Paging Mr. Gore......

[GenuineRisk]

<<Were They Duped?
In response to the the claim that the Anti-Global Warming Petition Project had gathered 19,000 signatures of scientists who allegedly downplay the significance of climate change, the Union of Concerned Scientists wrote this response to suggest that many of the signees might have been duped.

"In the spring of 1998," the Union writes, "mailboxes of US scientists flooded with a packet from the 'Global Warming Petition Project,' including a reprint of a Wall Street Journal op-ed 'Science has spoken: Global Warming Is a Myth,' a copy of a faux scientific article claiming that 'increased levels of atmospheric carbon dioxide have no deleterious effects upon global climate,' a short letter signed by past-president National Academy of Sciences, Frederick Seitz, and a short petition calling for the rejection of the Kyoto Protocol on the grounds that a reduction in carbon dioxide 'would harm the environment, hinder the advance of science and technology, and damage the health and welfare of mankind.'

"The sponsor, the little-known Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine, tried to beguile unsuspecting scientists into believing that this packet had originated from the National Academy of Sciences, both by referencing Seitz's past involvement with the NAS and with an article formatted to look as if it was a published article in the Academy's Proceedings, which it was not. The NAS quickly distanced itself from the petition project, issuing a statement saying, 'the petition does not reflect the conclusions of expert reports of the Academy.'

"The petition project was a deliberate attempt to mislead scientists and to rally them in an attempt to undermine support for the Kyoto Protocol. The petition was not based on a review of the science of global climate change, nor were its signers experts in the field of climate science. In fact, the only criterion for signing the petition was a bachelor's degree in science. The petition resurfaced in early 2001 in an renewed attempt to undermine international climate treaty negotiations.">>

http://www.newwest.net/index.php/cit...0347/C396/L396

[GenuineRisk]

And here's the biggest thing in this whole debate, and why I must respectfully disagree with your accusation that I am the liberal version of Timm ( )- I hope scientists are wrong about global warming. I really do. Because I think, if they're not, it's too late to fix it. And while I don't have any kids, and probably won't live to see the effects of it, the kids of my friends and peers likely will. And I'm not selfish enough to not care about that. But wanting it to be wrong doesn't mean it is wrong. But that doesn't mean it's not worth trying to do something about man-made CO2 emissions. Maybe I'm right, and it's too late to affect 100+ years of burning carbon. But maybe not. And better to try than to not try. Finding alternative energy sources will end a dependence on a finite energy source, and get us out from under the thumb of the Middle East, which would have enormous ramifications for the political situation there. So why not try to limit CO2 emissions? Other than it'll be a hassle and we're lazy?

And of course, you won't live to see the effects either, so if you don't want to believe it's true, then don't. It's not going to affect your life in any noticeable way, and if it affects future generations, hey, we'll all be dead anyway, so who cares, right?

[GenuineRisk]

Originally Posted by Bababooyee

Well, if it is too late, then what is the point of all the environmental BS? We're already fukked! And all the environmental stuff is completely and entirely irrational!

Eat. Drink. Be Merry. For tomorrow we die.

Because some of us think future generations are worth the effort. Even those of us who haven't created any of our own.

I think, in a funny way, it's why I was so affected by the final scene in "Angel," which ended with our heroes on their way into a hopeless battle, because it was still the right thing to do. I can be such a sap.

(Now, there's a test to see how devoted Somer is to the Whedonverse... will he sniff out this carefully hidden reference to one of his favorite shows... tucked away in a global warming thread? tee hee)

[GenuineRisk]

By the way, Danzig; fascinating, invigorating discussion for a Sunday morning- thank you! I could spend all day here, but I have to do laundry, bleah.

(In cold water; saves energy- tip for the day. My detergent is also vegetable-, not petroleum-based, but that's harder to find outside a city.)