Mario o' Mario, please go back to Maryland o' Mario!

[Travis Stone]

I know what you're saying throat, but I felt like the entire second half of the race he did not put himself in an optimum position to win. If he was told stay inside, well, that's tough, cause you listen to the advice given when you're in a new area.

That said, it looked to me like he had plenty of horse throughout. My frustration arose on the far turn, when he was out-maneuvered by a rival to the outside and was suddenly left with that decision: inside or out? Maybe the in-hand style he was using was an aberration and that's why he did not commit outside. But I would rather go a bit wide and see if there's horse there, as opposed to wait inside and get into trouble.

And you're right, stretch-trips are over-rated as opposed to mid-race struggles. I think this all boiled from about the 5/16's on, and my commentary also stems from watching that other race either last week or two weeks ago where Pino was flying up the rail only to get stuck late.

Do I chase this horse next time? Probably, just so I can hopefully justify the time spent this long-winded response!

[golfer]

Originally Posted by Travis Stone

I know what you're saying throat, but I felt like the entire second half of the race he did not put himself in an optimum position to win. If he was told stay inside, well, that's tough, cause you listen to the advice given when you're in a new area.

That said, it looked to me like he had plenty of horse throughout. My frustration arose on the far turn, when he was out-maneuvered by a rival to the outside and was suddenly left with that decision: inside or out? Maybe the in-hand style he was using was an aberration and that's why he did not commit outside. But I would rather go a bit wide and see if there's horse there, as opposed to wait inside and get into trouble.

And you're right, stretch-trips are over-rated as opposed to mid-race struggles. I think this all boiled from about the 5/16's on, and my commentary also stems from watching that other race either last week or two weeks ago where Pino was flying up the rail only to get stuck late.

Do I chase this horse next time? Probably, just so I can hopefully justify the time spent this long-winded response!

Travis, someone needs to explain to him (and others) that saving ground is only important on the turns! If you give him the benefit of the doubt that allowing Boggy Creek to "out-move" him wide on the turn was the right thing to do, especially with a stretch runner, there is absolutely no reason to remain glued to the rail in the stretch. His rides on Laysh and Gold and Blue Box were identical, and incredibly frustrating if you had a wager on either (or worse, both ).

[pgiaco]

I'm not one to defend jocks but Gold and Blue Box doesn't run worth a damn unless he is covered up in the stretch so it looks like he gets into trouble every race because that is how he has torun. I had my eye on him to claim him last year, but decided against him beacause he was a little too quirky.

[blackthroatedwind]

In yesterday's first race at Aqueduct, Mario Pino gave She's a Tuf Cookie a good ground saving ride into the stretch versus 1:9 favorite Shelby's Memory. At the top of the stretch he smoothly angled her out and eventually wore down the favorite. The only problem was when he angled out he left the inside open to Roxanne's Dancer, who took advantage of that position, and rallied to win the race.

Was Pino wrong this time? Not in my opinion, and I bet his horse, but I thought in the spirit of this thread I should point out that perhaps even the right decision ends up being the wrong one. There's plenty of jockey buffoonery at all racetracks but I have found a lot of selective Mario Pino bashing ( none more ridiculous than the 2007 Preakness ) to be misguided.

[NoLuvForPletch]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

In yesterday's first race at Aqueduct, Mario Pino gave She's a Tuf Cookie a good ground saving ride into the stretch versus 1:9 favorite Shelby's Memory. At the top of the stretch he smoothly angled her out and eventually wore down the favorite. The only problem was when he angled out he left the inside open to Roxanne's Dancer, who took advantage of that position, and rallied to win the race.

Was Pino wrong this time? Not in my opinion, and I bet his horse, but I thought in the spirit of this thread I should point out that perhaps even the right decision ends up being the wrong one. There's plenty of jockey buffoonery at all racetracks but I have found a lot of selective Mario Pino bashing ( none more ridiculous than the 2007 Preakness ) to be misguided.

