is horribly inconsistent.
Lebron's game is bull to the basket
and dish or dunk. His mid-range game
is not even close to Kobe's.
His 3 game is a laugher. Kobe has no
weakness offensively (dribbles a little much
but they dont have a legit PG like other good teams
in the West)

And Kobe is a much better defender.

Its Kobe and it aint close.

I honestly don't think you've ever watched the guy play outside of the NBA finals last year.

[Cannon Shell]

Originally Posted by pgardn

Kobe is the MVP right now.
Hands down.

And King your are going stats on us
again. Kobe hits the jumper. Again
and again and again. Lebron?

Lebron is horribly inconsistent.
Lebron's game is bull to the basket
and dish or dunk. His mid-range game
is not even close to Kobe's.
His 3 game is a laugher. Kobe has no
weakness offensively (dribbles a little much
but they dont have a legit PG like other good teams
in the West)

And Kobe is a much better defender.

Its Kobe and it aint close.

As i have asked you before...Do you ever actually watch the games?

Lebron is horribly inconsistent?
Probably the most consistent player in the game.

His offensive game is bull to the basket and dish or dunk?
Durant is NOT a good player supposedly because he doesn't do this but Lebron is not as good as Kobe because he does?

Kobe is a better shooter than LeBron yet his field goal percentage is lesser.
His superior 3 point shooting in 3 % point better than LeBrons.

Kobe doesnt have a legit point guard? Fischer and Farmer are like Bob Cousy and Walt Frazier compared to LeBrons alternatives.

Kobe is a much better defender though LeBron was ranked third in defensive win shares last year behind only Tim Duncan and Ben Wallace. Kobe has 119 steals compared to Le Brons 106 yet Le Bron has 54 blocks compared to kobe's 34.

Of course the fact that Lebron has 50 more rebounds and 80 more assists and is a far better rebounder on both ends and a much better passer doesnt count I suppose.

Lebron is not only the best player in the league already but he is getting better.

[GBBob]

Originally Posted by SCUDSBROTHER

Oh really? Well,I know what this is about,and this is for all you white conservatives (like Chucky boy.)

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

Kobe enjoyed f'n that White Girl.

White slut was kissin' on a married man,and beggin' to get f'd by the famous Black dude.He is guilty of adultery.About half of the marriages have this involved.He just did it with the wrong color ho,and in a White state.Ho was braggin' about gettin' f'd by him,and still they tried to prosecute it as a rape case.

lol..and Good Morning to you too Scuds

[SCUDSBROTHER]

Originally Posted by GBBob

[/b]

lol..and Good Morning to you too Scuds

G' MORNIN'

[horseofcourse]

LeBron is one of the most clear cut MVPs ever. He won't win it however unfortunately. In the end he has played for despite not the most talented team in the league still a very depleted team all year. Varejao/Pavlovic both will have missed at least half the season. Gibson is going to miss the rest of the year or very close to it. Ilgauskas is hurt now. And a week ago they changed half the team and somehow they keep winning. With LeBron in the lineup they are 34-20. As a team they are being outscored by nearly 1 point per game...based on that, they should be an under .500 team. What has happened is they win the majority of their close games and they have the most 4th quarter comeback wins this year in the NBA. LeBron is the top 4th quarter scorer in the league. It is all really pretty simple. That the leading scorer in the league who is 6'8" and 250lbs is also top 10 in the league in assists is pretty much all you need to know about the guy. I've actually read some publications and newspaper articles that don't even have him in the top 5 in the league for MVP. Stunning.