Okay, a few things here. While I agree with you most often, in regards to Mr Pino I do not. First, what he did yesterday what plain and simply the correct move. When his horse was getting to the leader, there wasn't nearly as much room as there was when Cedeno got there. Second on that track and the way it has been playing, he couldn't have been concerned about anyone coming from behind to run him down, therefore leaving the rail open for a miracle is not wrong. Lastly, yesterday's loss and the nonsense he pulled on Laysh, Laysh, Laysh are two different things, IMO. Of course, I wasn't on the horse, so I really can't see what he was hoping to accomplish by running up the asses of two horses. Maybe the earlier ride influenced his ride of yesterday?

As it pertains to his Preakness ride, REALLY? You honestly feel as though what he did in that race was the right thing? Running into garbage throwing down 45 and 3, and his own fractions of 109 and 4 and 134 and 3? Wow, I'm pretty sure I prefer the trips that Curlin and Street Sense got and supposedly to be forced to move early because 25-1 CP West was making a move is lunacy. Hard Spun probably ran a 22 and change quarter in the middle of that race somewhere. Not good for race going a mile and 3/16ths. I admit my opinion is quite slanted when it comes to Hard Spun, but between this ride and the Belmont ride he couldn't have possibly had two worse trips. I do realize Go-Go was aboard for that horror show in Elmont.

Maybe I should create my alterego, NoLuvForPino...

[blackthroatedwind]

I agree with you that the two rides were different situations, as most are, but I thought it was worth pointing out that sometimes doing what you and I both know is the right thing ends up ironically blowing up in one's face.

As for the Preakness, I don't have the energy, but I don't believe he had a realistic choice with CP West ranging up outside of him, and considering natural instincts of a competitive racehorse, wrangling him back could have, and well would have, been both difficult and a mistake. I can hear the criticisms he would have taken for that ringing in my head when it inevitably blew up as well. The bottom line is he finished exactly where he should have that day.....third. He was never going to beat either of those two horses if denied the early lead.

By the way, it is only recently that I have even seen him ride on any kind of regular basis, and my only history with him has been what Andy Beyer has told me about him.....and we all know that isn't complimentary. I'm far from predisposed to be a Pino fan but I just think I have seen some recent unfair criticism of him. Considering what Norberto Arroyo did in yesterday's 8th race, and what Pablo Fragoso did in the 9th, two rides nobody has seen fit to comment on, I feel there is far worse going on at Aqueduct that for whatever reason ( perhaps because it is less obvious ) gets completely ignored.

[NoLuvForPletch]

Originally Posted by blackthroatedwind

I agree with you that the two rides were different situations, as most are, but I thought it was worth pointing out that sometimes doing what you and I both know is the right thing ends up ironically blowing up in one's face.

As for the Preakness, I don't have the energy, but I don't believe he had a realistic choice with CP West ranging up outside of him, and considering natural instincts of a competitive racehorse, wrangling him back could have, and well would have, been both difficult and a mistake. I can hear the criticisms he would have taken for that ringing in my head when it inevitably blew up as well. The bottom line is he finished exactly where he should have that day.....third. He was never going to beat either of those two horses if denied the early lead.

By the way, it is only recently that I have even seen him ride on any kind of regular basis, and my only history with him has been what Andy Beyer has told me about him.....and we all know that isn't complimentary. I'm far from predisposed to be a Pino fan but I just think I have seen some recent unfair criticism of him. Considering what Norberto Arroyo did in yesterday's 8th race, and what Pablo Fragoso did in the 9th, two rides nobody has seen fit to comment on, I feel there is far worse going on at Aqueduct that for whatever reason ( perhaps because it is less obvious ) gets completely ignored.

What, you didn't think Regal Playtime had "rate me into submission" written all over her? What was Arroyo supposed to do, try and save 3rd money? My guess is that many on this board were probably happy about the 3/5 running out as I don't feel we are a group of chalkeaters. Though some Pick 6ers were probably on board, but may have been out well before that. Hence the lack of comments.

Pablo's ride is a tough call. Stacked 3 across in front of him, he made a call to go outside. He could've sat and waited I guess, but I suppose he knew he had horse, as did apparently quite a few people the way she was bet, and went for it.

You are right though, the overall performance of the jockey colony has been pitiful. Hell, at this point I'm looking for Chuckie on some speed and hoping for the best.